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Oct 22, 2023 21:28:33   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
I've just started working with people portraits and am involved in a fairly large project involving creating an online directory for our church. I have two soft boxes and a camera mounted flash. I plan to use the black backdrop as seen in the following shots. How can I optimize the light on dark hair while maintaining the dark background? Should I move a light a little more behind the subject to create a rim lighting effect? I have many reasons for not wanting to change to a different background.

The first shot is an example of not having to deal with dark hair but may be worth discussing in terms of improving the lighting.

My original trial shots, selfies, didn't address this problem because my hair is light.

Any and all suggestions are appreciated. -Vicki


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Oct 23, 2023 09:12:39   #
MCHUGH Loc: Jacksonville, Texas
 
I always liked a black background in portraits. I used a hair light for separation of the hair from the background. I had a light on the end of a light boom. Set the intensity as needed for the color of hair.

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Oct 23, 2023 09:48:38   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
That sounds good. Thanks for the advice.

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Oct 23, 2023 10:50:59   #
srt101fan
 
vicksart wrote:
I've just started working with people portraits and am involved in a fairly large project involving creating an online directory for our church. I have two soft boxes and a camera mounted flash. I plan to use the black backdrop as seen in the following shots. How can I optimize the light on dark hair while maintaining the dark background? Should I move a light a little more behind the subject to create a rim lighting effect? I have many reasons for not wanting to change to a different background.

The first shot is an example of not having to deal with dark hair but may be worth discussing in terms of improving the lighting.

My original trial shots, selfies, didn't address this problem because my hair is light.

Any and all suggestions are appreciated. -Vicki
I've just started working with people portraits an... (show quote)

Vicki, you might want to post this in the “The Dynamics of Photographic Lighting” section. Ed Shapiro, who runs the section, is a very experienced pro and very helpful to advice seekers. He’s also a nice guy!

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Oct 23, 2023 16:50:50   #
Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC
 
Vicki yes dark tresses can (and oft do) creative some serious challenges in low key portraiture...

For a key light I typically use a BD (Beauty Dish) with diffusion sock to tame specular highlights on the sitter's face/glasses etc.

btw, Makeup is your friend for portraiture... Even a touch of matte powder applied with a puff can do magic here.
Please see if you can enlist a local Makeup Artist to assist here... Check Wedding Wire for the aforementioned but if you are shooting on weekends you may not find an artist free (it's their prime time).

Handling dark hair is typically done with two strip softbox kickers (I use 42" by 12" boxes with cloth grids)
Note: A Grid isn't optional it is mandatory since you'll be aiming them at your camera lens (45 degrees either side). Initially I use a Sekonic L-308S Flashmate incident light meter to balance all three lights. (Actually four since I have one in the ceiling (a 32" Silver brolly box) pointed straight down on the talent (Yes I have 12 foot ceilings in my studio) if you're stuck with 8' ceilings forget the overhead.

FYI: Do not use white shoot through umbrellas anywhere in a Low Key scenario...
You'll lose control of the black seemless (btw I use Black Velvet instead which is VASTLY superior to seemless).

Below are some examples...
Strongly suggest you practice with a hair mannequins (not models) in both blonde and brunette hair mannequins... I always setup the studio knowing the talent's height so there is zero time wasted on set.

btw I could work with you here but you likely can't afford my billing rate... lol
If you actually need lighting assistants query the ASMP web site... It's were I get nearly all my gigs.

Anther very important item is an "Instruction Prep Sheet" for your clients that carefully list what (and what not) to wear on to the session. Wardrobe can make or break the image... trust me here, experience is a brutal teacher.

I could go on and on however just keep at it... You'll figure out what works if you practice long enough.
Cheers! Thomas

Agency Model: Alexandra; Hair Styling: Devon Baltimore; Makeup Artist: Samantha Miller Eyeshadow Palette: French Nude by LANCOME; Creative Direction & Photography: Yours Truly
Agency Model: Alexandra; Hair Styling: Devon Balti...
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Beauty Editorial Model: Arianna (Currently Unsigned); Make-up: Samantha (resident MUA for Reston Studio) Hair Styling: Devon Baltimore (formerally with VOGUE NYC); Creative Direction & Photography: Yours Truly
Beauty Editorial Model: Arianna (Currently Unsigne...

