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When is it finally all about the camera?
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Oct 28, 2021 21:14:03   #
E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada
 
quixdraw wrote:
Certainly to all your points. Again the question is, does whatever brand, newest top-of-the-line digital, with all of its features and functions, learned and appropriately applied, facilitate a leap to catch up with or bypass years of hard-earned learning and experience?


Good question!

No form of automation can ever replace long-term study, the ongoing effort for improvement and experience that is gained by constant and consistent working EXPERIINCE. A large percentage of photography skills, aside from talent and artistry, is instinct and perpetuity for good problem-solving.

There are people with inborn talent, let's call that a "good eye" for aesthetics and composition. The prerequisite technical savvy comes from study, experimentation and experience where certain procedures become second nature.

The latest advancement in equipment does not necessarily address all if any of the aforementioned components of successful photography but it makes accessing and accomplishing them more conveniently and perhaps a bit easier. Less time and effort has to be applied to certain procedures or calculations so the photographer can concentrate on aesthetics, light and lighting issues, composition and capture if peek action or expression in certain subjects.

Automated features as per focus, exposure control are helpful and valid, as long as the photograher understand how the function and how to apply, workaround each function and not allow the automation to take over all the control. Problems occur what the photograher engages in a cycle of continuous correcting things like exposure compensation and that becomes an additional job that has to be done. It's like a dog chasing its n tail and never catching it. Fpr years, competent photographers dealt with filter factors, compmnasting for backlighting, purposely under or overexposing for contrast expansion or compression with coordinated processing procedures, bellows extension factors and the zone system.

To some degree, many modern camera features can enable certain effects that would be otherwise very difficult or nearly impossible on older models. Certain kinds of action freezing, rapid sequences, flas-fill usage at extremely fast shutter (synch)speeds, rapid bracketing, and more. If you are going to make mural-sized prints from a section of a frame, those super-high pixel counts are gonna come in handy.

The best concept I can advise is to "choose your weapons" appropraoity as your work demands. You don't need an "elephant gun" to kill a flea. Some photographer will retort, "but what if I am set upon by a rampaging angry elephant and all I have is a can of flea spray"! So, you need to be honest with yourself and think "how many extremely large prints am I gonna be making"? "How many times will I need to freeze a Formula 1 race car running parallel to my camera or Humminbird wings on a dark night" "Do I need no noise images of a black cat in a coal mine at midnight all by available light"? "Do I wanna see the dust on my still life images"? And then, you buy accordingly. Problem is, if you do shoot a flea with an elephant gun, there is gonna be collateral damage, mostly to your bank account!

If you are doing everything right- exposure, focus, compositions and all the aesthetics are there but you determine that your gear is not performing to your standards, it may be time for an upgrade.

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Oct 28, 2021 21:20:15   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
When we read stories about successful photographers, have you noticed how often they begin with a new camera?

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Oct 28, 2021 22:31:08   #
Quixdraw Loc: x
 
Sorry I had to drop out of a Thread I started for most of the day. Had a dog health emergency and was gone to the City. Have neither the energy nor attitude to get into it now, back tomorrow. Looks like the pup will be o.k., but early yet, will know for sure by Monday.

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Oct 28, 2021 23:06:39   #
E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada
 
quixdraw wrote:
Sorry I had to drop out of a Thread I started for most of the day. Had a dog health emergency and was gone to the City. Have neither the energy nor attitude to get into it now, back tomorrow. Looks like the pup will be o.k., but early yet, will know for sure by Monday.


I hope all goes well with your dog. Looking forward to the good news on your return.

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Oct 29, 2021 03:36:47   #
rook2c4 Loc: Philadelphia, PA USA
 
I don't pay much attention to adverts. They are designed to make you think you need the product and want to buy it. And sometimes adverts can be quite deceptive.

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Oct 29, 2021 05:00:48   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
quixdraw wrote:
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for better than sixty years. Bought my first darkroom at twelve, got hold of my first "Real" camera at 15, and have been learning and working on photography ever since. As an adult, acquired the best equipment I could afford and continued to learn. I was a little slow going digital because I was pretty happy where I was, but made the switch and went all in. Continued on the learning path, and generally getting pretty decent results. For a very long time, I believed it was all about the photographer, Eye, Skills, abilities. Then I realized it sometimes is the photographer, but the camera and lens enable achievements / captures impossible otherwise. Think Bugs or Birds or Astro. I cheerfully use the various built in features of the cameras, on the other hand, most times I don't really need VR, I generally get the photo. The years of learning, practice, and experience will usually carry me through. I have some deletes, but except in the worst conditions, a small percentage.
I got an advert today for the newest pro super camera, I'll leave out the brand to avoid that swamp. From the intro piece it sounds as if the camera will do everything but trigger itself. The sample photos were stunningly good. The eye, of course, remains, but does someone acquiring one of these, and learning its capabilities, jump past decades of skill development and learning? I won't buy one, and have an old style background, so even if I did, could never know. What do you think?
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for b... (show quote)


