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Copywrite infringement...Now what should I do?
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Aug 27, 2019 00:53:18   #
Jaackil Loc: Massachusetts
 
Gene51 wrote:
I think your information is wrong.

You cannot bring about a copyright infringement suit in Federal Court unless you have a valid, registered copyright. Anyone can put a copyright watermark on the front of an image, on the rear, or even in the metadata if it is an electronic image. It is not proof of anything. Copyright registration allows the suit to enter into the court system.

Registration also allows the owner to sue for statutory damages if the work was registered before the infringement, attorney fees etc.

If the unauthorized seller doesn't have a copyright owner's permission it is reasonable enough to assume permission wasn't granted.

https://copyrightalliance.org/ca_faq_post/copyright-protection-ata/

And this, quoted from US Copyright website:

"Do I have to register with your office to be protected?

No. In general, registration is voluntary. Copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement of a U.S. work. See Circular 1, Copyright Basics, section “Copyright Registration.”


https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html#register

You clearly are no expert in this area and should not give out any advice other than "get a real attorney" on which we both agree.

You also many want to peruse the US Copyright website to correct some of your incorrect perceptions. It can be a real eye-opener.
I think your information is wrong. br br You cann... (show quote)


Gene FYI I am a graduate of an accredited university of law. I was not giving out any advice I was correcting the incorrect statement that there is no recourse if an image is not registered. That is a completely false statement. And while I am no expert in IP I can assure you I know a little more than you think I do but maybe not as much as you think you do. I don’t need to pursue the website, I have read the law itself something I suggest maybe you do. Your Logic is all wrong, just because there is no remedy in federal court for unregistered images does not mean that there is no copyright protection if the images are not registered. That is an awfully big leap to take. You read one thing and assumed another. Further the law actually says there is a limit to damages for unregistered IP. Stating that there is a limit if you read the law is stating that there is protection however it is limited. That limit is either what it would cost to have purchased a license or the gross sales. This is also called the acv or actual cash value which is basicly “loss” Where you are confused is the word damages. In this case damages refers to punishing the offending party above and beyond the owner of the properties loss was. Or if the OP’s business was adversely affected by someone using his images. Only cases that involve business losses (business loss defined as a decrease in business) or a negative impact to the business/individual or punitive damages would end up in federal court anyways. Neither of those apply here.
Again I will state the OP should speak to a lawyer and not listen to the prognosticators who quote websites.

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Aug 27, 2019 01:32:56   #
Kozan Loc: Trenton Tennessee
 
MagicMocha wrote:
No and no, the band and I are on good terms, they did nothing wrong. I do have messages between myself and the band agreeing that they can use my photos. I'm working on a project with them to sell some photos that they will autograph. The image is going to be printed and sold to fans and I and the band have agreed on how much we each get. But all has been done thru emails and phone texting. The news source is trying to sell different size prints without my or the bands permission.


The image you show does not have a valid copyright. You should have something like Copyright, then the copyright symbol, your name, then the year in four digits. Having just your name does not constitute a valid copyright.

I suggest you get a lawyer to send a Cease and Desist letter to the offending party. An official looking letter from a lawyer is usually all it takes.

Good luck.

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Aug 27, 2019 03:36:52   #
catchlight.. Loc: Wisconsin USA- Halden Norway
 
And it goes on and on...

This is an advertisement on a news media board for a photo posted for sale by a promotional company. It was submitted by ether the photographer, or band and looks to be part of an agreement for the submission.

... the legal fees would exceed the value of a print of this unknown local band in less than one hour of consultation.

