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Dec 3, 2023 09:51:14   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States
 
Wyantry wrote:
EXACTLY! I am not you! Conversely, you are not me.

We each “see” things differently. We each determine what is important or what we wish to capture in an image.

It would be a shame if there were only one way to see.


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Dec 3, 2023 09:51:25   #
turp77 Loc: Connecticut, Plainfield
 
Linda From Maine wrote:
Different times, different generation, different interests.

The creative aspects of photography had already changed many times by the time digital came along.


Linda I totally agree with you, not that long ago the same subject came up with the introduction of digital that the “photographer creatively is on the decline because having unlimited shots now they just spray and pray for a good shot”. There will always be the dedicated professional photographer and as the ease of capturing a memory there will be more people taking snapshots

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Dec 3, 2023 10:27:05   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
R.G. wrote:
As you say, photographs aren't real. They're a 2D representation of a 3D reality. Was post processing used with film? Yes. If people like Ansel Adams were around today, would they embrace and use digital post processing? I'm pretty sure the answer is "Yes".

It seems to me that the people who have a problem with post processing must have some sort of glorified idea in their head that photography is some sort of pure art form and any kind of image manipulation is a corruption of that purity. In reality, image manipulation is an integral part of any kind of photography so I don't know how people like that can rationalise their idealised perception of what photography is. The fact that such thinking still exists points to the inflexible and self-justifying mentality that those people must have.
As you say, photographs aren't real. They're a 2D... (show quote)




All creative pursuits involve some sort of manipulation... interpretation... new versions of old ideas...

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Dec 3, 2023 10:55:52   #
mindzye Loc: WV
 
burkphoto wrote:


All creative pursuits involve some sort of manipulation... interpretation... new versions of old ideas...


This brings to mind the same derision the paint artists viewpoint had for photographers, as this was the new and upcoming version of art/ expressionism.

The kind of ridicule that the impressionists of their time received, and were derided for their application of Their interpretation of the paint and canvas medium, Their interpretation/ expression of the world.

Maybe 'we' will develop, in regards to AI and it's visionaries, simply (?) a category of Alternate Reality of Artificial Intelligence Iterations.
orrr, maybe just a throwback to the 60' and those little purple dots?? jess say'n

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Dec 3, 2023 11:04:44   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
burkphoto wrote:


All creative pursuits involve some sort of manipulation...


That includes the desire for realism. And that isn't limited to what the circumstances were at the time of shooting. If the shooter can conceive what it would have been like under better circumstances, he/she can use PP to nudge the images in that direction. For example, if the lighting was less than ideal, PP can be used to render the scene with closer to optimum lighting. That isn't cheating, it's using initiative and imagination.

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Dec 3, 2023 11:27:57   #
mindzye Loc: WV
 
R.G. wrote:
That includes the desire for realism. And that isn't limited to what the circumstances were at the time of shooting. If the shooter can conceive what it would have been like under better circumstances, he/she can use PP to nudge the images in that direction. For example, if the lighting was less than ideal, PP can be used to render the scene with closer to optimum lighting. That isn't cheating, it's using initiative and imagination.


Absolutely agree. We all see individually what we experience, and then tweak it to portray what we have seen or experienced.

And then some of us, those with a bit of warped (playful) imaginations, play with what we have and get -creative - to produce something rendered that has Nothing to do with reality, yet absolutely fun and interesting nevertheless.

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Dec 3, 2023 11:33:11   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
larryepage wrote:
I have commented several times that it seems very difficult to find a photograph with "heart." I'm not even exactly sure what that is, other than being a likely intangible reason to look at a photograph a little bit longer, or to come back and look at it again. Or perhaps to try to decipher its "story."

Over the past few years, I have become very aware of the existence and importance of the Artist's Statement typically associated with a puece of art. This is just a short paragraph, perhaps two paragraphs, which describes things such as the inspiration for a piece of art, or some novel technique used to produce it, or some message the artist hopes the viewer gets, or any of a number of other possible topics.

Kids a tend to be reluctant to write such a statement. (They are often reluctant to commit any thoughts to paper.) A number of folks here have expressed verbal hostility to the idea of writing such a short note. In my mind, this unwillingness to commit to a position on their work is symptomatic of the lack of "heart" that I observe.

While a level of competence is certainly appropriate for any aspiring artist to master, art has never been primarily intended to show off technical prowess. It has been rather to communicate emotions, ideals, beliefs, points of view, and a host of other important and many times intangible values. That's why truly dedicated art teachers will say (forcefully), "Anyone can create art."

I general, I see quite a few nice photographs here. A good number of them are technically quite good. Not too many have heart.

The other side of this discussion is that UHH is probably too judgemental an environment to develop very many new artists.
I have commented several times that it seems very ... (show quote)


I have to agree with Larry here. Often a photo is posted that’s a nice picture, but raises the question, “What’s is all about?” I always appreciate a note or caption that states what inspired the artist to take the photo, paint the picture, etc. and what some of the background. For instance, there are tons of landscapes, but what are the stories there? A description and maybe a short bit of history might be in order to understand the basis for an image being taken, or a short statement as to what moved the photographer to take the photo. But then there are times, too, when the reason for a photo is pretty self evident.

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Dec 3, 2023 11:39:21   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Wingpilot wrote:
I have to agree with Larry here. Often a photo is posted that’s a nice picture, but raises the question, “What’s is all about?” I always appreciate a note or caption that states what inspired the artist to take the photo, paint the picture, etc. and what some of the background. For instance, there are tons of landscapes, but what are the stories there? A description and maybe a short bit of history might be in order to understand the basis for an image being taken, or a short statement as to what moved the photographer to take the photo. But then there are times, too, when the reason for a photo is pretty self evident.
I have to agree with Larry here. Often a photo is... (show quote)


Other times, an artist wants the reader, viewer, or listener to dig deeper and make their own conclusions. Multiple interpretations are often accepted.

