Travel to Cuba
Jul 8, 2019 13:03:32 #
Jul 8, 2019 13:06:11 #
Picture Taker wrote:
PS Don't go to Russia, China or any country that is not like us as you won't get interesting pictures. I din't think we can stay on subject for over one and a half pages. The guy is going to Cuba to take pictures I don't think he is going to join the Cuban Army.
I don't understand the venom this group has at times. Be friendly and take another picture.
I don't understand the venom this group has at times. Be friendly and take another picture.
Sorry my friend but this post is not about taking pictures. I have been to Russia and other countries. Wonderful photo opportunities abound in every country on the planet. The thread has evolved to where we are because of the Cuban government being abusive to its people.
Dennis
Jul 8, 2019 13:21:04 #
Jul 8, 2019 13:25:19 #
CWGordon wrote:
Comments as predicted. Dennis, you said I said thi... (show quote)
Perhaps you should check your history of the Obama administration. Obama wanted to open up diplomatic relations with Cuba but Cuba only wanted the money going into Cuba, nothing coming out of Cuba toward the U.S. I know someone here can explain it much better than me but it is true. How many Cubans do you see coming to America to see the sights, visit relatives and so on. For the Castro brothers this was a one way trip, to Cuba.
Dennis
Jul 8, 2019 13:36:12 #
Jul 8, 2019 13:38:29 #
Jul 8, 2019 13:49:10 #
I appreciate your objectiveness, though I will still disagree with your overall position. Any time there are negotiations each side gets some of what they want. As an Attorney, I learned the best deals are never ones where one side or the other gets everything they want. Is it a deal you can live with is often the best deal. As both sides experience the deal changes can be made. You have to start somewhere! I didn’t agree with everything in that deal or any other deals made recently. However, a place to start makes sense to me. I hope that things can improve when both sides better understand the other. If it doesn’t work well, we keep trying. The other side has to give something. It has been my position that Cubans living here can visit family alone was something. What we gave was not really all that much. Again, a start.
I do not have all the answers or even a few of them. I think almost any position, on its’ face can appear hypocritical. Each case must be accomplished by itself, in a vacuum. Weighed must be many factors that allow one case, seemingly the same as others, to be viewed independently. A lawyer will tell you there is no black and white, just shades of gray. Often these situations have no good answer or right answer. It is important to try. Looking at each case on its’ own is very difficult. I am sure that mistrust and distrust cause many otherwise good options to be rejected. I am concerned for our place in the world. I travel a lot and here many differing opinions on our country. Most still have great respect for us. I would hate to lose our allies in favor of nations I do not believe have mutual interests with ours. We can disagree about many things, but this is a great country that is important in the world. I hope we never lose our leadership and trust and respect. I had a bicycle Ferry operator (on the Danube in Germany) say many negative things about where we are going. I was the only cyclist aboard and so had plenty of time to talk and listen. As I was getting off he stopped me, and said “ I want you to know, I believe in America.” I feel the same and am pretty sure you do, too. Let each of us think openly and seriously about the many decisions we face. Most of all let us remember that as Americans, we are more alike than different. Let us each respect the other and those whose opinions differ from our own.
I thank you for your response made just a short while ago. Maybe we all can just get along.
I do not have all the answers or even a few of them. I think almost any position, on its’ face can appear hypocritical. Each case must be accomplished by itself, in a vacuum. Weighed must be many factors that allow one case, seemingly the same as others, to be viewed independently. A lawyer will tell you there is no black and white, just shades of gray. Often these situations have no good answer or right answer. It is important to try. Looking at each case on its’ own is very difficult. I am sure that mistrust and distrust cause many otherwise good options to be rejected. I am concerned for our place in the world. I travel a lot and here many differing opinions on our country. Most still have great respect for us. I would hate to lose our allies in favor of nations I do not believe have mutual interests with ours. We can disagree about many things, but this is a great country that is important in the world. I hope we never lose our leadership and trust and respect. I had a bicycle Ferry operator (on the Danube in Germany) say many negative things about where we are going. I was the only cyclist aboard and so had plenty of time to talk and listen. As I was getting off he stopped me, and said “ I want you to know, I believe in America.” I feel the same and am pretty sure you do, too. Let each of us think openly and seriously about the many decisions we face. Most of all let us remember that as Americans, we are more alike than different. Let us each respect the other and those whose opinions differ from our own.
I thank you for your response made just a short while ago. Maybe we all can just get along.
Jul 8, 2019 13:53:10 #
If Cuba is such a wonderful place to live, why don't you lead by example and move there to live? I am sure we would be more impressed if there were citizen's groups that were all extolling the virtues of a communist dictatorship. Sounds likevyour calling might be to organize them. If they did not cooerate you could always kill them with the governments blessings.
Jul 8, 2019 13:59:45 #
CWGordon wrote:
I appreciate your objectiveness, though I will sti... (show quote)
Thanks for your comments. I also would hope we can find common ground in America and get along as we used to do even on the political scene. But these days with so many Liberal Socialists pushing, sometimes violently, for Socialism in America it doesn't seem possible. We presently have one side of the aisle refusing to work with the President on anything. That just won't work. But hopefully we can keep trying.