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Aug 27, 2019 07:26:16   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Jaackil wrote:
Good try! Not sure what law school you went to but the one I went to never used Peta pixel as a reference. You apparently did not read the article and are unfamiliar with the ruling. The case stated in the article is completely different than what the op is asking. It actually has to do with something called fair use doctrine which does not apply in this case. In the article the images were not being sold and as I stated the question of whether there was reasonable knowledge of copyright is important. A photographers name watermarked on the image is enough for a reasonable person to know that the image is the property of the photographer. That did not exsist in the case in the article. However the OP did state his name was on the images.
Furthermore in my post if you bothered to read it my question was to the value of Zenfolios protection. Was it worth and neccesary for $4 a month. Keep in mind the question was to the value of zenfolio monitoring the internet for you then procescuting violations given that on top of the $4 per month they would also take a hefty percentage of any judgements. So basicly you would pay them to chase ambulences for them. Again not applicable to this situation or my comment.
Fact: a photograph does not have to be registered to have copyright protection. Copy right protection under US law is created at the time the image is taken. You said a judge would never rule in your favor if it wasn’t registered Fact courts have awarded damages to photographers for images that were not registered. I will give you an easy one to look up. Tony Northrup won a copy right judgement of $60k for a non registered image.
This is a very easy case. The OP had someone take his images which were watermarked with his name on them and they were selling them without his permission. Maybe you were absent the day they went over this in law school but You do not have the right to take someone else’s intellectual property, (in this case images)and sell it without permission. That is theft and theft is a violation of copyright laws. The Op needs to prove only two things. 1 the images were his. They were watermarked and even selling them with his name on it. 2 that they were not licensed and or the person who was selling them was not granted a license. He does not have to register the photos. The law is on the Op’s Side. However as a practical matter the cost of litigating is most likely going to far exceed what they could potentially recover.
Now the next time you accuse me of being a troll I suggest you get your facts straight first and maybe make sure they apply to the situation at hand. Legal stuff just doesn’t seem to be your thing.
Good try! Not sure what law school you went to bu... (show quote)


Guess details were not emphasized in your course work nor your professional life, whatever that might be .... The infringement and settlement for Northrup occurred in Australia. That's another country, maybe you've heard of it? They have their own currency where AU$60,000 is more like $45,000 USD (in 2017). The Northrups also acknowledge that after all their effort and currency exchange, they pocketed $7,543.48 USD. Everyone else involved, lawyers and middlemen, took more money out of the settlement than the Northrups achieved. Beyond the numerous suggestions our OP waste their own money engaging a lawyer, the similarities of our OP's situation to the Northrup case are mostly entirely false, but I'm sure I've already wasted my time given your apparent export-level of comprehension.

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Aug 27, 2019 08:35:09   #
jonjacobik Loc: Quincy, MA
 
Second Street Media is providing the marketing of you picture. (fine print at the bottom of the page) Their FAQ sheet refers to copyright ownership as requirement to submit a photo. If I were you, I'd start there, with a friendly request indicating that you are the owner of the copyright - and it's your name is identified on the photo and reqest they stop selling it.

I'll bet they will. They have a legitimate business interest in avoiding copyright violation.

Nice work on your part.

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Aug 27, 2019 10:32:26   #
E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada
 
Nowadays we live in a litigious society- basically, it seems that everybody is suing everybody else! Lawsuits can become an expensive, aggravating and protracted affair that ends up with a cost far exceeding the amount of money in question. Of course, one must protect one's interest and principles.

I did not advise the OP to not contact a lawyer or use whatever legal recourse he has at his disposal to receive compensation. I think, he does have a case in that a third party SOLD an image that did not belong to them and where the OP holds intrinsic copyright.

My suggestion was simply to first directly contact the offending party and bill them accordingly. If, however that party refuse to cooperate, then it is time to take legal action. The news agency where this offender is employed may share some responsibility or liability.

I agree that seeking professional services from a lawyer is a prudent idea but the investment in sound legal advice should be more preventative than remedial.

