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Are Sony NP-BX1 Replacement Batteries for the Sony RX100 Cameras Okay to Use?
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May 21, 2023 16:51:56   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
Doc Barry wrote:
A number of firms offer a replacement battery for the Sony NP-BX1 battery which is used in the Sony RX100 series cameras. I have the Sony RX100 VII and am very happy with it. Owners of this camera know that the camera “drains” the battery rather quickly. The capacity of the Sony brand battery is 1240 mAh. The capacity of replacement batteries varies from 1100 mAh to 1800 mAh. To the first order, one might expect 1800 mAh batteries to operate almost 50% longer than the Sony battery. In casual operations, this didn’t seem to be the case, i.e., they all seem to give me about the same run time.

So I decided to perform a test of the various batteries I have to learn the “truth”. The test process was to set the RX100 VII to have its display ON for 30-minute intervals and count the number of intervals required to discharge each battery. I note that each tested battery was first discharged in the camera and then fully charged using the same charger for all the batteries. The time between intervals was no more than 10 seconds. A photograph of the batteries tested is shown below.

Battery Capacity Time to discharge
1100 mAh 194 minutes
1240 mAh 216 minutes
1600 mAh 210 minutes
1700 mAh 215 minutes

The test results tend to confirm my earlier observation, but this test was at a modestly low current draw. When shooting, running the EVF, and operating the zoom lens, much more current is drawn albeit for short times. A further observation I made when performing the tests was that the battery capacity indicator on the camera (4 bars) behaved differently. For example, the Sony battery held four bars the longest, then three bars, and rapidly went through two and one bars before exhaustion was indicated. I suggest that this indicates the internal resistance of the Sony battery is the lesser of the batteries tested.

The Sony battery is about $35 or so and some replacement batteries are much less expensive. For example, the Green Extreme is about $15. Although not tested, a pack of three DOT-01 Brand 1800 mAh is only $15 ($5 each). The 1600 mAh battery tested was the FirstPower and a pack of 3 batteries and a triple cell charger was a total of $20 on Amazon.

Bottom Line: Don’t waste your money buying the Sony or other expensive replacements. The much less expensive batteries appear to work adequately. For the price of a pair of Sony batteries, you can have a pocket full of low-cost replacement batteries that will let you operate for a long time!
A number of firms offer a replacement battery for ... (show quote)


I got manufacturer's brand for my latest camera as there now seems to be some communication.
Also 2 extra batteries, way plenty, are such a small fraction of the cost of the camera it was a no brainer if you take the difference in price as the savings vs cost of the camera. Other brands work fine I guess but my original manufacturer's batteries, dating back well over 15 years, are still functioning well while off brands lose charge after a relatively few shots.

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May 21, 2023 17:45:43   #
Doc Barry Loc: Huntsville, Alabama USA
 
Architect1776 wrote:
I got manufacturer's brand for my latest camera as there now seems to be some communication.
Also 2 extra batteries, way plenty, are such a small fraction of the cost of the camera it was a no brainer if you take the difference in price as the savings vs cost of the camera. Other brands work fine I guess but my original manufacturer's batteries, dating back well over 15 years, are still functioning well while off brands lose charge after a relatively few shots.


As I mentioned, there appears to be a difference in the internal resistance of the various brands of the NP-BX1 type batteries I evaluated. The Sony seems to be the better although all of the other three provide "good enough" performance. You might be amused that the Lithium based battery was patented in Britain in 1976 by Whittingham. However, the first viable Li-ion was developed by Dr. Goodenough while the Chemistry Chair at Oxford during the late 1970s and early 1980s. He solved the issues with Whittingham's approach. And yes, his name was really Goodenough!

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May 21, 2023 18:05:36   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
Doc Barry wrote:
As I mentioned, there appears to be a difference in the internal resistance of the various brands of the NP-BX1 type batteries I evaluated. The Sony seems to be the better although all of the other three provide "good enough" performance. You might be amused that the Lithium based battery was patented in Britain in 1976 by Whittingham. However, the first viable Li-ion was developed by Dr. Goodenough while the Chemistry Chair at Oxford during the late 1970s and early 1980s. He solved the issues with Whittingham's approach. And yes, his name was really Goodenough!
As I mentioned, there appears to be a difference i... (show quote)


Lol on the name.

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May 22, 2023 02:39:56   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
Doc Barry wrote:
As I mentioned, there appears to be a difference in the internal resistance of the various brands of the NP-BX1 type batteries I evaluated. The Sony seems to be the better although all of the other three provide "good enough" performance. You might be amused that the Lithium based battery was patented in Britain in 1976 by Whittingham. However, the first viable Li-ion was developed by Dr. Goodenough while the Chemistry Chair at Oxford during the late 1970s and early 1980s. He solved the issues with Whittingham's approach. And yes, his name was really Goodenough!
As I mentioned, there appears to be a difference i... (show quote)


That’s an interesting bit of historical information, Barry. I guess Dr. Goodenough’s batteries were good enough, as they’ve been around for awhile now.

