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Strange bokeh
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Jun 2, 2019 18:39:35   #
LFingar Loc: Claverack, NY
 
fantom, those branches are much closer to the camera then the bird. Depth of field make them look transparent. Try the same shot at f/22 and see what you get. You can get a similar effect shooting through a chain link fence at a distant object. With a large aperture you can make the fence disappear.

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Jun 2, 2019 19:04:54   #
aellman Loc: Boston MA
 
moosus wrote:
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G and was trying it out on my D7200. Starting with this shot and the following four, which I won't show, there is this strange ripple-like anomaly in the bokeh and it appears in about the same place on the other shots as well. This effect isn't seen in the two shots of the bird before the shot I'm showing, or the next few of the bird perched on a wire farther away and then in the branches of a tree. I don't see the effect anywhere else at all. Should I send the lens back for a replacement or can someone suggest why or how this occurs and maybe I should just chill?
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G... (show quote)


Have never seen anything like that. If Nikon repair is too expensive, check out www.tempecamera.com. They are excellent. (Phoenix area)

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Jun 2, 2019 20:32:06   #
jimdandy
 
jerryc41 wrote:
Or a mini black hole. : )


How could this ever happen with a “Nikon” lens?

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Jun 2, 2019 20:45:33   #
f8lee Loc: New Mexico
 
jimdandy wrote:
How could this ever happen with a “Nikon” lens?


Nikon in quotes - like it's not really a thing? Are you desperately trying to be clever, or are you taking "being a jerk" lessons from ole Timmers there?

If you really haven't figured it out, even the vaunted Nikon can sometimes pass through bad samples of their product (as has every other manufacturer.

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Jun 2, 2019 20:59:51   #
amyinsparta Loc: White county, TN
 
It's the effect of the lighting. Don't dump your lens.

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Jun 2, 2019 22:41:09   #
TomV Loc: Annapolis, Maryland
 
If this was shot at your house it should be easy to replicate.

I have a Sony zoom that exhibits terrible bokeh for an otherwise sharp lens. Branches in the background bloom excessively and can be distracting.


(Download)

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Jun 2, 2019 22:50:20   #
Lou Salamon Loc: Calabash, nc
 
Easy.....it’s simply a portal to another dimension.....this one for the birds to pass through, of course. Be careful not to get too close, or your camera will go to the other side!

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Jun 2, 2019 23:32:12   #
fantom Loc: Colorado
 
LFingar wrote:
fantom, those branches are much closer to the camera then the bird. Depth of field make them look transparent. Try the same shot at f/22 and see what you get. You can get a similar effect shooting through a chain link fence at a distant object. With a large aperture you can make the fence disappear.


Thanks for the reply. I understand what the aperture does and what its capabilities are and use it for these purposes constantly.

Your explanation does an excellent job of explaining what happens but I was looking for an explanation of why that occurs. There is a term for the apparent" bending" of the light within the lens that I cannot remember. If someone knows what the term is I could google it for more info.

I believe it is a phenomena similar to why a Stealth bomber is invisible to radar. I had this explained to me over twenty years ago by some missile/microwave engineers and understood less than half of their explanation. Now twenty years later I recall none of it.

This phenomenon is possibly related to the OP's initial question and understanding what is happening in LAYMAN'S terms may help to resolve the original question. The OP's query is quite interesting but will not keep me up at nite trying to figure it out.
Thanks again for the reply.

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Jun 3, 2019 00:39:22   #
dwmoar Loc: Oregon, Willamette Valley
 
moosus wrote:
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G and was trying it out on my D7200. Starting with this shot and the following four, which I won't show, there is this strange ripple-like anomaly in the bokeh and it appears in about the same place on the other shots as well. This effect isn't seen in the two shots of the bird before the shot I'm showing, or the next few of the bird perched on a wire farther away and then in the branches of a tree. I don't see the effect anywhere else at all. Should I send the lens back for a replacement or can someone suggest why or how this occurs and maybe I should just chill?
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G... (show quote)


Oh no it is a time bubble and the bird is about to enter it to go to the other side.....

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Jun 3, 2019 01:16:17   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
fantom wrote:
........There is a term for the apparent" bending" of the light within the lens......


Diffraction. Sometimes it's a desired effect and sometimes not.

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Jun 3, 2019 05:54:14   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Timmers wrote:
What follows is why so many on the Hog Forum regard me as a jerk. It does not bother me one bit. When one is truly a master of your discipline then one learns to deal with the envious regards from the lesser practitioners in ones field.

