Moomoo48 Loc: Boston

I take a lot of pictures of family at ice hockey rinks. 100% of the time Lightroom will help adjust pictures to a presentable level. I shot the attached in a poorly lite rink behind glass with a Nikon D500 and a Nikon AF-S 24-70 mm 1:2.8E lens. As normal I was in shutter priority mode speed in the case of this pix 1/500 and iso 1600.
ISO level is set for automatic.
Can’t figure out what happened and unfortunately I’m going back to the same rink this weekend.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

You need more light. The lens is at the f/2.8 maximum aperture. 1/500 is unnecessarily fast for this slower motion skating. At 1/250 you'd have another stop of light. For when the action is faster, if the light doesn't improve, use a higher ISO or continue to adjust in post-processing. The Exposure Compensation is 0. Try EC +1 to tell the camera to up the AUTO-ISO while leaving the camera in shutter priority. Check your highlight alerts and back-off EC to +2/3 if indicated by the blinkies.

ksmmike

Hello,

I fully admit that I'm only guessing since I only tried to shoot behind glass at a hockey game one time and that was years ago with a film camera. I have shot in many poorly lit gyms over the years however with older and newer camera bodies. As you know, the brightness from the ice can mess with your settings since the meter is likely to meter an average of the overall scene. Your shutter speed of 1/500 is borderline for action as fast as hockey though an image like the one you have displayed is ok. Depending on your camera, your ISO might be as high as I would try to push it, unless you have a Nikon D750 or the 850. They shoot well in low light situations like that one. You can push the ISO higher.

From what I see there, you can easily adjust your exposure maybe a half a stop or a full stop and that alone should make that image look much better. I would also suggest to manually adjust your tint and temp as well. That will take the gray/yellow out of the ice. I don't think you really did anything wrong. It's very difficult to get images like that in poorly lit rinks or gyms without some tweaking in post. It usually comes with a yellow tint even with auto ISO from my experience. Most lights have a red or yellow cast once they are a few years old. Not much you can do unless you use strobes and I'm assuming that's not really an option here. I would try to keep the highest shutter speed possible and if your camera obtains a lot of detail in low light, worry about the exposure in post.

Meaning for a fast action sport, I would think getting the action right is more important than the exposure, if you have to adjust one or the other. If your camera doesn't capture detail in low light, then you might have to bump your ISO higher and take images like that where 1/500 will still keep things in focus. Its all a trade off and try adjusting it as you go. Bottom line, it looks to me that you're not that far off with the image you displayed. I'll bet you can brighten that up pretty easy then do a touch of dodging and burning.

Just my two cents. I'm sure others will have some thoughts, but in reviewing the larger file, it sure looks pretty easy to fix in post. Low lit arenas are not the friend of any photographer :)

Mike

Rich1939 Loc: Pike County Penna.

You said that ISO was set for auto, what are the min/max ISO numbers you have set


PS: correct the color balance and I think you will find the image only needs about 1/3 stop more exposure.

jlocke Loc: Austin, TX

Hockey rinks are notorious for having poor and uneven lighting, unless you are at a professional venue. I take a lot of pictures at my grandson's junior hockey games (NA3HL) and I've been shooting with a D7200 w/80-200 f/2.8 lens. I've been getting good results shooting in Manual mode at f/2.8, 1/1000, and ISO 6400. You might post this over in the "Sports Photography" section. I've gotten some really good advice from some of the folks that hang out over there.

1/1000, f/2.8, ISO 6400

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CurleyB Loc: MAITLAND FL

Were I in your shoes I would start shooting test shots before the game to establish my settings. First order of business would be to check my white balance. You are in a closed environment and for the most part should be able to work within the same settings. After that, I’d shoot a couple in auto and see if that gives me any hints for my settings. Then I would go to manual mode with those numbers and adjust, paying close attention to my histograms. While shooting the real game watch your histograms and, like the earlier guy said make final adjustments with your exposure compensation. (Yes I know, I am an armature and still have to check myself after most shots)

Bob Mevis Loc: Plymouth, Indiana

I have my auto ISO SET to max 3200. I also have a D500.

larryepage Loc: North Texas area

What metering mode were you using? If matrix, the ice probably pulled your exposure down too far. Exposure compensation, as already discussed, would solve your problem. The D500 has a metering mode called "Highlight Weighted Metering," which looks at the entire frame and adjusts to just avoid blown highlights in the brightest spot, wherever that happens to be. I've not used it in this environment, but it might be a solution. You would have to be careful about bright exposed light fixtures, because they could push the exposure too low.

What type of lighting is in the arena? If it's LED fixtures, the color temperature is probably somewhere between 4000K and 5000K, which can be set easily in your D500. If there is a lot of fluorescent lighting, there is usually a strong magenta/green correction that will need to be made (especially if the tubes are "cool white." Sometimes I have seen Auto WB not get that component correct. And color saturation looks like it could be set too low to me. (But I like more saturation than most folks, so test me on that before making any final adjustments.)