On this forum and elsewhere, photographers frequently complain about theses issues- misuse or abuse of their images, unauthorized sales and publications, and simply not getting paid for their services or usages of their images. If these photographers are doing business where they expect payment, credit lines and other forms of compensation or remuneration for there images, they should consult a lawyer and produce the proper protective contract forms that cover all the eventualities that may occur in the course of doing business. All contracts and agreements should be in writing stating all the terms, conditions and of course, the disposition of the copyright ownership. A lawyer that is familiar with copyright, patent, and intellectual property law will advise on all the technicalities in the jurisdiction in which photographer is operating.

I am not offering this advice as a legal expert but as an experienced business operator. In my commercial photography business, I deal with small businesses, large corporations, government departments and I do photography for many theatrical and entertainment folks. My images end up on CD covers, advertisements, general publicity displays, brochures, posters, lobby cards and are given out to fans with autographs. The law firm I deal with has provided me with the all great protective stipulations to include in all my contacts. I deal with clients, agents, ad agencies, commercial printers, art directors, signage providers, just about everyone who has to reproduce my work with virtually no issues. Occasionally, if someone breaches any of my terms, I can usually settle the issue directly and diplomatically with the client.

It also behooves the photographer to do his or her own research. There are many books on photography and the law. There are organizations such as the ASMP and the Professional Photographer of America that have resources as to pricing and copyright protection.

So...Photographers- familiarize yourselves with the general laws and principles concerning copyright and understand your rights. Create proper protective documentation and have you lawyer verify the validity of your terms and conditions and make certain that you are protected.

There is nothing worse in business that having adversarial relationships with your clients. Even if you are in the right, nasty lawsuits oftentimes generate bad public relations.

What do they say about an an ounce of PREVENTION is worth more than a pound of CURE? Avoid any ambiguity, put your terms and expectations upfront and there will be no unpleasant surprises. If you do launch a legal claim and end up in court, you need all the documentation, signatures and evidence of the violation. Courts seem to take dim view of frivolous lawsuits, inflated claims for damages that don't exist, etc.

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Aug 27, 2019 16:49:01   #
spaceytracey Loc: East Glacier Park, MT
 
Jaackil wrote:
Good try! Not sure what law school you went to but the one I went to never used Peta pixel as a reference. You apparently did not read the article and are unfamiliar with the ruling. The case stated in the article is completely different than what the op is asking. It actually has to do with something called fair use doctrine which does not apply in this case. In the article the images were not being sold and as I stated the question of whether there was reasonable knowledge of copyright is important. A photographers name watermarked on the image is enough for a reasonable person to know that the image is the property of the photographer. That did not exsist in the case in the article. However the OP did state his name was on the images.
Furthermore in my post if you bothered to read it my question was to the value of Zenfolios protection. Was it worth and neccesary for $4 a month. Keep in mind the question was to the value of zenfolio monitoring the internet for you then procescuting violations given that on top of the $4 per month they would also take a hefty percentage of any judgements. So basicly you would pay them to chase ambulences for them. Again not applicable to this situation or my comment.
Fact: a photograph does not have to be registered to have copyright protection. Copy right protection under US law is created at the time the image is taken. You said a judge would never rule in your favor if it wasn’t registered Fact courts have awarded damages to photographers for images that were not registered. I will give you an easy one to look up. Tony Northrup won a copy right judgement of $60k for a non registered image.
This is a very easy case. The OP had someone take his images which were watermarked with his name on them and they were selling them without his permission. Maybe you were absent the day they went over this in law school but You do not have the right to take someone else’s intellectual property, (in this case images)and sell it without permission. That is theft and theft is a violation of copyright laws. The Op needs to prove only two things. 1 the images were his. They were watermarked and even selling them with his name on it. 2 that they were not licensed and or the person who was selling them was not granted a license. He does not have to register the photos. The law is on the Op’s Side. However as a practical matter the cost of litigating is most likely going to far exceed what they could potentially recover.
Now the next time you accuse me of being a troll I suggest you get your facts straight first and maybe make sure they apply to the situation at hand. Legal stuff just doesn’t seem to be your thing.
Good try! Not sure what law school you went to bu... (show quote)


Well said & thank you. I went searching for the process to register my copyright. Holy s**t! seems one must register each individual image, with metadata. That's outrageous! Most photographers have 1000's + images. That's one huge chunk out of one's life to handle such an overwhelming undertaking.

