Pastor Commits Suicide (Page 5): So Hawking, Greene, LeMaitre, and Hubbel were all wrong? BTW your link claims the universe had a distinct beginning and embraces the Big Bang. I do...

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

Jade Warrior wrote:

I don't know how the universe came into being. Neither do you. Neither does anyone know for sure. There are various models proposed, such in the following article but they are models. This is how science works. It constructs models to try and get the best fit with what can be observed, and with other models which seem to explain other parts of the jigsaw. Until a better explanation comes along.
https://www.discovermagazine.com/the-sciences/what-came-before-the-big-bang

So Hawking, Greene, LeMaitre, and Hubbel were all wrong?

BTW your link claims the universe had a distinct beginning and embraces the Big Bang.

I do also.

What about you, or do you even understand what it means?

It seems you would be stumped by Newtonian physics, much less Einstein.

Do you abide by the Big Bang?

Jade Warrior Loc: Sydney, Australia

LWW wrote:

So Hawking, Greene, LeMaitre, and Hubbel were all wrong?

BTW your link claims the universe had a distinct beginning and embraces the Big Bang.

I do also.

What about you, or do you even understand what it means?

It seems you would be stumped by Newtonian physics, much less Einstein.

Do you abide by the Big Bang?

Scientists produce scientific models. I don't pretend to be able to prove these models right or wrong. The big bang may have started from nothing or it may have been part of a continuum. What is your point?

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

Jade Warrior wrote:

Scientists produce scientific models. I don't pretend to be able to prove these models right or wrong. The big bang may have started from nothing or it may have been part of a continuum. What is your point?

As I suspected, you have no comprehension of the subject.

If you believe the science, then before the big bang there was no space, no time, no matter, no energy, no anything. The universe simply did not exist ... and then, in less than a moment it did.

Are you of a different opinion?

soba1 Loc: Somewhere In So Ca

Jade Warrior wrote:

Scientists produce scientific models. I don't pretend to be able to prove these models right or wrong. The big bang may have started from nothing or it may have been part of a continuum. What is your point?

If you truly want scientific proof regarding the Bible I suggest you start with Chuck Missler. He had a technical background with the Navy and used to work for TRW. He is as about as technical as anyone can get.
That’s if you truly seek understanding.
Though you might think so nothing in the Bible is random.

https://youtu.be/496V7OR35vs

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

soba1 wrote:

If you truly want scientific proof regarding the Bible I suggest you start with Chuck Missler. He had a technical background with the Navy and used to work for TRW. He is as about as technical as anyone can get.
That’s if you truly seek understanding.

https://youtu.be/496V7OR35vs

My guess is that his only interest is in convincing himself that he's right.

soba1 Loc: Somewhere In So Ca

LWW wrote:

My guess is that his only interest is in convincing himself that he's right.

If fe really wants truth he will find it. Our job is to share the gospel. It’s for God to do the rest. Some people want to live how they want to live not realizing the cannot live up to the perfection of God and not wanting to acknowledge they need the Savior Jesus Christ who paid for our transgressions by his suffering death and resurrection.
We just shake the dust and move on

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

soba1 wrote:

If fe really wants truth he will find it. Our job is to share the gospel. It’s for God to do the rest. Some people want to live how they want to live not realizing the cannot live up to the perfection of God and not wanting to acknowledge they need the Savior Jesus Christ who paid for our transgressions by his suffering death and resurrection.
We just shake the dust and move on

What gets me is that the self proclaimed open minded free thinkers typically never put any thought into things at all.

If they admit the existence of a Creator they have to dismiss their wanted belief that they are the highest form of consciousness in creation ... a falsehood they cling to like a hobo with a hot ham sandwich.

soba1 Loc: Somewhere In So Ca

LWW wrote:

What gets me is that the self proclaimed open minded free thinkers typically never put any thought into things at all.

If they admit the existence of a Creator they have to dismiss their wanted belief that they are the highest form of consciousness in creation ... a falsehood they cling to like a hobo with a hot ham sandwich.

That’s because they don’t want any consequences for their actions.
They create God in their own image

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

soba1 wrote:

That’s because they don’t want any consequences for their actions.
They create God in their own image

Well put.

soba1 Loc: Somewhere In So Ca

LWW wrote:

Well put.

Jade Warrior Loc: Sydney, Australia

LWW wrote:

So Hawking, Greene, LeMaitre, and Hubbel were all wrong?

BTW your link claims the universe had a distinct beginning and embraces the Big Bang.

I do also.

What about you, or do you even understand what it means?

It seems you would be stumped by Newtonian physics, much less Einstein.

Do you abide by the Big Bang?

My views on the meaning of life, the existence of God and the value of science are pretty much summarised as per the following article which is an interview with Marcelo Gleiser:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/atheism-is-inconsistent-with-the-scientific-method-prizewinning-physicist-says/

Newton rejected the concept of the Trinity. Einstein rejected Judeo-Christianity and a belief in the idea of eternal life, outright. Hawkins was an atheist. Hubble was an agnostic. Georges Lemaître was a Catholic Priest
Brian Green does not seem to admit to any religious filter which would shape his views.
(He is a very compelling and entertaining speaker.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S14zONUX3JY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M22MEShcyx8&t=861s

Do I believe in the Big Bang?
It seems the bet explanation so far.

Did time exist before the Big Bang? The mathematics that led to the theory of the Big Bang do not allow it to. To paraphrase Brian Green, how can you go further north than the North Pole?

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

Jade Warrior wrote:

My views on the meaning of life, the existence of ... (show quote)

There we go.

Now, step two, if you accept the Big Bang it dictates that we live in a determinist universe where the entirety of history was set in motion at that moment an every atom is on a course dictated by that event.

Agreed?

Jade Warrior Loc: Sydney, Australia

LWW wrote:

There we go.

Now, step two, if you accept the Big Bang it dictates that we live in a determinist universe where the entirety of history was set in motion at that moment an every atom is on a course dictated by that event.

Agreed?

I wonder if Soba1 would agree that his later life conversion to Christianity was pre determined at the time of the big bang and that his belief in the power of pray is meaningless.
Get to your point

LWW Loc: Banana Republic of America

Jade Warrior wrote:

I wonder if Soba1 would agree that his later life conversion to Christianity was pre determined at the time of the big bang and that his belief in the power of pray is meaningless.
Get to your point

Do you agree with the science of the Big Bang and what it caused?

I am getting to the point, you have to be willing to learn.

The universe and the creator cannot be learned or explained on a paragraph.

I have answered all your questions, why do you fear answering mine?

As to soba1, by the end ... if you have the intellectual integrity to pursue it to the end ... I am confident you will find he and I in complete agreement.

Jade Warrior Loc: Sydney, Australia

Get to your point