To answer the topic - hopefully never. Part of the standard for quality is a fluid one - better cameras enable better images. But another major part - the photographer - I think might be less fluid. A good photographer will always make good photographs - regardless of whether they are using a Brownie, a view camera, a 2 mp point and shoot, a cellphone, bridge camera or full blown, top shelf latest and greatest from the best of the best. The last part is how the captured image is processed. This was as true with film as it is with digital. The final act of the creative process is the realization of the original intent.

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Oct 29, 2021 05:34:15   #
KindaSpikey Loc: English living in San Diego
 
quixdraw wrote:
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for better than sixty years. Bought my first darkroom at twelve, got hold of my first "Real" camera at 15, and have been learning and working on photography ever since. As an adult, acquired the best equipment I could afford and continued to learn. I was a little slow going digital because I was pretty happy where I was, but made the switch and went all in. Continued on the learning path, and generally getting pretty decent results. For a very long time, I believed it was all about the photographer, Eye, Skills, abilities. Then I realized it sometimes is the photographer, but the camera and lens enable achievements / captures impossible otherwise. Think Bugs or Birds or Astro. I cheerfully use the various built in features of the cameras, on the other hand, most times I don't really need VR, I generally get the photo. The years of learning, practice, and experience will usually carry me through. I have some deletes, but except in the worst conditions, a small percentage.
I got an advert today for the newest pro super camera, I'll leave out the brand to avoid that swamp. From the intro piece it sounds as if the camera will do everything but trigger itself. The sample photos were stunningly good. The eye, of course, remains, but does someone acquiring one of these, and learning its capabilities, jump past decades of skill development and learning? I won't buy one, and have an old style background, so even if I did, could never know. What do you think?
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for b... (show quote)


Well written, great insight, and I'm in complete agreement Quix. Keep shooting!

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Oct 29, 2021 05:42:44   #
ClarkJohnson Loc: Fort Myers, FL and Cohasset, MA
 
quixdraw wrote:
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for better than sixty years. Bought my first darkroom at twelve, got hold of my first "Real" camera at 15, and have been learning and working on photography ever since. As an adult, acquired the best equipment I could afford and continued to learn. I was a little slow going digital because I was pretty happy where I was, but made the switch and went all in. Continued on the learning path, and generally getting pretty decent results. For a very long time, I believed it was all about the photographer, Eye, Skills, abilities. Then I realized it sometimes is the photographer, but the camera and lens enable achievements / captures impossible otherwise. Think Bugs or Birds or Astro. I cheerfully use the various built in features of the cameras, on the other hand, most times I don't really need VR, I generally get the photo. The years of learning, practice, and experience will usually carry me through. I have some deletes, but except in the worst conditions, a small percentage.
I got an advert today for the newest pro super camera, I'll leave out the brand to avoid that swamp. From the intro piece it sounds as if the camera will do everything but trigger itself. The sample photos were stunningly good. The eye, of course, remains, but does someone acquiring one of these, and learning its capabilities, jump past decades of skill development and learning? I won't buy one, and have an old style background, so even if I did, could never know. What do you think?
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for b... (show quote)


Yes, new technology allows users to avoid the experience of learning skills that are no longer relevant. Like some others who have posted, I am relatively new to photography. I have never used a manual focus camera or a light meter. Am I less of a photographer? If so, it is because I have not had the years of experience in the field developing the instincts about what makes a good shot, but not because I lack the knowledge of how to work around the limitations of old equipment. I also don’t know how to ride a horse, but I am pleased that I don’t need to saddle up to go to the store.

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Oct 29, 2021 05:43:22   #
bodiebill
 
quixdraw wrote:
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for better than sixty years. Bought my first darkroom at twelve, got hold of my first "Real" camera at 15, and have been learning and working on photography ever since. As an adult, acquired the best equipment I could afford and continued to learn. I was a little slow going digital because I was pretty happy where I was, but made the switch and went all in. Continued on the learning path, and generally getting pretty decent results. For a very long time, I believed it was all about the photographer, Eye, Skills, abilities. Then I realized it sometimes is the photographer, but the camera and lens enable achievements / captures impossible otherwise. Think Bugs or Birds or Astro. I cheerfully use the various built in features of the cameras, on the other hand, most times I don't really need VR, I generally get the photo. The years of learning, practice, and experience will usually carry me through. I have some deletes, but except in the worst conditions, a small percentage.
I got an advert today for the newest pro super camera, I'll leave out the brand to avoid that swamp. From the intro piece it sounds as if the camera will do everything but trigger itself. The sample photos were stunningly good. The eye, of course, remains, but does someone acquiring one of these, and learning its capabilities, jump past decades of skill development and learning? I won't buy one, and have an old style background, so even if I did, could never know. What do you think?
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for b... (show quote)


In addition to photography your also an accomplished cook and photographer of some tasty dishes.

