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Dec 7, 2020 12:56:16   #
Etram
 
Thomas902 wrote:
""...take some mini (15 min session) holiday family portraits, on-site... ...holiday picture of her, her husband and baby... ...has to be nighttime and she would like if outdoors, in front of their new house, with Christmas lights... ...I don’t ever shoot at night. I have a speed light but am not even sure how to use it.... I have a Nikon d7200. The speed light I own (Altura) cannot not be set-up for TTL? (just learning about off-camera flash) so has to be manual and I am not sure of the settings I should use. Help! ...hoping for a quick lesson so I can get a decent shot for her tonight..."

Etram you should not have accepted this assignment... especially if you've never attempted nighttime outdoor portraiture... Sorry to be the messenger, but you have seriously exceeded your capabilities...

Since you will likely ignore my advice and attempt this shoot... The best I can suggest is to use your built in flash on the D7200 and set it's flash compensation for -1.7. Others here will try and tell you never use your built in flash... This is likely because they have yet to master this technique... See below taken with your camera model a D7200 using it's built in flash.

btw, if a commercial photographer were in your situation they might deploy a large shoot through umbrella with your (off brand) flash in manual mode using a PC Sync cord (you'll need a hot shoe converted ($2) and 20 foot PC ($15) cord to pull this off... To have the Christmas lights show up you'll need to deploy Slow Speed Sycn... and let your D7200 match ambient here...

Mission impossible Etram, you're in way over your head...
And shame on those encouraging Etram to "Go for it!"
This is highly unlikely to end well...
.
""...take some mini (15 min session) hol... (show quote)


I respectfully disagree...this is a not a professional shoot- I am doing a favor for my boss, who I am also very friendly with. I am not being paid. She would have hired someone professional, if that was her intention.
I believe I am capable of taking a decent outdoor, nighttime photo. Was just looking for some friendly advice as to how best to use a flash in this situation. It will end just fine:)

Reply
Dec 7, 2020 13:00:04   #
Etram
 
Gene51 wrote:
The advice is simple - if you use flash, make sure it doesn't look like you used flash.

The execution, on the other hand can be daunting.

This NJ Wedding photographer nails it:

https://neilvn.com/tangents/flash-photography-techniques/natural-looking-flash/

Even if you are shooting at night, there is always a way to get natural looking and flattering light from a flash - even if it means you need to bring a friend to hold a large bounce surface so that the light source is large and nicely diffused, yet directional.
The advice is simple - if you use flash, make sure... (show quote)

Thank you so very much for your very helpful and encouraging response. I will bring one of my kids-I have bounce surface I can bring. And I very much appreciate the video you referenced! I look forward to watching it!! Thanks very much!

Reply
Dec 7, 2020 13:08:23   #
Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC
 
"...I believe I am capable of taking a decent outdoor, nighttime photo..."
Wishing you all the best Etram...

Please be certain share the results with this evening's session with us.
I'm certain many here will enjoy seeing the fruits of your endeavor...

Reply
 
 
Dec 7, 2020 13:12:59   #
Etram
 
n4jee wrote:
There is no trick to flash photography. Your flash is a fixed speed (very fast) so the correct exposure is determined by the aperture setting and the distance the flash is from the camera. You can determine this by trial and error with a substitute subject in your own yard at night. Oops, the shoot is tonight. When you get home from work do it in a darkened room, you'll get close enough. Now you adjust the shutter speed to record the background lit by the ambient light. Use a tripod, bracket your shutter speeds, and shoot in RAW mode.
Good luck.
There is no trick to flash photography. Your flash... (show quote)

Cannot thank you enough! Your response made sense to me and gave me some extremely helpful tips for achieving this. I really appreciate it!

Reply
Dec 7, 2020 13:18:08   #
Etram
 
Thomas902 wrote:
"...I believe I am capable of taking a decent outdoor, nighttime photo..."
Wishing you all the best Etram...

Please be certain share the results with this evening's session with us.
I'm certain many here will enjoy seeing the fruits of your endeavor...

Thank you for your well-wishes.