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Dec 3, 2023 11:46:16   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
mindzye wrote:
....get -creative - to produce something rendered that has Nothing to do with reality, yet absolutely fun and interesting nevertheless.


You're not suggesting that photography can be fun, are you?

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Dec 3, 2023 11:46:29   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
burkphoto wrote:
Other times, an artist wants the reader, viewer, or listener to dig deeper and make their own conclusions. Multiple interpretations are often accepted.


Very true. Good point. Art, being art, is never fixed, but always fluid in some way. It evokes different reactions from different viewers. But then, isn’t art supposed to do that, to bring out emotions, impressions, create discussion and imagination?

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Dec 3, 2023 11:54:34   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Wingpilot wrote:
Very true. Good point. Art, being art, is never fixed, but always fluid in some way. It evokes different reactions from different viewers. But then, isn’t art supposed to do that, to bring out emotions, impressions, create discussion and imagination?


Yes… we impose our own lives on whatever we encounter. Perception is 9/10 of reality, and none of us has the same perceptions about everything.

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Dec 3, 2023 12:38:22   #
larryepage Loc: North Texas area
 
burkphoto wrote:
Other times, an artist wants the reader, viewer, or listener to dig deeper and make their own conclusions. Multiple interpretations are often accepted.


But that intent must come with the realization and understanding that only a small percentage of viewers will be willing to play along. Think of the audience here...and it's preselected. The vast majority want the photographer to do something to them, not the other way around. How many here are willing to look for something in an image if they don't immediately see it? It is normal to have a level of preconception. If it's not met, do you keep looking or just move on?

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Dec 3, 2023 12:52:31   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States
 
Wingpilot wrote:
I have to agree with Larry here. Often a photo is posted that’s a nice picture, but raises the question, “What’s is all about?” ...

Maybe he just liked what he saw.......
(No "about" to be extrapolated.)

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Dec 3, 2023 13:01:53   #
charles brown Loc: Tennesse
 
srt101fan wrote:
Hmm.... Could be, but....

There has always been a distinction between serious photographers and snap-shooters. For me, by definition, a "serious" photographer will always think "about how the subject is presented" regardless of how easy the camera makes the picture-taking process.

I think most digital photographers consider at least some editing to be part of the overall process. In this context, camera settings and post-adjustments are in a basket of options for getting what you want. Maybe some photographers have shifted more of the adjustments to post. And perhaps that can be viewed as a lessening of creativity at the camera end of the business.

It is interesting that smart-phones, the cameras of the masses, are incorporating more and more creative controls!?
Hmm.... Could be, but.... br br There has always ... (show quote)


it will be the same as with digital cameras. Lots of special/creative features, most of which seldom get used.

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Dec 3, 2023 13:04:51   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
larryepage wrote:
But that intent must come with the realization and understanding that only a small percentage of viewers will be willing to play along. Think of the audience here...and it's preselected. The vast majority want the photographer to do something to them, not the other way around. How many here are willing to look for something in an image if they don't immediately see it? It is normal to have a level of preconception. If it's not met, do you keep looking or just move on?


I remain curious, even if I move on. With a chance to come back to a work, or talk to the author, I'll learn more. Sometimes a piece is so good I'll want to experience it again and again.

Here is a remarkable, bizarre, and thought-provoking piece of musical, film, and poetically staged art from the mind of three kid sisters. The video is DEEPLY layered with meanings and thought-provoking symbolism. The author (drummer in the film) says it is about the 21st Century and some things they would like to change in our world. These kids have been paying closer attention than most adults I know! They ask very pertinent questions.

The music video of the title track from The Warning's 21st Century Blood album won all kinds of awards. The band members were ages 17, 15, and 12 when this was released, and a bit younger when they wrote it! By the way, they are Mexican, bi-lingual, are working on their fourth album, and have been touring the world for much of the past two years (110 concerts in 2022 alone).

https://youtu.be/syTyga3lVL0?si=lNQCd1vYZizLrLrX

Lyrics:

We're the new generation
Lost our salvation
Another problem to be solved
We're the groundbreakers honey
Living for the money
21st century blood

Immortal souls dying
'Empires are falling
We are just waiting to be crushed
Politicians trying, but we know they're lying
Every truth has been sold

Hey yeah, he he he he hey yeah, hey yeah, he he he he hey

We make buildings
When what we need are bridges
We are stuck within these walls
Everyone with blank faces
Trying to fill the blank spaces
That we left a long time ago

Hey, yeah! What will our future hold?
Will we regret our addiction to the rush??!!
Hey, yeah! We've always been crazy so
Let's fly away
And roam through the world that is slowly burning in the flames

Hey yeah, he he he he hey yeah, hey yeah, he he he he hey

Everyone's in depression
Because of an obsession
With stereotypes around the world
Worldwide starvation
But in this situation
No one seems to care at all

Our communication
Replaced by animation
Television has control
Every question answered
Internet demands us
To worship it like a god

Hey, yeah! What will our future hold?
Will we regret our addiction to the rush??!!
Hey Yeah! We've always been crazy so
Let's fly away
And roam through the world that is slowly burning in the flames

Hey, yeah! What will our future hold?
Will we regret our addiction to the rush??!!
Hey, yeah! We've always been crazy so
Let's fly away
And roam through the world that is slowly burning in the flames

Hey yeah, he he he he hey yeah, hey yeah, he he he he hey yeah
​

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