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May 22, 2023 09:34:15   #
bobbydvideo
 
Yes. I have been using them for years without a problem. They last as long as the originals. I use them in my new Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX100.

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May 22, 2023 11:29:45   #
bnsf
 
In my camera bag I have 2 Sony, 2 Watson and 2 Kastar Batteries. On thing I have notices was that the Sony batteries just sitting in the case drain faster than the Kastar and Watson batteries. The Watson batteries have a longer shelf or case life than the Sony or Kaster batteries do, plus they have a larger Millie Amp rating than the Sony and Kaster batteries which means they will last longer in the camera of longer on the shelf or storage life.

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May 22, 2023 13:49:27   #
robertjerl Loc: Corona, California
 
jcboy3 wrote:
Did you do a life time test on these? Because a battery that only lasts half as long is only worth half as much.


A few years back one of the tech magazines did an article on batteries, esp those for advanced electronics like cameras.
At the time there were only about 6 companies/factories that produced over 90% of the battery cores on the world market and all those other brands bought cores from them and assembled batteries with various brand names. Often one factory turned out multiple brand names but had only one battery design. This was especially true for the numerous "house brands". All assembled in one factory, with cores from one company but different names on them. After reading that was when I started to use "Wasabi Power" batteries. It is a Southern California company and the batteries were totted as using "all Japanese made cores". The review stated that while their design only lasted about 3/4 as long as OEM(Canon in my case) they only cost about 1/4 to 1/3 as much depending on where you bought them. The article concluded that at that price difference a given amount of money in Wasabi batteries lasted about 50% longer than OEM batteries costing the same amount. You just changed batteries more often. They suggested battery grips on your camera. So I started getting grips that would fit all my bodies. Besides the grip vastly improves the holdability of the camera as long as you didn't mind the size and weight. Well I am now 77 and just starting to think about smaller and lighter - not because I can't carry and use them but because I can't get as much gear in the camera bag and a camera with grip swinging on a neck strap is starting to bug me.
My newest bodies; an RP full frame and R7 crop sensor don't have an available battery grip anyway.

So only buy the third party batteries that have the best customer rating and reviews. In my case that is now Wasabi and Kastar - I have cordless phones on the home line that have Kastar replacement batteries going on 10 years old in them. I bought two full sets back them and the second set is still in the drawer unused. Oh well the double set (one wired base station and 4 unwired phones on the home line) cost 1/2 the phone brand OEM battery price for 4 batteries. So even if the ones in the phones and the spare set die of old age I still saved money.

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May 22, 2023 13:59:46   #
robertjerl Loc: Corona, California
 
Wingpilot wrote:
That’s an interesting bit of historical information, Barry. I guess Dr. Goodenough’s batteries were good enough, as they’ve been around for awhile now.


I used to have a little wall sign in my class room.
"The enemy of good is not bad. It is perfect."
Good enough is well, good enough!
After decades I still have a problem getting my wife to understand that. Her family associated quality with price and believed that if you could afford it you only got the absolute best. Even something you were buying for a one off project.
Over the years I have bought a lot of "good enough" tools for projects because it was a one time thing with me and I didn't need a tool that would last decades of regular use. And a lot of those supposedly "cheap" tools are in my garage after decades and still perfectly good since they seldom get used and I am careful (read as cheap skate) when I use them.

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May 22, 2023 14:36:35   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
robertjerl wrote:
I used to have a little wall sign in my class room.
"The enemy of good is not bad. It is perfect."
Good enough is well, good enough!
After decades I still have a problem getting my wife to understand that. Her family associated quality with price and believed that if you could afford it you only got the absolute best. Even something you were buying for a one off project.
Over the years I have bought a lot of "good enough" tools for projects because it was a one time thing with me and I didn't need a tool that would last decades of regular use. And a lot of those supposedly "cheap" tools are in my garage after decades and still perfectly good since they seldom get used and I am careful (read as cheap skate) when I use them.
I used to have a little wall sign in my class room... (show quote)


Roger that. I have some tools I bought from Harbor Freight a number of years ago and they are still working, despite their cheapness. And you’re right, more expensive doesn’t necessarily equate to better.

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May 22, 2023 18:30:32   #
robertjerl Loc: Corona, California
 
Wingpilot wrote:
Roger that. I have some tools I bought from Harbor Freight a number of years ago and they are still working, despite their cheapness. And you’re right, more expensive doesn’t necessarily equate to better.