Reply
Dec 7, 2020 13:20:17   #
Etram
 
[quote=Etram]Thank you for your well-wishes.[
And thank you for your response. I realize you are a professional and respect your comment. I hope you have a safe and wonderful holiday.

Reply
Dec 7, 2020 14:04:06   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Etram wrote:
Thank you so very much for your very helpful and encouraging response. I will bring one of my kids-I have bounce surface I can bring. And I very much appreciate the video you referenced! I look forward to watching it!! Thanks very much!


I would just ignore Thomas902 on this one. He is a very good photographer, but a with a bit of a "my way or the highway" point of view. There are obviously many ways to do this, and a shoot through umbrella is certainly one of them. However, these have a hot spot in the center, and the large ones are best used with more powerful monolights. I prefer to use a DIY version of Beadboard solution like this:

https://movingpicture.com/product/bead-board-4x4/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJO9IZPQnKM&t=282s

If you don't want to bother with a DIY reflector, you can always get something like this:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1110963-REG/savage_rf5_13648_5_in_1_photo_reflector_36.html
or bigger

These should help you understand the quality of the light you should be aiming for and how to mix ambient and speedlight:

https://neilvn.com/tangents/flash-photography-techniques/flash-and-ambient-light/

https://neilvn.com/tangents/flash-photography-techniques/dragging-the-shutter/

I think you are on a tight schedule - you probably want to do a test series on location just to make sure you get your lighting dialed in just right. It will help if you have your speedlight on a lightstand and you use some inexpensive radio triggers to get the flash away from the camera. I use Yongnuo triggers - they have proven reliable over the past 8 yrs I've been using them.

I like this quality of light in the following images - they were done with simple bounce light off the walls and ceiling in a very large room with high ceilings, though I do recognize that everyone's mileage can and does differ. Pay particular attention to the quality of the shadows and skin textures.

.


(Download)


(Download)


(Download)


(Download)


(Download)

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Dec 7, 2020 16:19:22   #
Etram
 
Gene51 wrote:
I would just ignore Thomas902 on this one. He is a very good photographer, but a with a bit of a "my way or the highway" point of view. There are obviously many ways to do this, and a shoot through umbrella is certainly one of them. However, these have a hot spot in the center, and the large ones are best used with more powerful monolights. I prefer to use a DIY version of Beadboard solution like this:

https://movingpicture.com/product/bead-board-4x4/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJO9IZPQnKM&t=282s

If you don't want to bother with a DIY reflector, you can always get something like this:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1110963-REG/savage_rf5_13648_5_in_1_photo_reflector_36.html
or bigger

These should help you understand the quality of the light you should be aiming for and how to mix ambient and speedlight:

https://neilvn.com/tangents/flash-photography-techniques/flash-and-ambient-light/

https://neilvn.com/tangents/flash-photography-techniques/dragging-the-shutter/

I think you are on a tight schedule - you probably want to do a test series on location just to make sure you get your lighting dialed in just right. It will help if you have your speedlight on a lightstand and you use some inexpensive radio triggers to get the flash away from the camera. I use Yongnuo triggers - they have proven reliable over the past 8 yrs I've been using them.

I like this quality of light in the following images - they were done with simple bounce light off the walls and ceiling in a very large room with high ceilings, though I do recognize that everyone's mileage can and does differ. Pay particular attention to the quality of the shadows and skin textures.

.
I would just ignore Thomas902 on this one. He is a... (show quote)


I am so appreciative of your very thorough response. You have been more than helpful-truly! Your photos are just beautiful!! I love the lighting-so natural...the skin tones are gorgeous.
I appreciate the materials you’ve sent me, as well. Very kind of you!
And thank you for addressing the Thomas comment. I found him to be condescending and unprofessional. He may be a good photographer but the ability to communicate respectfully and make thoughtful, human connections is even more essential in this world. Implying I have inferior capabilities and will fail, even before I’ve begun, astounded me. I steer clear of people like that:)) Everyone else, including yourself!, has been so kind and supportive and I am very grateful for your help. Have a wonderful evening!

