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Shooting RAW & JPEG
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Jul 7, 2022 17:49:50   #
MrBob Loc: lookout Mtn. NE Alabama
 
sgomboz wrote:
I never said I personally was amazing.. all I was saying is I will not be editing every photo that is taken. That’s a waste of time. Learn the art, learn your camera, learn photography. The time you save on constantly editing…. You could be out photographing.


Without trying to add fuel to the fire have you ever considered that there is a whole lot more to photography than just taking the click... There are a lot of folks out there who get just as much pleasure behind the monitor as they do in the field... I for one, even as a humble enthusiast, get as much and possibly MORE enjoyment doing post and rendering things in possibly a way that my eye did not see and could not envision at that moment. Some folks like to do custom matting and framing; is this not a big part of photography ? Presentation of your captured images and renderings is IMHO just as important as the initial click. Getting it "Right" has different meanings for different folks... If you are trying to recreate what the eye has seen, which is a futile exercise in itself, then "getting it right" has some meaning but as each of us interprets our senses in different ways there is no hard fast "Getting it Right" rule. When you get that little smile across your face then it is right for you. Bob

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Jul 7, 2022 17:58:45   #
Retina Loc: Near Charleston,SC
 
rmalarz wrote:
You are partially correct. To quote Ansel Adams,

“You don't take a photograph, you make it.”


“You don't make a photograph just with a camera. You bring to the act of photography all the pictures you have seen, the books you have read, the music you have heard, the people you have loved.”

One can very easily compare a negative to a RAW file. One can print non-destructively from a negative. Each time one can manipulate the print exposure in various ways. This is much the same as a RAW file in which one can manipulate the final appearance through various adjustments in whatever processing software one uses.

Similarly, once the shutter is operated, the resulting exposure, whether film or digital, is made. Hopefully, all went according to plan when that initial capture was made. The captured image, film or digital, can't be easily corrected if a mistake is made.
--Bob
You are partially correct. To quote Ansel Adams, ... (show quote)

Thanks for that. All I meant was that the exposed sensor, or RAW file, is more like an undeveloped piece of film than a finished negative. Exposed film can be developed in a variety of ways (pushing, pulling, water bath, etc.), but developing is a one-shot destructive process. After it's done, intensifiers and reducers don't go very far. Developed film is more like a JPG where shadows and highlights are baked in compared to the latent image in the film. You can do a lot with a negative but not nearly as much as before it is subjected to the choice of developer, time, temperature, agitation, etc. Granted, it is easy and common to compare PP with enlarging or printing a negative because both involve a major break on the human part of the workflow, computer~=enlarger. Someone could offer a more technical explanation involving extracting both ends of the exposure spectrum pre vs post development, or even being able to apply filters for B&W photos after the fact taking the analogy of RAW back prior to exposing the film, quite tricky with a finished negative. Discussions aside, it's a great time to be a photo maker.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:09:31   #
mdoing
 
Just Shoot Me wrote:
As you said " I do not recall ever going back to the jpeg shots for any reason." This should be enough reason for you not to keep them. And yes I only shoot RAW.

Ron


I shoot RAW+Jpeg, save Raw to one larger card, save JPEG to a smaller card. When on a trip I can more quickly download the JPEGS to my laptop to see how things are going, use less space and have something quick and easy for social media. When I get home I download the RAWS to my desktop and never do anything with the JPEGS.

If the RAW card was to become corrupted, I would at least have the JPEGs as a backup. This has never happened yet.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:17:00   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
frankraney wrote:
There is a lot more than getting it right in camera. You can get the focus, composition, light, etc all right in the camera (we all do, at least hope to). But............................

What if you want something brighter (burning) or darker (dodgeing). Suppose you only want the red rose to show in color (and you cannot select color in your camera).

The jpg comes from the raw data....Do you really want to let someone else develop your photo for you with their decisions, or would you like to do your own developing?

There are several reasons to shoot jpg and raw, or not to, but do not get on the high horse "I get it right in camera" because we all try to, but things happen, and we need a raw photo (ALL the data) to make better changes.

I only know one perfect Person that walked this earth, and I don't think you are HIM.
There is a lot more than getting it right in camer... (show quote)


Let me guess his name is Adams!

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Jul 7, 2022 18:17:30   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Very good points. Thanks for the further clarification of your post.
--Bob
Retina wrote:
Thanks for that. All I meant was that the exposed sensor, or RAW file, is more like an undeveloped piece of film than a finished negative. Exposed film can be developed in a variety of ways (pushing, pulling, water bath, etc.), but developing is a one-shot destructive process. After it's done, intensifiers and reducers don't go very far. Developed film is more like a JPG where shadows and highlights are baked in compared to the latent image in the film. You can do a lot with a negative but not nearly as much as before it is subjected to the choice of developer, time, temperature, agitation, etc. Granted, it is easy and common to compare PP with enlarging or printing a negative because both involve a major break on the human part of the workflow, computer~=enlarger. Someone could offer a more technical explanation involving extracting both ends of the exposure spectrum pre vs post development, or even being able to apply filters for B&W photos after the fact taking the analogy of RAW back prior to exposing the film, quite tricky with a finished negative. Discussions aside, it's a great time to be a photo maker.
Thanks for that. All I meant was that the exposed ... (show quote)