Moomoo48 Loc: Boston

Thank you very much I’ll give it a try

Moomoo48 Loc: Boston

Good solid advice thanks
]Hello,

I fully admit that I'm only guessing since I only tried to shoot behind glass at a hockey game one time and that was years ago with a film camera. I have shot in many poorly lit gyms over the years however with older and newer camera bodies. As you know, the brightness from the ice can mess with your settings since the meter is likely to meter an average of the overall scene. Your shutter speed of 1/500 is borderline for action as fast as hockey though an image like the one you have displayed is ok. Depending on your camera, your ISO might be as high as I would try to push it, unless you have a Nikon D750 or the 850. They shoot well in low light situations like that one. You can push the ISO higher.

From what I see there, you can easily adjust your exposure maybe a half a stop or a full stop and that alone should make that image look much better. I would also suggest to manually adjust your tint and temp as well. That will take the gray/yellow out of the ice. I don't think you really did anything wrong. It's very difficult to get images like that in poorly lit rinks or gyms without some tweaking in post. It usually comes with a yellow tint even with auto ISO from my experience. Most lights have a red or yellow cast once they are a few years old. Not much you can do unless you use strobes and I'm assuming that's not really an option here. I would try to keep the highest shutter speed possible and if your camera obtains a lot of detail in low light, worry about the exposure in post.

Meaning for a fast action sport, I would think getting the action right is more important than the exposure, if you have to adjust one or the other. If your camera doesn't capture detail in low light, then you might have to bump your ISO higher and take images like that where 1/500 will still keep things in focus. Its all a trade off and try adjusting it as you go. Bottom line, it looks to me that you're not that far off with the image you displayed. I'll bet you can brighten that up pretty easy then do a touch of dodging and burning.

Just my two cents. I'm sure others will have some thoughts, but in reviewing the larger file, it sure looks pretty easy to fix in post. Low lit arenas are not the friend of any photographer :)

Mike[/quote]

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

It doesn't seem to be poorly lit - though light level may be low. The lighting does appear to be even, which is a good thing. You can take a couple of sample images, using your exposure settings and increasing the ISO manually until you get what you are looking for. Use those settings fore the rest of the game and you will be fine. Or you can fiddle around with auto exposure, auto ISO, exposure compensation, etc. The even lighting provides a perfect setting for using a manual approach.

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

Turn on your camera's Flicker Reduction feature.

The problem is the lights. They are fluorescent or sodium vapor, which cycle on and off rapidly. It's so fast, it isn't apparent to your eyes. But your camera will sure notice. I would guess that some of your images are fine, while others are underexposed like your example. That's because sometimes the lights happen to be "on" when the shutter is open, while other times they're "off".

Before Flicker Reduction, there were two ways to counteract the problem. One was to use a slow shutter speed so that they light would complete a full cycle while the shutter is open. That won't work for sports photos, though. You need a faster shutter speed to stop the action. So with sports photos the only way to counteract it in the past was to take lots and lots of extra shots, because some of them would be ruined with underexposure.

What Flicker Reduction does is detect the cycle of the lights and time the opening of the shutter to coincide with the peak output of the lights. I've been using Canon with the equivalent feature for several years now and it works very well. I see almost no underexposed images "under the lights" now. Before that features, I'd see exposure problems with about half of my images.... and a fairly high percentage were ruined.

The D500 and the D850 are the only Nikon DSLRs I'm aware of that have Flicker Reduction. All current Canon DSLRs have it (Canon calls it "Anti-Flicker"), except for the two most entry-level Rebel T7 (2000D) and EOS 4000D. I don't know about other brand DSLRs or mirrorless cameras.

I've seen Nikon's Flicker Reduction setup a couple different ways. One was simply enabled or disabled. Another example I saw was more complex... It had "off", "50"hz" (European), "60 hz" (N. American) and "Auto Detection" settings. If in N. America, you can use 60 hz, which is the alternating current cycle. If you're in Europe and some other parts of the world, you'll need to use 50 hz. If you're uncertain, just use the Auto Detection mode and the camera will time shutter release itself. (Canon's Anti-Flicker only has enabled/auto or disabled.)

You also might want to set a "Custom White Balance". Your user manual will tell you how. DO NOT use any of the white balance presets. Those are wrong far more often than they are right. Also DON'T set the color temp yourself. In most cases you'll have a difficult time getting close.... plus the color temp is only half the equation (the cyan/yellow axis). You also have to set color tint (the green/magenta axis... which is usually strongly skewed under fluorescent lighting). Auto white balance may work best, because any mixed types of lighting will cause different color temps and tints in different parts of the arena.

One solution is to shoot RAW... then you can adjust white balance after the fact more easily.

Hockey is difficult due to the glass surrounding the rink. Look for as clean a spot as possible and don't use flash (it will reflect off the glass and ruin your shot).

Auto ISO is fine, but it will probably be pretty high, in order to have a fast enough shutter speed to stop action.

Use a large aperture close to the glass. That will both keep the ISO as low as possible, as well as minimize anything on the plexiglass or any scratches. The plexiglass will be like a really poor quality filter in front of your lens, but there's not much you can do about it, unless you can get them to let you shoot from the penalty box or the team's box.

Pistnbroke Loc: UK

leaded glass has a green tinge ...is that a clue

Moomoo48 Loc: Boston

Excellent points thank you

Moomoo48 Loc: Boston

Great information and excellent points I’ll check them out next game thank you