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Still having focus issues
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Mar 10, 2020 15:37:11   #
authorizeduser Loc: Monroe, Michigan
 
OK, here is the JPG converted with Canon DPP


(Download)

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Mar 10, 2020 15:38:05   #
Screamin Scott Loc: Marshfield Wi, Baltimore Md, now Dallas Ga
 
authorizeduser wrote:
OK, here is the JPG converted with Canon DPP


Nothing attached
Now its showing....

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Mar 10, 2020 15:39:12   #
authorizeduser Loc: Monroe, Michigan
 
Screamin Scott wrote:
Nothing attached
Now its showing....

ok

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Mar 10, 2020 16:00:16   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
authorizeduser wrote:
OK, here is the JPG converted with Canon DPP


Thank you for converting and posting. Below is an example of the technical details this file provides. We see a zone AF group is used. Using the 'center' isn't wrong, but coupled with the f/5.6 aperture and the nearness to this 6-person group is where all the settings combined do not result in a pleasing recipe.

Experiment with the external dials on the camera that you'll need to use to move the zone quickly around the frame. See if the camera will make a better 'program auto' decision if told to AF using a group in the lower left on the woman in glasses and light blue. If the camera still 'thinks' f/5.6 is a good aperture, begin to learn and practice with the exposure modes that give you more control.

Finally, do not use AI Focus AF. Although the manual makes this seem ideal, it is actually the worst AF option from Canon EOS. This mode has even been removed from newer EOS-R models. Your best AF drive mode for sharp images is AI Servo, using either a BBF configuration or practicing to have your index finger always half-pressing the shutter and forcing the camera / lens to constantly focus.


(Download)

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Mar 10, 2020 16:18:52   #
amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA
 
authorizeduser wrote:
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera is in P mode with Flash. I have the focus set to use the center 9 focus points. Went to a party and took photos. Had a 3 people standing together and I took the photo. The center photo is sharp and is the right person, however the left person is out of focus. Now I am thinking this is a screwy lens but this phenomenon does not always happen. Sometimes it the other way around. I took a group shot of 6 people. Some are in sharp and in focus and some are not. I took 3 shots. The focus is different on all 3 photos with not all being in focus at once. I tried using all 45 focus points and letting the camera decide which was not a whole lot better. However I can shot center focus with a single person and get a great shot. Obviously I do not understand how to control focus.

What am I doing wrong.
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera... (show quote)


If you uploaded your image(s) here, we might be able to give you an informed answer.

Without a photo, we'd just be guessing.

EDIT:

Whoops! Okay, now I see the example you posted.

Yep, it's a depth of field thing. Focus is on the folks in the back row, so the folks in front, closest to you, are out of focus. Partly it's from using f/5.6 and partly it's from using a short telephoto at a close distance. It's not a problem with the lens or the camera.... it's a "user error".

Depth of field is effected by lens focal length... longer focal lengths render shallower depth of field... shorter focal lengths render deeper depth of field.

Depth of field is also effected by lens aperture.... the larger the aperture (largest on your lens is f/2.8) the shallower the depth of field.... the smaller (such as f/11), the deeper the depth of field.

And, depth of field is effected by distance.... the closer you are to the subject, the shallower the depth of field.

If instead of f/5.6 you had used f/11, that would have helped (to still get a good exposure with 2 stop smaller aperture, and not have to use a too-slow shutter speed, you would need to increase ISO to 1600).

If you had somehow focused midway in between the people in the back row and the people in the front row, that would also have helped keep everyone more in focus. This is called "hyperfocal focusing". You can read about hyperfocal distance here https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/hyperfocal-distance.htm and elsewhere on the Internet.

Note: You might wonder why not use an even smaller lens aperture, to increase depth of field more. Well, there's also an optical effect called "diffraction" that occurs at too-small lens apertures. Diffraction "robs" fine detail from images. The smaller the aperture, the stronger the effect. It actually starts to occur with a camera like yours around f/5.6... but it's very slight at first so you can probably comfortably use f/8 and f/11.... maybe even f/16. But your macro lens probably also has f/22 and f/32. I would recommend *not* using those ultra-small apertures. In fact, I'd recommend you do some test shots of a highly detailed, flat subject or "target" (a weathered fence, brick wall, etc.) at various lens apertures and then look them over closely to see what's acceptable to you, in your images. You might not like f/16, either. (Set up on a tripod and be sure to have the flat test shot target parallel with the image sensor in your camera.... so that depth of field doesn't have any effect on the shots.)

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Mar 10, 2020 16:25:39   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
amfoto1 wrote:
If you uploaded your image(s) here, we might be able to give you an informed answer.

Without a photo, we'd just be guessing.

It's probably just a depth of field thing... but who knows!


He did. You just have to read all of the postings to see.

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Mar 10, 2020 16:27:18   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
CHG_CANON wrote:
Thank you for converting and posting. Below is an example of the technical details this file provides. We see a zone AF group is used. Using the 'center' isn't wrong, but coupled with the f/5.6 aperture and the nearness to this 6-person group is where all the settings combined do not result in a pleasing recipe.

Experiment with the external dials on the camera that you'll need to use to move the zone quickly around the frame. See if the camera will make a better 'program auto' decision if told to AF using a group in the lower left on the woman in glasses and light blue. If the camera still 'thinks' f/5.6 is a good aperture, begin to learn and practice with the exposure modes that give you more control.