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Jul 7, 2022 18:23:36   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
via the lens wrote:
But you do understand I hope that if one does choose to shoot in RAW that image must be processed, just as a camera processes the JPEG image that is output. How one chooses to shoot and how and what they process is a personal decision and does not affect me so I really don't care about it. I shoot RAW because I like to be in charge of the changes made to the original RAW file, just like you appear to be someone who likes to shoot JPEG because you don't have the desire to be in charge of the changes made to the original RAW file. It all works as long as the photographer is happy with the outcome. Getting it "right" can actually have various meanings in the world of photography, your "right" and my "right" could be somewhat different. Obtaing a well-exposed image is a good goal to have but even what that might mean, based on what the intent is, can differ. I haven't looked at your work and I assume you are happy with it but just because you do something does not mean that everyone else should do what you do. I can do a lot more creative processing with a RAW file than my camera can do with a RAW file as the camera does not have my vision. It's about more than the basics.
But you do understand I hope that if one does choo... (show quote)


I must apologize to everyone I’m a 10 year jpeg shooter I have never had so much fun. I post process with windows 10 and smart photo editor. I have topaz denoise and sharpen I generally do light weight corrections. And I know they not as good as some but hundreds of people come thru and love them. I’m into birds. By now I’m heartbroken and I feel so dirty for shooting jpegs! I’m just goin to throw my cameras away. I’m 72 like the song says I just wanta have fun

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Jul 7, 2022 18:29:58   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
billnikon wrote:
...if I was shooting a once in a lifetime event, like a wedding, I would shoot RAW and Jpeg. I would use two cards and shoot one card in RAW and the other in Jpeg...


When I shoot important events I shoot raw and raw. I use two cards, both raw.

When I got my first DSLR I shot jpg because (1) it was the default setting; (2) it was what I knew. When I saw what raw could do for me I shot raw+jpg. Because I didn't really know how to handle raw. Once I got comfortable with raw I dropped the jpg.

Now I shoot raw only (except for modes where raw is not available or necessary [e.g. taking shots looking for sensor dust]). If, for some reason, I need a jpg immediately, I can use IrfanView or a similar viewer which will show me the jpg preview embedded in the raw file. It is the same jpg that the camera would have given me.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:31:28   #
via the lens Loc: Northern California, near Yosemite NP
 
sgomboz wrote:
I haven’t asked anyone to do what I do my friend.. I just posted and opinion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I would never tell anyone how they should shoot or edit their work.. but I did laugh when someone commented that I wasn’t or anyone isn’t a professional photographer because RAW is not the setting.


And most of us know, on the comment about RAW, that the person is simply misinformed.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:35:00   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
sgomboz wrote:
Everybody talks about shooting RAW and then converting them to JPEG for final.. If you learn photography and how to expose, there is no reason you can’t shoot in JPEG...


There is such a reason.

It's called 'dynamic range'. When it is a bit too large, jpg won't hack it and raw will. If it is WAY too large, raw won't hack it either and you need to try other strategies such as bracketing and HDR.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:36:36   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
sgomboz wrote:
I never said I personally was amazing.. all I was saying is I will not be editing every photo that is taken. That’s a waste of time. Learn the art, learn your camera, learn photography. The time you save on constantly editing…. You could be out photographing.


I edit every photo that I take.

Not that every photo needs correction, but one aspect of composition is the aspect ratio which does not always fit a standard.

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Jul 7, 2022 18:53:23   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
You people have got to stop worshiping Ansel Adams! He’s gone

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Jul 7, 2022 19:09:16   #
via the lens Loc: Northern California, near Yosemite NP
 
davyboy wrote:
You people have got to stop worshiping Ansel Adams! He’s gone


If you were to hit the "quote reply" button then we would know to whom you were referring without having to search back through the comments. The photographers of the past are gone (yes, we know that), that's why we refer to them that way, of the past, but that does not diminish their impact on photography today. Adams had a tremendous impact on photography and is one of the reasons that photography became known as an art and not just as a science. There are many other things that he also did for photography and it's probably good to remember him and others who came and left before us as they paved the way.

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Jul 7, 2022 19:14:45   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
If Ansel Adams was the photographer worthy of that name, he'd do a better job Straight Out Of Camera like a Real Photographer.

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Jul 7, 2022 19:27:10   #
b top gun
 
It just never ends at UHH, bet on it, at least a couple of times a week, topics like "RAW vs JPEG", "DSLR vs mirrorless", "To post process or NOT to post process"...ad nauseam...all reasons UHH has lost its appeal and relevance for me.

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Jul 7, 2022 19:27:25   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
via the lens wrote:
If you were to hit the "quote reply" button then we would know to whom you were referring without having to search back through the comments. The photographers of the past are gone (yes, we know that), that's why we refer to them that way, of the past, but that does not diminish their impact on photography today. Adams had a tremendous impact on photography and is one of the reasons that photography became known as an art and not just as a science. There are many other things that he also did for photography and it's probably good to remember him and others who came and left before us as they paved the way.
If you were to hit the "quote reply" but... (show quote)


But it does diminish instead of you talking about him you become like him threw your work😊

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