My mother worked at one of the largest Sears in the states in Los Angeles - it was also a catalog and service center.

She had a good friend who managed the discount/return sales in the basement and another who was assistant manager of the tools department.
You could go and look at two sets of the same tools, one the Sears "Craftsman" brand and the other the name brand. Big price difference even though the Craftsman stuff was made on contract by the other brand and the only differences were the name on the tool, sometimes the color of the rubber on the grips and the package. And the Sears lifetime warrenty.
Our family bought the Craftsman, often from the discount department=damaged package, returns etc. Some times the "returns" had marks that showed they had been used for at least one job. Sears took them back anyway and then resold them at a huge mark down.

And you know they weren't losing money. The mark up from wholesale to retail was enormous.

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May 22, 2023 19:38:07   #
Doc Barry Loc: Huntsville, Alabama USA
 
bobbydvideo wrote:
Yes. I have been using them for years without a problem. They last as long as the originals. I use them in my new Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX100.


Good observation Bobby.

Reply
 
 
May 23, 2023 01:25:39   #
Doc Barry Loc: Huntsville, Alabama USA
 
robertjerl wrote:
A few years back one of the tech magazines did an article on batteries, esp those for advanced electronics like cameras.
At the time there were only about 6 companies/factories that produced over 90% of the battery cores on the world market and all those other brands bought cores from them and assembled batteries with various brand names. Often one factory turned out multiple brand names but had only one battery design. This was especially true for the numerous "house brands". All assembled in one factory, with cores from one company but different names on them. After reading that was when I started to use "Wasabi Power" batteries. It is a Southern California company and the batteries were totted as using "all Japanese made cores". The review stated that while their design only lasted about 3/4 as long as OEM(Canon in my case) they only cost about 1/4 to 1/3 as much depending on where you bought them. The article concluded that at that price difference a given amount of money in Wasabi batteries lasted about 50% longer than OEM batteries costing the same amount. You just changed batteries more often. They suggested battery grips on your camera. So I started getting grips that would fit all my bodies. Besides the grip vastly improves the holdability of the camera as long as you didn't mind the size and weight. Well I am now 77 and just starting to think about smaller and lighter - not because I can't carry and use them but because I can't get as much gear in the camera bag and a camera with grip swinging on a neck strap is starting to bug me.
My newest bodies; an RP full frame and R7 crop sensor don't have an available battery grip anyway.

So only buy the third party batteries that have the best customer rating and reviews. In my case that is now Wasabi and Kastar - I have cordless phones on the home line that have Kastar replacement batteries going on 10 years old in them. I bought two full sets back them and the second set is still in the drawer unused. Oh well the double set (one wired base station and 4 unwired phones on the home line) cost 1/2 the phone brand OEM battery price for 4 batteries. So even if the ones in the phones and the spare set die of old age I still saved money.
A few years back one of the tech magazines did an ... (show quote)



Hi Bobby, bnsf, and Robert,

A point I was trying to make is that one should beware of the capacity written on the battery. My little test showed that the run duration was essentially the same even though the stated capacity varied from 1100 to 1700 mAh. I have also commented that the Sony battery seemed to "hold its bars" longer than the other batteries.

I think you might enjoy reading this article from a few years ago "NP-BX1 Lithium-ion Batteries: Sony vs. Wasabi" (see url https://softsolder.com/2014/02/11/np-bx1-lithium-ion-batteries-sony-vs-wasabi/). The bottom line he presented was "The Sony battery says it’ll deliver 4.5 W·h and actually produces 4.8 W·h. The Wasabi batteries claim 5.7 W·h and don’t even come close at 4.25 W·h.". Towards the end of the article, he summarizes the testing of a couple of other batteries and if you click on the images, it will take you to more information.

Perhaps you already know this tidbit of information, but you can tell, with reasonable confidence, if the Sony NP-BX1 is real or counterfeit. First, check to see if the label looks like a known real battery. Second, look on the back side label and see if it has on the bottom line the date of manufacture having the format yyyymmdd. And lastly, look at the end of the battery not having the electrical contacts. Turn the cell so that the arrow is on the right-hand side. In the middle, there is a hologram that contains the manufacturing data and a serial number. Also, if you tilt it around, you will see SONY. This is a quality security device Sony uses.

And finally, I suggest that you check the voltage of your fully charged batteries and verify that it is close to 4.15 V. If not, get rid of it. When a battery is exhausted by the camera, measure the voltage and if it is less than 2.5 V get rid of it. Also, don't leave an exhausted battery in that state for very long (a few days) because it can/will self-discharge and ruin the battery. For all of my battery-powered devices, I discharge the batteries at least every few months (3-4) and then recharge them. There are other guidelines for obtaining the longest lifetime and performance of this type battery.

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