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Fujifilm XT-3: JPEG or RAW?
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Aug 29, 2022 21:34:56   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Ysarex wrote:
You processed the raw file in Adobe LR. In terms of fine detail rendition LR is as bad or worse than the software in the camera. If you want maximum fine detail from your Fuji RAF files you're not going to get it from either the camera or LR. Your X-T3 has a Fuji XTrans sensor that uses a non-Bayer CFA. It's a tricky demosaicing job.

I'll come back in a few minutes and get you some empirical evidence.


Absolutely. I was really disappointed with my Fuji raw conversions in LR (ACR). Switched to Capture One, and the difference was impressive (in a very good way). They have really figured out XTrans demosaicing.

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Aug 29, 2022 23:45:56   #
Ysarex Loc: St. Louis
 
TriX wrote:
Absolutely. I was really disappointed with my Fuji raw conversions in LR (ACR). Switched to Capture One, and the difference was impressive (in a very good way). They have really figured out XTrans demosaicing.


Yep, C1 has been my primary processor for a decade now.

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Aug 30, 2022 08:15:58   #
leftj Loc: Texas
 
sergiohm wrote:
Empirical evidence only, the RAW pictures in Fujifilm XT-3 have a little bit more contrast and much more saturation; it looks better - most of the time - than the JPEG (of course without any processing).
But it took me by surprise how much more detailed the JPEGs are, look at the same photo below, JPEG and RAW. The wings have a lot more detail (both pictures were cropped at the same ratio). Film Simulation set to Eterna.
Any thoughts?


You have not processed the RAW to it's full potential. In other words the camera did a better job of processing on the jpeg than you did on the RAW.

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Aug 30, 2022 12:05:25   #
tenny52 Loc: San Francisco
 
Retired CPO wrote:
A man after my own heart!!!


I am sure you will get less keepers than you could.

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Aug 30, 2022 13:08:11   #
PHRubin Loc: Nashville TN USA
 
ecobin wrote:
An in camera JPEG is converted from the RAW file using the camera manufacturer's algorithm and any in camera setting that the shooter has made. If you shoot only JPEG (not RAW+JPEG) then the RAW file is not saved on your memory card (but it was produced to get the JPEG). So based on the manufacturer's algorithm, an in camera JPEG typically includes some sharpening, noise reduction, etc.
Your processing of the RAW file can achieve the same results if you knew the algorithm but you should be able to achieve much better results after learning how to do postprocessing.
An in camera JPEG is converted from the RAW file u... (show quote)



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Aug 30, 2022 13:29:56   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
selmslie wrote:
It doesn't get talked about because all Bayer arrays are the same and everyone has had a lot of time to perfect their demosaicing algorithms.

The fundamental Bayer process combines two green, one red and one blue pixel to form each RGB pixel.

Each raw pixel (except for the ones along the edges and in the corners of the sensor) gets used four times so there is almost no loss of megapixels.


In this tiny sensor, 16 raw pixels can create 9 RGB pixels. But in a much larger sensor the proportion of lost RGB pixels along the edges and in the corners is insignificant.

The X-Trans array is more complicated and the repetitions are less obvious.



As in the Bayer array, each intersection of raw pixels includes two green, one red and one blue pixel except for the one in the center which has only green pixels. In order to create an RGB pixel it needs information from the 8 adjacent blue and red pixels.

There is no inherent penalty in sharpness with an X-Trans array, only a potential difference in color rendition that's probably impossible to see in a real image. If there is any difference between different processors it's probably because the software builders have not spent enough time to perfect their product.

Regardless, medium format Fuji sensors will not use an X-Trans array.



X-Trans seems to have been a nice try for APS-C sensors - close but no cigar.
It doesn't get talked about because all Bayer arra... (show quote)


Wayyy to close! I could never comprehend the difference in raw and jpeg. Sorry. I just had a old friend come and stay with us for 4 days and he is retired military airborne ranger college educated. I says but these are jpegs, with some noise. He looked at me and said my boy I see nothing but a beautiful pic. I beginning to think some of guys are losing it all this technology doesn’t and it doesn’t make a difference to 90 percent of the people. Oh well carry on gals and gents

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Aug 30, 2022 13:32:14   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
davyboy wrote:
Wayyy to close! I could never comprehend the difference in raw and jpeg. Sorry. I just had a old friend come and stay with us for 4 days and he is retired military airborne ranger college educated. I says but these are jpegs, with some noise. He looked at me and said my boy I see nothing but a beautiful pic. I beginning to think some of guys are losing it all this technology doesn’t and it doesn’t make a difference to 90 percent of the people. Oh well carry on gals and gents

Oh ya my friend put his arm around me and said you should enter some of those photos in a contest! Can you believe it. Probably more luck on my part

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Aug 30, 2022 14:38:48   #
SalvageDiver Loc: Huntington Beach CA
 
sergiohm wrote:
Empirical evidence only, the RAW pictures in Fujifilm XT-3 have a little bit more contrast and much more saturation; it looks better - most of the time - than the JPEG (of course without any processing).
But it took me by surprise how much more detailed the JPEGs are, look at the same photo below, JPEG and RAW. The wings have a lot more detail (both pictures were cropped at the same ratio). Film Simulation set to Eterna.
Any thoughts?


If you want to use the image straight out of camera (i.e. no post processing), use the jpeg.

However, if you want something better than the jpeg, use raw and post-process.

There isn't more detail in the jpeg because the jpeg was derived directly from the raw. The only difference is the camera has done your raw post-proccessing for you.

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Aug 30, 2022 20:55:46   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
SalvageDiver wrote:
If you want to use the image straight out of camera (i.e. no post processing), use the jpeg.

However, if you want something better than the jpeg, use raw and post-process.

There isn't more detail in the jpeg because the jpeg was derived directly from the raw. The only difference is the camera has done your raw post-proccessing for you.

I love the camera to do the heavy hitting that’s what I paid the big bucks for

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Aug 30, 2022 20:57:09   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
SalvageDiver wrote:
If you want to use the image straight out of camera (i.e. no post processing), use the jpeg.

However, if you want something better than the jpeg, use raw and post-process.

There isn't more detail in the jpeg because the jpeg was derived directly from the raw. The only difference is the camera has done your raw post-proccessing for you.


Is there really something better then the jpeg?

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Aug 30, 2022 21:44:32   #
Ysarex Loc: St. Louis
 
davyboy wrote:
Is there really something better then the jpeg?

For you no.
To get results (from raw files) superior to the camera JPEG both skill and understanding are required.

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Aug 30, 2022 22:08:54   #
delder Loc: Maryland
 
econin has a great answer!
RAW simply allows you to have the total image capture of your camera available for Post-processing. As stated, the Jpeg is the output of the internal processing of your camera and your custom settings.

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Aug 30, 2022 22:11:02   #
SalvageDiver Loc: Huntington Beach CA
 
Ysarex wrote:
For you no.
To get results (from raw files) superior to the camera JPEG both skill and understanding are required.



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Aug 30, 2022 22:12:01   #
SalvageDiver Loc: Huntington Beach CA
 
davyboy wrote:
I love the camera to do the heavy hitting that’s what I paid the big bucks for


Then jpeg is the best option for you.

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Aug 30, 2022 22:28:52   #
Sentinel4
 
Great post. Glad to hear that prints as large as 30x40 are fine. The Fuji jpegs using various recipes work for me.

If you need to bump the resolution up to 200% to see the difference between Fuji and Lecia that is all I need to know.

I want to create art and not get hung up on resolution at 200%.

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