Corporate Headshot (featuring my son Eric) A client with an attitude "Hurry up Dad, I'm late for a meeting" lol
Corporate Headshot (featuring my son Eric) A clien...
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Oct 23, 2023 16:57:00   #
joecichjr Loc: Chicago S. Suburbs, Illinois, USA
 
Thomas902 wrote:
Vicki yes dark tresses can (and oft do) creative some serious challenges in low key portraiture...

For a key light I typically use a BD (Beauty Dish) with diffusion sock to tame specular highlights on the sitter's face/glasses etc.

btw, Makeup is your friend for portraiture... Even a touch of matte powder applied with a puff can do magic here.
Please see if you can enlist a local Makeup Artist to assist here... Check Wedding Wire for the aforementioned but if you are shooting on weekends you may not find an artist free (it's their prime time).

Handling dark hair is typically done with two strip softbox kickers (I use 42" by 12" boxes with cloth grids)
Note: A Grid isn't optional it is mandatory since you'll be aiming them at your camera lens (45 degrees either side). Initially I use a Sekonic L-308S Flashmate incident light meter to balance all three lights. (Actually four since I have one in the ceiling (a 32" Silver brolly box) pointed straight down on the talent (Yes I have 12 foot ceilings in my studio) if you're stuck with 8' ceilings forget the overhead.

FYI: Do not use white shoot through umbrellas anywhere in a Low Key scenario...
You'll lose control of the black seemless (btw I use Black Velvet instead which is VASTLY superior to seemless).

Below are some examples...
Strongly suggest you practice with a hair mannequins (not models) in both blonde and brunette hair mannequins... I always setup the studio knowing the talent's height so there is zero time wasted on set.

btw I could work with you here but you likely can't afford my billing rate... lol
If you actually need lighting assistants query the ASMP web site... It's were I get nearly all my gigs.

Anther very important item is an "Instruction Prep Sheet" for your clients that carefully list what (and what not) to wear on to the session. Wardrobe can make or break the image... trust me here, experience is a brutal teacher.

I could go on and on however just keep at it... You'll figure out what works if you practice long enough.
Cheers! Thomas
Vicki yes dark tresses can (and oft do) creative s... (show quote)


Beautiful shots 🌞🌞🌞🌞🌞 I should be okay if you need a model - no hair at all

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Oct 23, 2023 19:43:35   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
Thanks so much for the detailed reply and superb examples, Thomas. You are indeed a wealth of helpful information. I may have to be a little creative with your ideas since this is a very low budget effort. I will be putting in many hours with no return on investment except what I learn. Often that's the best reward. That said, I think purchasing strip lights will be a worthwhile investment.

Thanks again for the input. Just tell me where I should mail your airline tickets and the tuition funds for your course. Oh, right, this is low budget. Doesn't hurt to dream.

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Oct 23, 2023 19:44:39   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
joecichjr wrote:
Beautiful shots 🌞🌞🌞🌞🌞 I should be okay if you need a model - no hair at all


Thank you for the kind comment, Joe. You're hired.

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Oct 30, 2023 06:42:51   #
dpullum Loc: Tampa Florida
 
We all, as non professionals, have a lot to learn from the great advice you have been given. I would only add light weight portable suggestions...

Never under estimate the worth of simple low cost home floor lamps [eg. $24 "Industrial Floor Lamps for Living Rooms"] from Walmart have directional goose necks and are effective using high output hi K white or warmer bulbs.... example $9 "High Output 1850-Lumen Outdoor Light Bulbs 15-Watt Super Bright E26 LED Bulb, 6000K White Corn Bulb" When the bulb shield is lined with aluminum foil the light is high directive.

While I appreciate "professional" equipment... it is typically bulky, and expensive. Lamps like the goose neck above... and also the use of trigger flashes. These flashes attached hide behind the subject for back lighting or are also effective for side lighting.

Dedicated studio lighting setups are not portable... often we need to pack-up and move to a site. Google "portable studio kits" and there are many to fit budgets and space.

Ring lights are very portable... "Vivitar 18-Inch LED Ring Light, Adjustable 63-Inch Tripod Stand, $30. Many How-2 articles on portrait photography using ring lights.

Back drop... I like light gray felt fabric white is harsh. Back drop and frames are not expensive... be sure to get the ones with bags for ease of portability.

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Oct 30, 2023 08:14:36   #
MCHUGH Loc: Jacksonville, Texas
 
dpullum wrote:
We all, as non professionals, have a lot to learn from the great advice you have been given. I would only add light weight portable suggestions...