Dennis
Jul 8, 2019 14:08:33 #
Architect1776 wrote:
It is pure delusional politics. Of all the nations on earth to select a repressive socialist regime to visit? That is disgusting. Why not help the people of Guatemala or Ecuador or Uruguay?
Take the curtain you keep referring to off your head, and pay attention to WTF is going on on our borders! We are helping them by allowing them to come here illegally and supporting them!
Jul 8, 2019 14:27:06 #
I believe Obama did all he could legally do, including visiting Cuba. I think it is up to congress to remove the remaining resrictions...
“Like so many people in both of our countries,” he said in his televised speech in Havana on March 22, 2016, “my lifetime has spanned a time of isolation between us. The Cuban Revolution took place the same year that my father came to the United States from Kenya. The Bay of Pigs took place the year that I was born. The next year, the entire world held its breath, watching our two countries, as humanity came as close as we ever have to the horror of nuclear war."
“As the decades rolled by, our governments settled into a seemingly endless confrontation, fighting battles through proxies. In a world that remade itself time and again, one constant was the conflict between the United States and Cuba.”
Differences remained, Obama cautioned, and the two countries continued to be divided on their systems of government, their economic models and their ideas about individual rights.
But “I have come here to bury the last remnant of the Cold War in the Americas,” he said. “I have come here to extend the hand of friendship to the Cuban people.”
I haven't heard of the money angle but why would the richest country on earth want or need money from one of the poorest? It's like saying the state of California shouldn't do anything for the homeless and poor because they don't spend money at Disneyland.
“Like so many people in both of our countries,” he said in his televised speech in Havana on March 22, 2016, “my lifetime has spanned a time of isolation between us. The Cuban Revolution took place the same year that my father came to the United States from Kenya. The Bay of Pigs took place the year that I was born. The next year, the entire world held its breath, watching our two countries, as humanity came as close as we ever have to the horror of nuclear war."
“As the decades rolled by, our governments settled into a seemingly endless confrontation, fighting battles through proxies. In a world that remade itself time and again, one constant was the conflict between the United States and Cuba.”
Differences remained, Obama cautioned, and the two countries continued to be divided on their systems of government, their economic models and their ideas about individual rights.
But “I have come here to bury the last remnant of the Cold War in the Americas,” he said. “I have come here to extend the hand of friendship to the Cuban people.”
I haven't heard of the money angle but why would the richest country on earth want or need money from one of the poorest? It's like saying the state of California shouldn't do anything for the homeless and poor because they don't spend money at Disneyland.
dennis2146 wrote:
Perhaps you should check your history of the Obama administration. Obama wanted to open up diplomatic relations with Cuba but Cuba only wanted the money going into Cuba, nothing coming out of Cuba toward the U.S. I know someone here can explain it much better than me but it is true. How many Cubans do you see coming to America to see the sights, visit relatives and so on. For the Castro brothers this was a one way trip, to Cuba.
Dennis
Dennis
Jul 8, 2019 14:30:54 #
The conversation deviates even more. The comments made by the guy who suggested I thought Cuba was a wonderful place and I should move there and kill people came up with a lotta crap based on nothing I wrote. To you, sir, I say your remarks are some of the most stupid remarks I have read anywhere, anytime. You win the prize.
Dennis, I appreciate your efforts to be more reasonable and objective. I respect that. Please note that my political beliefs on what you said are totally opposite yours. I do not wish to argue politics. I know that neither of us, nor likely anyone else, is ever going to change the others beliefs. I am satisfied that you and I were able to tone down the rhetoric. I respect that your opinions are different than mine and that as an American you have the right to have your opinions. I think of all of those Americans, and foreign nations’ soldiers, who fought and gave so much so that all of us sitting at home could feel free to have opinions and the freedom to express them without fear of jail or death. I wish you well.
Dennis, I appreciate your efforts to be more reasonable and objective. I respect that. Please note that my political beliefs on what you said are totally opposite yours. I do not wish to argue politics. I know that neither of us, nor likely anyone else, is ever going to change the others beliefs. I am satisfied that you and I were able to tone down the rhetoric. I respect that your opinions are different than mine and that as an American you have the right to have your opinions. I think of all of those Americans, and foreign nations’ soldiers, who fought and gave so much so that all of us sitting at home could feel free to have opinions and the freedom to express them without fear of jail or death. I wish you well.
Jul 8, 2019 14:33:27 #
Jul 8, 2019 14:33:41 #
Elaine2025
Loc: Seattle, Wa
sueyeisert wrote:
Haven’t been to Cuba and don’t support the government. However when talking about a violent country and killing children and exporting violence. This sounds like you;could be talking about the U.S. Look at our interment camps on the border the reports are horrific. Children dying in our custody. Inhuman living conditions. Hope you are vocal protesting this in our country as you are about Cuba. And I’m not even talking about our history in the area.
How liberally ignorant of you to call them "Internment Camps" at the border. The people in the detention facilities CAN WALK OUT ANY TIME THEM WANT AND GO BACK WHERE THEY CAME FROM. They choose to stay for all the free shit we will give them.
Jul 8, 2019 14:35:24 #
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