texasdigital Loc: Conroe, Texas

Early on in this thread, I posted an article that went into detail about how Keiretsu works. Additionally, I lived in Japan for about 2 1/2 yrs and I have a tiny bit of knowledge about their culture, although their business culture can be somewhat foreign to how we Gaijin think.

I suppose my original post was somewhat dramatic and perhaps misleading as I am not as worried about Nikon going out of business as I am that they will fall so far behind in technological advancement that they will be relegated to a position in the market that pros or advance amateur's will no longer consider them. I love my Nikons (especially my D850) an my lenses, which I personally believe the quality rivals other lens makers.

What I do hope is that Nikon comes out with an adapter that will allow full frame Nikon lens to be used on the Sony.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

Why would Nikon or Sony build and brand such an adapter to support another brand's equipment? That hope is even more unrealistic than Nikon will pull out of this long and ever increasing tailspin.

texasdigital Loc: Conroe, Texas

Hah hah! Now I get you. I initially thought you had serious contributions to make in this conversation, but now I understand that you just have a different sense of humor. You've been pulling our leg all along. Good one CHG_CANON!

Well that's okay, we have room for jokesters as well as serious posters. Thanks for the laugh.

Bill_de Loc: US

Or, Sony could make the adapter.

It would be nice if we could pair our favorite bodies with our favorite lenses with full functionality on both. May never happen, but we can dream.

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torchman310 Loc: Santa Clarita, Ca.

It is unfortunate that a company as big as NIKON is going down the drain. The fault does NOT lay with their products or their craftsmen and women. It lies directly with poor management. One lousy executive who has other plans than keeping the company afloat can, and have done, major damage to otherwise viable companies. It is a damned shame that NIKON may very well be on it's way out. I have used NIKON cameras and lenses since the mid 70's.
I started with the F2 AS, F 3, D 70, D200, and now the D-4S. Their lenses are superb, the feel of the cameras in my hands are great, but 1 bad apple is lousing the entire corporation up. In MHO !

gwilliams6

There are many third-party makers that have created these cross-platform lens adapters. And they are all different quality and have different levels of performance, some very poor, some just ok, some much better.

You will never see the OEM manufacturer making an adapter so that you can use a different lens brand on their cameras, that will never happen as they want you to buy OEM lenses. But that does not mean that the OEM maker will ever try to legally stop these third-party adapters from being made, it can help them sell more bodies.

What happens more often is deals are made for third-party lens makers to get access to the OEM native lens algorithms and software to make native-mount lenses for different platforms . Multi-platform native-mount lenses from Sigma, Tamron and Samyang/Rokinon are perfect examples of that. And as was noted, Sony does own a good part of Tamron and has shared their OEM lenses algorithms with Tamron ,and Tamron native E-Mount lenses work superbly on Sony bodies for both still and video shooting.

Another way is to make one same lens mount for more than one camera platform. That isn't a new concept and has been done throughout photo history. The most current fullframe mirrorless iteration of that is the "L" mount shared by Sigma, Panasonic and Leica.

There are many technical and engineering differences between brands , and therefore many reasons why some system's lenses will generally work better than others with adapters on another platform. Those engineering differences and proprietary technology aren't going away , so don't expect full functionality when using non-native lenses cross-platform . It is simply a crap-shoot how well or poorly that will work.

The only way for full functionality in both stills and video shooting is to use native-mount lenses on your camera, whether from the OEM manufacturer or a native-mount lens from a third-party maker.

Cheers

texasdigital Loc: Conroe, Texas

In Japanese, "bad apple" is Damena ringo. So, Damena ringo Nikon! Bad Nikon

wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado

This part of the conversation is interesting. The reason for the "L" mount is just so Panasonic, Leica, and Sigma could compete with the likes of Sony, Canon, and Nikon. Any beginning photographer can buy a Panasonic, Leica, and Sigma body and a Panasonic, Leica, and Sigma lens to meet their beginning quality needs and cost. Then later, upgrade to a better, or much better, body or lens. This also offers a photographer a much bigger body and lens pool to choose from than the smaller body and lens pools of the individual manufacturers. This all makes it easier for Panasonic, Leica, and Sigma to compete on a smaller budget with the big boys as long as they keep up with the quality and innovation. Will the strategy work? That remains to be seen. In the long run, I think the strategy will be somewhat successful. It will be somewhat successful especially if the one industry consultant's indication that the market will eventually move towards smaller, lighter, and less costly. If the full frame market shrinks towards APS-C and some to 4/3rds with their bigger megapixel sensors, the "L" mount will provide an economic advantage to those using it.

I only wish I had a time machine to find out today how the future ends up tomorrow. But until the future gets here, I guess I will just take photos.

SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA

Actually quite a few people under 30 know the difference and mostly want MILC’s. There are still lots of higher end cameras being sold. The point and shoot market is done. Except for a couple of specialty areas, like underwater, they’ve been replaced by the cellphone. The biggest market for cameras now is content creation. People under 30 want cameras that can do both great still shots and great video. Many of these “creators” started with cellphones but have progressed to mirrorless cameras.

baron_silverton Loc: Los Angeles, CA

The market is moving away from smaller sensors to full frame and why wouldn't it. There is more distinction between a cell phone and a full frame than there is between cell phones and smaller sensors - as cell phones get better the need for cameras in general diminishes but full frame will be the last to go - not the first.

kb6kgx Loc: Simi Valley, CA

That is NOT what I'm saying at all. I'm NOT saying "all brands are the same. Clearly they are not. What I'm saying is that whatever it is that you have, you bought Canon because you believe Canon is the best. You bought Nikon because Nikon is the best. And so on. My "Ford vs. Chevy" comparison is because owners of THOSE trucks believe that what THEY have is the best. That is why they bought it. Obviously Ford, Chevy, Dodge, etc., are not "all the same".

wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado

Full frame is not going to die. It will probably never die until optical cameras are replaced with some other future "magical" technology. But I suspect it will not be "king of the hill" down the road. Sensor technology is changing. The five year old 4/3rds sensor designs are going to start being replaced this year. I was only hoping for a 25mp sensor, but now it appears it will be a 33mp new technology sensor. And there may be a 42mp in the further future. And Olympus has already stated that the pro lenses are good up to a 100mp sensor. Will a 33mp sensor make 4/3rds "king of the hill"? No. But take a look at what is changing in the market. I do not remember the brand, but the manufacturer's comment was that the body was small and light "like a 4/3rds body" while having a full frame sensor. The only remaining problem is now in the lens' sizes and weights.

The Sony FE 600 f4 GM OSS is 6.44" X 17.68", 6.7#, and $12,998. The Canon RF 600 f4 IS USM is 6.6" X 18.6", 6.8#, and $12,999. The Nikon 600 f4E AF-S Nikkor FL ED VR is 6.54" X 17", 8.4#, and $12,296.95. The Olympus ED 300 f4 IS Pro IS 3.64" X 8.94", 3.25#, and $2,749. These four lenses are all sharp 4.1° lenses. But which ones are the smallest, most handholdable, and the most affordable? Yes, there is a difference in depth of field between full frames and 4/3rds lenses. Even as expensive the Olympus lens is, most people cannot afford a 4.1° lens except for the Olympus lens. Can those full frame lenses be made half the size, half the weight, and still be a 300 f4 lens? No. But the APS-C could offer a system that would be smaller, lighter, and more affordable without losing all the sometimes desired narrow depth of field and high ISO of full frame. There are no 400 f4 APS-C lenses. The closest lenses are 300 f8 reflex lenses and a zoom that goes to 350. The market is wide open for Nikon's taking right now (or any smart thinking company). Plus, less material cost. The manufacturers could be offering all of us a system more powerful than 4/3rds yet not all the size, weight, and cost of full frame. My guess Nikon will miss this opportunity and Sony will not.

There will be less and less amateurs and enthusiasts that will be willing to save and/or spend $13K for a pro lens if and when there are cheaper alternatives. And the pro level sales alone will probably not totally support keeping a pro level lens' cost from going up further in cost. Further evidence of this is: one can buy any one of the full frame 600 f4 lenses now without much delay, but one has to wait "in line" for a new Olympus 150-400 f4.5 lens until sometime between July and December of next year to get one of the $7,500 lenses. This shows that the amateurs and enthusiasts, along with some pros, are willing to save and spend the money even in the light of more depth of field and more noise at higher ISO just to get those long telephoto lengths. They are not will to spend the extra $6K for a full frame lens with less reach. This is part of the reason that the "crown" will eventually move from full frame to APS-C. 4/3rds will benefit from better sensors, but they will not be made "king of the hill".

BebuLamar

I know that CHG_CANON likes to make jokes but I think you're really joking in hoping for Nikon to make such an adapter.

larryepage Loc: North Texas area

Actually, given the strong cultural push for standardization and interoperability that has pervaded Japan for decades, the proliferation of incompatible lens mounts is actually at least a little bit surprising. Test equipment plug-ins, commonality of auto parts (think moldings and tail light compinents) has been a hallmark for a long time, even though it's fading somewhat now.

The reverse bayonet that identifies the Nikon mounts have in particular been a long-standing mystery.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

Apple isn't a plug n play open design, who said they're a failure?