The effect is generally in the realms of that category of what you are calling bokeh, but it is merely an effect and not the 'reason' for what you are seeing. There is nothing malfunctioning with your lens that this image is displaying.

Now the boring didactic part of this story/explanation. Everyone has heard of the golden means, also the Fibonacci principle. That Fibonacci principle is attributed to an Italian story about I guy who championed the principle of what is also referred to as the golden means. Essentially the golden means is a FOUNDATION of the active principle that governs the way our world works. The growth, the PATTERN of that growth in the natural world follows this interesting pattern. The way leaves grow on a stem and branch from weeds to giant elm trees, that pattern is followed. It is encoded in the life structure from a single leaf and the spiral of a snails shell. So there is an inherent pattern created by the plants leaves and the pattern you are seeing in this display, be it called bokeh or golden means it is the outcome of the inherent pattern that leaves exhibit as they break up the beams of light flowing through the tree's leaf pattern.

An additional didactic reference for this can be found by looking up a rather unique photographic lens made by Schneider called the Imagon. To achieve the 'soft focus' effects of the Imagon a device is installed in the front of the lens called an 'airy diffusion disk'. This is the part of the Imagon lens that creates effects like those you see in your image sun light through the tree's levees. In some images where a direct light source is shown in the photograph, the airy diffusion disk may show as a cluster of tiny points of light as seen as circles if the lens disk is dialed fully open or as partial crescents if closed down.

I found several images associated with the Imagon lens. The first shows the effect in the Christmas tree lights, especially to the right of the image. The second image shows the extreme effect most call bokeh and are the repeating pattern of diffraction with interference of light waves generated by the shaping pattern by a simple lens. The third images shows the Imagon airy diffusion disk and the light pattern it generates when in use. The last image is of an Imagon lens with it's airy diffusion discs.

To end this, the pattern you are seeing is the natural patterning of sunlight as it passes through leaves that interfere with that light and are creating a 'pattern' that is inherently made up of a pattern that you are seeing based on the golden means. Your natural and biological response to this pattern is built into the biological structure of your own body. Congratulation! You are a living being who for a moment has connected to the natural structure of the world in which you are part! I know, way to Pagan for the Hog! LOL!!!

All the images shown are from the internet, they are not my photographs.
What follows is why so many on the Hog Forum regar... (show quote)


Yeah, you're right.

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Jun 3, 2019 05:58:29   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
jimdandy wrote:
How could this ever happen with a “Nikon” lens?


This is not really a Nikkor lens - it's design was stolen from another company and Nikon slapped it's name on it, believing that if it came in a Nikon box, had Nikon written the lens barrel, and the camera identified it in the metadata as a Nikon lens - people would blindly buy it and defend their purchases to the death if necessary.

I have mostly Nikkor lenses, and tried 3 different copies of this lens over a 3 yr period - once from Nikon's NPS loaner program, and twice from others that had purchased the lens. They were all simply awful.

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Jun 3, 2019 06:01:29   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
moosus wrote:
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G and was trying it out on my D7200. Starting with this shot and the following four, which I won't show, there is this strange ripple-like anomaly in the bokeh and it appears in about the same place on the other shots as well. This effect isn't seen in the two shots of the bird before the shot I'm showing, or the next few of the bird perched on a wire farther away and then in the branches of a tree. I don't see the effect anywhere else at all. Should I send the lens back for a replacement or can someone suggest why or how this occurs and maybe I should just chill?
I recently bought a new Nikon 28-300mm 1:3.5-5.6 G... (show quote)


It's pretty typical for the 28-300, though your specific conditions of aperture, distance to subject and distance between subject and background and between camera and background is probably the worst I've seen. Your lens is not broken, it's just not a great lens.

Bokeh is elusive - and some lenses can show outstanding bokeh at some combinations of distances and mediocre to awful at others.

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52348342
https://photographylife.com/reviews/nikon-28-300mm-vr

If it's new you should be able to return it and get your money back. I would. But the reason is not that it's broken, but that it is just not up to Nikon's standards. That's a lot of money to have to "just chill" over.

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Jun 3, 2019 09:34:25   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
fetzler wrote:
I tink you meant highlights from specular reflections. Of course there always the holy highlights. HI HI



Yes. Though it seems "specular" is not in the UHH spell-checker.

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Jun 3, 2019 09:37:49   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
rook2c4 wrote:
You absolutely nailed it with your explanation.
To simplify the general concept - foreground bokeh pattern interacting with background bokeh pattern, creating a secondary pattern (in this case, the ripple effect).

Unfortunately, there are UHH members who will continue to insist the lens is defective and it needs to be replaced.


I believe I referred to Wave Interference way back in the thread.

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