Finally, do not use AI Focus AF. Although the manual makes this seem ideal, it is actually the worst AF option from Canon EOS. This mode has even been removed from newer EOS-R models. Your best AF drive mode for sharp images is AI Servo, using either a BBF configuration or practicing to have your index finger always half-pressing the shutter and forcing the camera / lens to constantly focus.
Thank you for converting and posting. Below is an ... (show quote)


I agree. AI Focus NO BUENO. Get rid of it. F/8 would probably be fine like I said previously. I'd also use fewer focus points. Why let that many focus points pic what to focus on when you could use 1 and only 1 to focus on the eye of the person YOU choose to have the best focus on.

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Mar 10, 2020 16:29:09   #
Screamin Scott Loc: Marshfield Wi, Baltimore Md, now Dallas Ga
 
I'd have used F8 as well, but I would have stepped back and taken the shot from a bit farther back & cropped in post if needed...

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Mar 11, 2020 06:58:24   #
billnikon Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont
 
authorizeduser wrote:
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera is in P mode with Flash. I have the focus set to use the center 9 focus points. Went to a party and took photos. Had a 3 people standing together and I took the photo. The center photo is sharp and is the right person, however the left person is out of focus. Now I am thinking this is a screwy lens but this phenomenon does not always happen. Sometimes it the other way around. I took a group shot of 6 people. Some are in sharp and in focus and some are not. I took 3 shots. The focus is different on all 3 photos with not all being in focus at once. I tried using all 45 focus points and letting the camera decide which was not a whole lot better. However I can shot center focus with a single person and get a great shot. Obviously I do not understand how to control focus.

What am I doing wrong.
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera... (show quote)


Stop down lens two to three stops, keep folks at the same distance from lens. Continue on grasshopper.

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Mar 11, 2020 10:10:07   #
camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.
 
Understand what depth of field is. While an aperture in your lens of lets say f16 will offer a great depth of field apertures like f4 or below offer a narrow depth of field.
Slight movement of a person while the picture is been taken will be blurred if the shutter speed is rather slow like 1/30 sec. or less.

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Mar 11, 2020 12:04:02   #
via the lens Loc: Northern California, near Yosemite NP
 
authorizeduser wrote:
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera is in P mode with Flash. I have the focus set to use the center 9 focus points. Went to a party and took photos. Had a 3 people standing together and I took the photo. The center photo is sharp and is the right person, however the left person is out of focus. Now I am thinking this is a screwy lens but this phenomenon does not always happen. Sometimes it the other way around. I took a group shot of 6 people. Some are in sharp and in focus and some are not. I took 3 shots. The focus is different on all 3 photos with not all being in focus at once. I tried using all 45 focus points and letting the camera decide which was not a whole lot better. However I can shot center focus with a single person and get a great shot. Obviously I do not understand how to control focus.

What am I doing wrong.
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera... (show quote)


It's a depth of field problem as well as an aperture setting problem. Learning about DOF takes time and practice as does knowing what each aperture setting does. If you lined all of the people up exactly in the same plane across and took that shot at f/2.8, assuming no one moves and all people, even their noses!, are lined up the same than you could get a sharp shot of all of them. The minute someone moves out of that line your DOF has changed and how your lens sees that lineup changes. Shoot with a greater DOF and move around to get the best spot for sharpness. It's often difficult to get people in a group all sharp so be sure to get the people in the front the sharpest and, using an aperture of f/8 or so, the sharpness of the people not in the front will fall off a bit, which would be the way we actually see things in the world. Practice a lot and you'll get better. Wide angle lenses take the sharpest shots close up but may skew the shot if too wide so be careful with that. Maybe a 50mm lens would work good for you for groups of people, you can crop off a bit to bring the group closer in.

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Mar 12, 2020 00:58:29   #
Shoeless_Photographer Loc: Lexington
 
authorizeduser wrote:
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera is in P mode with Flash. I have the focus set to use the center 9 focus points. Went to a party and took photos. Had a 3 people standing together and I took the photo. The center photo is sharp and is the right person, however the left person is out of focus. Now I am thinking this is a screwy lens but this phenomenon does not always happen. Sometimes it the other way around. I took a group shot of 6 people. Some are in sharp and in focus and some are not. I took 3 shots. The focus is different on all 3 photos with not all being in focus at once. I tried using all 45 focus points and letting the camera decide which was not a whole lot better. However I can shot center focus with a single person and get a great shot. Obviously I do not understand how to control focus.

What am I doing wrong.
I am using a Canon 80D with 60mm 2.8 lens. Camera... (show quote)


Definitely depth of field issue. Notice how the little girl is a bit out of focus, and the woman closer to the camera is definitely out of focus. You used f/5.6. In the same scenario the next time, try at least f/8, or better yet f/11. Focus on someone in the middle of the group, too, like the little girl.

Of course, to pull that off, I'd aim for aperture priority and not let the camera decide everything like it does in P mode.

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Mar 12, 2020 12:09:55   #
dsmeltz Loc: Philadelphia
 
authorizeduser wrote:
Here is a sample


At those settings (60mm f/5.6 and I am guessing around 5 or 6 feet away) you have a total DOF of around 5" with only about 2.5" in front of the primary subject. You seem to be focused on the woman in the center back so those in the front are out of focus.

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