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 00:07:31   #
Wallen Loc: Middle Earth
 
Etram wrote:
Thank you so very much for your very helpful and encouraging response. I will bring one of my kids-I have bounce surface I can bring. And I very much appreciate the video you referenced! I look forward to watching it!! Thanks very much!


No idea of your location but if you are in a room and the walls & ceiling are white or white enough, you can bounce the flash on them and get beautiful diffused natural lighting. Colored ceilings & walls may require some adjustment on your white balance.
Outdoors, you can put the flash on tripod on a slave mode and diffuser on, off to one side and slightly above your head and use the cameras own flash as fill light to lessen shadows & activate the main flash.
This set up with present ambient light can do well. Experiment before you start with your session so you can see what setting and combination can be the best for your situation.

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 02:34:11   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Etram wrote:
I am so appreciative of your very thorough response. You have been more than helpful-truly! Your photos are just beautiful!! I love the lighting-so natural...the skin tones are gorgeous.
I appreciate the materials you’ve sent me, as well. Very kind of you!
And thank you for addressing the Thomas comment. I found him to be condescending and unprofessional. He may be a good photographer but the ability to communicate respectfully and make thoughtful, human connections is even more essential in this world. Implying I have inferior capabilities and will fail, even before I’ve begun, astounded me. I steer clear of people like that:)) Everyone else, including yourself!, has been so kind and supportive and I am very grateful for your help. Have a wonderful evening!
I am so appreciative of your very thorough respons... (show quote)


I think you will do just fine as long as you do a test session or two to get your ducks in a row. We all started somewhere, just like yourself right now. I give you a lot of credit for doing something like this, and for having the curiosity to investigate what others might do and really take their advice to heart. Good luck and I hope to see a post or two of the results - at least of the test sessions!

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 06:56:00   #
Don, the 2nd son Loc: Crowded Florida
 
Thomas902 wrote:
""...take some mini (15 min session) holiday family portraits, on-site... ...holiday picture of her, her husband and baby... ...has to be nighttime and she would like if outdoors, in front of their new house, with Christmas lights... ...I don’t ever shoot at night. I have a speed light but am not even sure how to use it.... I have a Nikon d7200. The speed light I own (Altura) cannot not be set-up for TTL? (just learning about off-camera flash) so has to be manual and I am not sure of the settings I should use. Help! ...hoping for a quick lesson so I can get a decent shot for her tonight..."

Etram you should not have accepted this assignment... especially if you've never attempted nighttime outdoor portraiture... Sorry to be the messenger, but you have seriously exceeded your capabilities...

Since you will likely ignore my advice and attempt this shoot... The best I can suggest is to use your built in flash on the D7200 and set it's flash compensation for -1.7. Others here will try and tell you never use your built in flash... This is likely because they have yet to master this technique... See below taken with your camera model a D7200 using it's built in flash.

btw, if a commercial photographer were in your situation they might deploy a large shoot through umbrella with your (off brand) flash in manual mode using a PC Sync cord (you'll need a hot shoe converted ($2) and 20 foot PC ($15) cord to pull this off... To have the Christmas lights show up you'll need to deploy Slow Speed Flash Sycn... and let your D7200 match ambient here...

Mission impossible Etram, you're in way over your head...
And shame on those encouraging Etram to "Go for it!"
This is unlikely to end well...
.
""...take some mini (15 min session) hol... (show quote)



Reply
 
 
Dec 8, 2020 07:03:36   #
Don, the 2nd son Loc: Crowded Florida
 
All fantastic advice, but wouldn't it be good to ask for a couple of days delay? The advice given aall requires a bit of time to try and evaluate what will work for you. I'd need a bit of breathing room for prep. Best of luck, your excellent results so far speak for your ability to do well.