Never under estimate the worth of simple low cost home floor lamps [eg. $24 "Industrial Floor Lamps for Living Rooms"] from Walmart have directional goose necks and are effective using high output hi K white or warmer bulbs.... example $9 "High Output 1850-Lumen Outdoor Light Bulbs 15-Watt Super Bright E26 LED Bulb, 6000K White Corn Bulb" When the bulb shield is lined with aluminum foil the light is high directive.

While I appreciate "professional" equipment... it is typically bulky, and expensive. Lamps like the goose neck above... and also the use of trigger flashes. These flashes attached hide behind the subject for back lighting or are also effective for side lighting.

Dedicated studio lighting setups are not portable... often we need to pack-up and move to a site. Google "portable studio kits" and there are many to fit budgets and space.

Ring lights are very portable... "Vivitar 18-Inch LED Ring Light, Adjustable 63-Inch Tripod Stand, $30. Many How-2 articles on portrait photography using ring lights.

Back drop... I like light gray felt fabric white is harsh. Back drop and frames are not expensive... be sure to get the ones with bags for ease of portability.
We all, as non professionals, have a lot to learn ... (show quote)


Back in the late 60's I started out using photo floods. They were professional portable lights but worked fine. Heat was sometimes a problem. I never had a problem and I don't think Vickstar will either. Glad you made the suggestion to give her a very possible and economical way to take her portraits.

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Oct 30, 2023 11:00:37   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
dpullum wrote:
We all, as non professionals, have a lot to learn from the great advice you have been given. I would only add light weight portable suggestions...

Never under estimate the worth of simple low cost home floor lamps [eg. $24 "Industrial Floor Lamps for Living Rooms"] from Walmart have directional goose necks and are effective using high output hi K white or warmer bulbs.... example $9 "High Output 1850-Lumen Outdoor Light Bulbs 15-Watt Super Bright E26 LED Bulb, 6000K White Corn Bulb" When the bulb shield is lined with aluminum foil the light is high directive.

While I appreciate "professional" equipment... it is typically bulky, and expensive. Lamps like the goose neck above... and also the use of trigger flashes. These flashes attached hide behind the subject for back lighting or are also effective for side lighting.

Dedicated studio lighting setups are not portable... often we need to pack-up and move to a site. Google "portable studio kits" and there are many to fit budgets and space.

Ring lights are very portable... "Vivitar 18-Inch LED Ring Light, Adjustable 63-Inch Tripod Stand, $30. Many How-2 articles on portrait photography using ring lights.

Back drop... I like light gray felt fabric white is harsh. Back drop and frames are not expensive... be sure to get the ones with bags for ease of portability.
We all, as non professionals, have a lot to learn ... (show quote)



Thanks for the very helpful suggestions, dpullum. I've invested in some fairly portable soft boxes and already had a "goose neck" craft light at the ready. All are now working well, and people are happy with the results. I had a medium gray backdrop as well as the black one I decided to use, both with carrying bags. The lighting is easy to tweak as needed, too. In addition, the room I've been using for this effort has very good overhead lighting which seems to work well in concert with my setup. People look at it and think I'm a pro.

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Oct 30, 2023 12:41:38   #
Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC
 
"...People look at it and think I'm a pro..." Vicki at the end of the day that is all that really matters...
.
As for the need of "Portable" lighting equipment? I've had to deal with this repeatedly when shooting Fashion Editorials for local Fashion Designers who insist that their Catalog Images look like they came off the pages of VOGUE.

To this end I deployed a single Alien Bee 800 with an easily collapsible 36x42 inch softbox on a portable lighting stand. You can pick up used Alien Bee 800's for ~ $125 to $150 on eBay... Also used a robust lighting stand I scored used for half that.

How portable? I have my Model and Hair Stylist carry them... lol
How to trigger the Alien Bee? I initially used a 15-foot sync cord; 1/8-inch (3.5mm) mini to PC-connection; which actually ships with Alien Bees (B400, B800 and B1600) units *New for ~ $8 That is what I used in the images below (Taken over 14 years ago).

Vicki my fav quote is by the late Dean Collins "Beauty is in the eyes of the checkbook holder"
Also as many here realize please be rather skeptical of advice that comes from those from those lacking imagery to collaborate their inferences...