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Oct 29, 2021 05:45:40   #
KindaSpikey Loc: English living in San Diego
 
User ID wrote:
That new Nikon Z9 looks to be terrific and competitively priced. Acoarst it’s not for everyone.

I hope someday new battery technology allows getting rid of that lower grip. Need a “portrait grip” ? Cool, but it could be optional like on “lesser” cameras. Other than that little gripe, if I had a $6000 B&H gift card I’d buy a Z9 instead of some other stuff.

Do I need a Z9 ? No. Can I benefit from the Z9 ? Yes. But only in pixel count. It doesn’t appear to do anything my G9 doesn’t already do, but it does it with more pixels (not bigger, just more).

In some major ways the Z9 really falls short of the G9. But maybe more pixels in an almost-as-good camera is worth an extra $4500 for certain users.
That new Nikon Z9 looks to be terrific and competi... (show quote)


HI User ID, quick question. I've often seen you use the word "Acoarst". I have no idea what it means and I can't find it in any dictionary! Could you please enlighten me, it has me perplexed! Lol

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Oct 29, 2021 06:04:29   #
KindaSpikey Loc: English living in San Diego
 
I've been a carpenter my whole life. I served my apprenticeship learning with hand saws, hand cranked drills, many different shaped planes etc. Of course the years and technology have created tools once only dreamt of! I am still capable of using the "old" tools and can still attain pretty good results, but I am admittedly a tool junkie, so I invest probably too much in the latest and greatest. That said, my work flow is faster, more accurate and somewhat more fun. So as an analogy to photography, I still have the ability to use the low tech equipment to a pretty good standard, but I get better results with the high tech stuff. Put those new tools in the hands of someone with little or no experience, and the results will not reflect the capabilities of those tools. To be successful it's always a good combination of knowledge, and equipment.

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Oct 29, 2021 06:08:11   #
Tdearing Loc: Rockport, TX
 
In my very humble opinion it requires the match between pilot and machine. Pilot providing the settings, composition etc., the machine brings home the bacon. As a mere neophyte, I look for the best of both above discussed and then on download wait to see if at the completion of the download that extra pop of definition shows itself. The pop that all of the sudden makes everything super vivid allowing me to really crop to that portion I want to use for perhaps a wallpaper. Without the great camera and lens that finish simply doesnt happen. My thoughts anyway.

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Oct 29, 2021 06:14:53   #
uhaas2009
 
You can see this from different sides. Technically you may not need it but it keeps you going and you enjoy photography.....why not enjoy new equipment......

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Oct 29, 2021 06:38:58   #
SkyKing Loc: Thompson Ridge, NY
 
…isn’t advertising wonderful…and technology advancements have come in leaps and bounds…especially with such good competition…I hope there is no clear winner and we all enjoy what the next bestest camera brings…(did I hear someone say Canon?)…


quixdraw wrote:
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for better than sixty years. Bought my first darkroom at twelve, got hold of my first "Real" camera at 15, and have been learning and working on photography ever since. As an adult, acquired the best equipment I could afford and continued to learn. I was a little slow going digital because I was pretty happy where I was, but made the switch and went all in. Continued on the learning path, and generally getting pretty decent results. For a very long time, I believed it was all about the photographer, Eye, Skills, abilities. Then I realized it sometimes is the photographer, but the camera and lens enable achievements / captures impossible otherwise. Think Bugs or Birds or Astro. I cheerfully use the various built in features of the cameras, on the other hand, most times I don't really need VR, I generally get the photo. The years of learning, practice, and experience will usually carry me through. I have some deletes, but except in the worst conditions, a small percentage.
I got an advert today for the newest pro super camera, I'll leave out the brand to avoid that swamp. From the intro piece it sounds as if the camera will do everything but trigger itself. The sample photos were stunningly good. The eye, of course, remains, but does someone acquiring one of these, and learning its capabilities, jump past decades of skill development and learning? I won't buy one, and have an old style background, so even if I did, could never know. What do you think?
I have been a serious photography enthusiast for b... (show quote)

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Oct 29, 2021 06:55:10   #
Walkabout08
 
No matter what the equipment, there are soooo many elements required to create a good photo I don’t see gear every having the ability to overcome a lack of experience, training, and artistic talents.

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