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 07:07:44   #
billnikon Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont
 
Etram wrote:
Hi-
I am a hobbyist photographer who mainly shoots macro nature (flowers, foliage) and some sea and landscapes) and of course, my 4 kids:))
About a year ago, my employer asked if I would take some mini (15 min session) holiday family portraits, on-site. I work at a beautiful nursery/home decor place, perfect setting for photos. I have continued it this year, purchasing a portrait lens, etc, practicing and learning everything I could about this type of photography. I’ve had a very positive response to the images and have truly enjoyed this genre. They have all been daytime, outdoors, natural light.
My boss just asked if I could run out to her house to take a holiday picture of her, her husband and baby. Because of her work schedule, it has to be nighttime and she would like if outdoors, in front of their new house, with Christmas lights. I said yes, of course, but am panicking because I don’t ever shoot at night. I have a speed light but am not even sure how to use it. I have a Nikon d7200. The speed light I own (Altura) cannot not be set-up for TTL? (just learning about off-camera flash) so has to be manual and I am not sure of the settings I should use. Help! Please be kind. I never use flash and was hoping for a quick lesson so I can get a decent shot for her tonight.
Thank you in advance!
Martha
adding a photo from one of the sessions-a new baby! Really have enjoyed capturing these special moments!
Hi- br I am a hobbyist photographer who mainly sho... (show quote)


I suggest a TTL flash with a revolving head, turn the head up at a 45 degree angle and aim it behind you, set the camera to manual and the flash to TTL. Drag your shutter (use about 1/30 sec.) and take test shots until you like the results, then shoot the family. ISO about 800, keep lens opening to about 2 stops back from wide open. ie. if you have a 1.8 lens, then close it down two stops. This would be a good starting point. Vary your ISO until you find a good combination.

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 07:43:50   #
camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.
 
The statements by Thomas 902 in my opinion are right on. Without experience using flash the chances are excellent that you will not do very well.

You will have to combine, if that is possible since it gets dark earlier now, an ambient light with the flash exposure so that you can get good details in the Christmas lights. Using manual flash is a great idea but you have told us that you lack the experience. Using off camera flash is a great idea also but still you need to control the flash exposure for a pleasant portrait with the least amount of flash that will render a good image.

I wish I could give you better advise but I do not know how much ambient light will be available for your shooting or how powerful your flash is. Something you should know is that TTL flash does not communicate with the camera, that is only possible with TTL-BL. When TTL is used the exposure is for the subject, not the background. If you have good light for the background I would meter and set my exposure from there and use TTL flash only for fill-in cutting the light by at least 1.7 stop. Let me repeat it, since I do not know the conditions under which you will be shooting I am only talking about the generalities of flash photography.. Umbrellas are very useful to soften the light but I am sure you are not set up to use them.

Your time is too short to learn to use flash properly but I wish you good luck.

Reply
Dec 8, 2020 07:55:48   #
tenny52 Loc: San Francisco
 
Etram wrote:
Hi-
I am a hobbyist photographer who mainly shoots macro nature (flowers, foliage) and some sea and landscapes) and of course, my 4 kids:))
About a year ago, my employer asked if I would take some mini (15 min session) holiday family portraits, on-site. I work at a beautiful nursery/home decor place, perfect setting for photos. I have continued it this year, purchasing a portrait lens, etc, practicing and learning everything I could about this type of photography. I’ve had a very positive response to the images and have truly enjoyed this genre. They have all been daytime, outdoors, natural light.
My boss just asked if I could run out to her house to take a holiday picture of her, her husband and baby. Because of her work schedule, it has to be nighttime and she would like if outdoors, in front of their new house, with Christmas lights. I said yes, of course, but am panicking because I don’t ever shoot at night. I have a speed light but am not even sure how to use it. I have a Nikon d7200. The speed light I own (Altura) cannot not be set-up for TTL? (just learning about off-camera flash) so has to be manual and I am not sure of the settings I should use. Help! Please be kind. I never use flash and was hoping for a quick lesson so I can get a decent shot for her tonight.
Thank you in advance!
Martha
adding a photo from one of the sessions-a new baby! Really have enjoyed capturing these special moments!
Hi- br I am a hobbyist photographer who mainly sho... (show quote)

I have one of the cheaper flash(about $50-60) which has universal rotation and gradual intensity dial, then experiment it manually with different brightness vs iso vs speed vs F-stop.
I have fairly good portrait results per D610 and 50mm 1.4 with the flash reflector up, direct it to the ceiling(brightness about mid-way), ISO(about 400), speed(about around 100), Aperture(about 4.5). then vary different settings according to your needs.

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