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Aug 27, 2019 17:22:37   #
Shel Loc: Lecanto FL
 
photoman022 wrote:
I'm no copyright lawyer and I never played one on television, the one thing I do know is that I would consult would a copyright lawyer in this case. Unless someone on here is a copyright attorney, all you will get is conjecture.

I do know that if you did not register your photos with the copyright office, then you will, by law, receive limited damages. A good attorney will tell you whether or not your case is worth pursuing monetarily. You can order the offending company to take down your images and cease selling them. Or you could offer them a licensing agreement.

By the way, great photo!
I'm no copyright lawyer and I never played one on ... (show quote)


I have been lead counsel in copyright infringement cases in Federal District courts of about a 1/2 dozen different states. Litigation is very expensive and I repeat my recommendation. Register your copyright and put the infringing party on notice by sending the party a letter identifying your registration number. Hopefully, that will be sufficient to get the infringer to stop or alternatively to pay a royalty.

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Aug 27, 2019 17:32:43   #
Hamltnblue Loc: Springfield PA
 
The damage is done.
Maybe you can take advantage and see if they will post your contact info.
Minus well get some advertising out of it.
You already got the lesson learned.

Also, take note that someone thought your work was good enough to make money.
If you haven’t already, consider adding a page on the band website and sell additional pictures.
When life deals lemons, make lemonade.

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Aug 27, 2019 18:56:03   #
catchlight.. Loc: Wisconsin USA- Halden Norway
 
I left a message for the Band "Lords of 52nd street" (ex Billy Joel) via face book with a screen shot of the original post.

It will be interesting If I get a reply... I would think the Band would step in and repair the damage.

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Aug 29, 2019 23:19:15   #
MDI Mainer
 
I would send the offending party a DMCA take down notice. Easy to do yourself.

Here's a guide, there are many others if you Google DMCA.

https://www.upcounsel.com/dmca-notice

In my experience registration (which is a predicate to litigation) and litigation is simply not economic in the vast majority of cases, and the take down notice suffices to end the infringing acts. Note that registration IS required to seek a remedy in court (federal courts have exclusive jurisdiction over copyright claims), but IS NOT required to secure protection under US copyright law, including the DMCA.

PS DMCA is the Digital Millennium Copyright Act

PPS Copyright law does not require that an image bear the copyright symbol, date and name of the creator in order to be protected, though that is certainly a good practice.

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Aug 30, 2019 02:25:40   #
Shel Loc: Lecanto FL
 
MDI Mainer wrote:
I would send the offending party a DMCA take down notice. Easy to do yourself.

Here's a guide, there are many others if you Google DMCA.

https://www.upcounsel.com/dmca-notice

In my experience registration (which is a predicate to litigation) and litigation is simply not economic in the vast majority of cases, and the take down notice suffices to end the infringing acts. Note that registration IS required to seek a remedy in court (federal courts have exclusive jurisdiction over copyright claims), but IS NOT required to secure protection under US copyright law, including the DMCA.

PS DMCA is the Digital Millennium Copyright Act

PPS Copyright law does not require that an image bear the copyright symbol, date and name of the creator in order to be protected, though that is certainly a good practice.
I would send the offending party a DMCA take down ... (show quote)


Excellent job of providing information. Very accurate, clear, impressive. (Before retiring, I did file prosecute and defend quite a few copyright infringement actions.)

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Aug 30, 2019 11:00:12   #
MDI Mainer
 
Shel wrote:
Excellent job of providing information. Very accurate, clear, impressive. (Before retiring, I did file prosecute and defend quite a few copyright infringement actions.)


Thanks. I practiced local govt law for 25 years, which included a few IP issues. But the real challenge was to distill legal issues to make them clear enough for elected officials

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