Again hope this helps Vicki

Notice the Price it SOLD as... This is the best way to gauge market values... Also the seller has 100% Positive Feedback (Critically Important!)
Notice the Price it SOLD as... This is the best wa...
(Download)

I used a 15 foot Sync Cord frequently... Bullet Proof! Works well... Cost effective...
I used a 15 foot Sync Cord frequently... Bullet Pr...
(Download)

Illumination: Ambient Window Backlighting... Key Light Alien Bee 800 trigger with 15 foot Sync Cord
Illumination: Ambient Window Backlighting... Key L...
(Download)

Illumination: Ambient Window Backlighting... Key Light Alien Bee 800 trigger with 15 foot Sync Cord
Illumination: Ambient Window Backlighting... Key L...
(Download)

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Nov 10, 2023 10:49:51   #
jaysnave Loc: Central Ohio
 
Hi Vicki,

I have been absent from UHH for quite some time as I have kind of leveled off the learning process and stopped buying equipment and only do work for family, friends, and charity. Anyway, one of those charities called and asked if I could do some staff pictures. Not sure if I would get it figured out (been 2 yrs), but I threw a bunch of that equipment in the car and gave it a whirl. Looking at your post here has been quite enjoyable reading recommendations from the masters of photographic lighting.

So, I will share my experience to give you another option and I would like to invite comments from others to see what they think. I used a large soft box on an AD600 and positioned it camera left about 7 ft. up (I go by feel) and positioned a reflector at floor level to illuminate the neck and right side of face. I had another soft box and AD200 camera right, but never turned it on as I liked the results without it. I used a pop up white background as they like a white background (sometimes blue).

Now, to your black background and black hair problem I thought what would happen if I went into LR, masked the background and turn it black? Well, it worked at least from my less than master perspective. The hair is still illuminated and in the last picture I masked the hair and brought up the highlights a bit. So, the images are out of camera, edited for white background, background turned black, and hair enhanced a bit.


(Download)


(Download)


(Download)


(Download)

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Nov 10, 2023 11:51:33   #
vicksart Loc: Novato, CA -earthquake country
 
jaysnave wrote:
Hi Vicki,

I have been absent from UHH for quite some time as I have kind of leveled off the learning process and stopped buying equipment and only do work for family, friends, and charity. Anyway, one of those charities called and asked if I could do some staff pictures. Not sure if I would get it figured out (been 2 yrs), but I threw a bunch of that equipment in the car and gave it a whirl. Looking at your post here has been quite enjoyable reading recommendations from the masters of photographic lighting.

So, I will share my experience to give you another option and I would like to invite comments from others to see what they think. I used a large soft box on an AD600 and positioned it camera left about 7 ft. up (I go by feel) and positioned a reflector at floor level to illuminate the neck and right side of face. I had another soft box and AD200 camera right, but never turned it on as I liked the results without it. I used a pop up white background as they like a white background (sometimes blue).

Now, to your black background and black hair problem I thought what would happen if I went into LR, masked the background and turn it black? Well, it worked at least from my less than master perspective. The hair is still illuminated and in the last picture I masked the hair and brought up the highlights a bit. So, the images are out of camera, edited for white background, background turned black, and hair enhanced a bit.
Hi Vicki, br br I have been absent from UHH for q... (show quote)


Thanks so much for the tips, Jay. This has been a rather steep learning curve for me especially as it pertains to editing. I’m shooting an older group (most are 70+) who don’t like their wrinkles, or shall we say “character lines?” I try to minimize lines with light while wondering what would be an acceptable amount of touch up. Frequency separation seems to help, but it would be very easy to overdo.

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Nov 10, 2023 14:46:37   #
jaysnave Loc: Central Ohio
 
vicksart wrote:
Thanks so much for the tips, Jay. This has been a rather steep learning curve for me especially as it pertains to editing. I’m shooting an older group (most are 70+) who don’t like their wrinkles, or shall we say “character lines?” I try to minimize lines with light while wondering what would be an acceptable amount of touch up. Frequency separation seems to help, but it would be very easy to overdo.


Yes, I know exactly what you are working with. Our church is 70+ as well. Those young people and their perfect skin tones are wonderful when it comes to editing right? Yes, it helps to wash away some of the wrinkles with soft light then what I do is a touch of skin softening (just enough that they don't know you did it) and my favorite trick to minimize harsh wrinkles is the patch tool in Photoshop. You select the patch tool from the PS menu. It is there with healing tool, remove tool, and all that. Then circle the wrinkle. You will see blinking dotted lines that you then move to a patch of clear skin. It removes the wrinkle which is too much and not believable. The next step is to go up to edit fade patch selection and move the slider back until it is believable. Like I say, it is my favorite and learned it from a guy doing a workshop years ago. However, sometimes it is what it is. :)

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