Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

I suppose it shows everyone who the poor tesla owners are!! Kidding of course, however, I wonder if Tesla have given thought to that, a sort of red mark on an owner to show they did not want to pay the extra for another colour?

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

So, what car maker is charging to keep your seats heated, after the initial free period ends? I'll be sure to never buy a product they make, and I hope others do the same.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

BMW

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Competition forced all cell phone providers to bring down their pricing. In the UK, cell phone service was a fraction of what the providers were charging, in America, many years ago. If you all think back a number of years, you were all prepared to pay that minutes charge to use your phones, but only that, the bloody phone companies have been double charging you all for years, during those minutes' charges and possibly many of you never realized it.

In the UK and Europe, phone carriers were banned from double charging for minutes more than 30 or more years ago. Only the person making a call was allowed to be charged, all incoming calls had to be free. In America, they kept doing it. If you recall, when you received a phone call, you were being charged for the minutes you spoke. When you made a phone call, you were being charged for the minutes that you spoke. Effectively, both parties were being charged at the same time for the same minutes of phone line time being used. What a dirty thing that was, charging both parties for the same call, I can't believe people accepted that, for so long.

I can't remember now but there may have come a time when they changed that in America to only charging the person who made the call, although they may have never done that, and simply phased out the minutes system for phone calls.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Ohhh, I had to sell mine when our daughter grew too long to fit comfortably in the back seat of my 323i. Had to buy an SUV. We have been happy with our Toyota Highlander and Mitsubishi Outlander. Thanks for that info, I'm amazed they are trying that out on customers. I had thought about an X5 but now we shall stick with Toyota.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

If it were the case yes, however, it is not the case, because a new car is not inexpensive.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Just remember though, that I bought mine outright and it still does almost everything I need to do to a photo. I have not spent a penny more on it in all these years, PLUS, I can continue using mine for years to come if I keep the system the way it is right now.

You, on the other hand, will be shut down in a month or two, if you stop paying the monthly ransom. Then what will you do? That is the big difference, along with the total you've paid out, all these years. I would hazard a guess that for most of us on here, we are only using a small part of what Photoshop/LR is capable of and probably would get along fine with the old CS6 for most needs. Thereby saving a ton of money by not renting all those years.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Precisely, and if more people had decided to jump ship when Adobe went Ransom charges, they might have halted that effort. With that said, I knew some insiders at Adobe and the word was that less than 20% of their income came from 80% of their users, so people like you and I, and the rest of us here. It was the large corporate customers which was around 20% of their customer base, that earned Adobe 80% of their profit. They didn't really care about the general user; they knew those large corporate users were the ones they were going to be able to force to keep paying the ransom.

Years later they also tried to raise the monthly charge, and did some test groups in different countries to see what would happen when they began to raise their monthly ransom. They wanted to see what level of increase they could achieve, before the users started to jump ship. They soon saw that it was not going to work for them, so abandoned that idea, for the time being, at least.

For those that remember the start of it all, Adobe was wanting to charge $49.99 a month for their entire suite. However, most did not need the whole suite and were not signing up. They reduced it to $39.99 and still not to many takers, then they changed plans and offer the $10 just for Photoshop and that seemed to work. They were still selling LR outright. Then later, they included it as part of the Photography only package.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Completely agree.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

We were thinking of getting a new vehicle last year and went to a Subaru dealership. Going over the pricing I noticed a $3,500 charge on the total. This was not on the Subaru website, where you could build your own car, so to speak, and then have it delivered to your local dealer to pickup.

I asked the salesman to explain the charge and he gave some cock and bull story about what it was for. In the end I deduced that because the new Subarus were taking many months longer to get from the manufacturer and that people were putting in orders and selling new cars at a few thousand over what they paid, to those who had to have one right now, the dealers were adding a premium charge to every new car purchased, to cash in on this.

This was, in reality, an extra charge to the customer for nothing more than the luxury of being able to get a new vehicle from Subaru. What a con. I told him that the website of Subaru's build your car section, had no such charge showing. He told us that this charge would show up on your final delivery invoice, when you came to pick it up at the dealership, when it arrived.

He reluctantly agreed that this is what the charge really was. I told him we were also looking at Honda and they had no such charge. He said that customers were happy to pay it because there was such a long wait to get certain new Subaru models. I think most customers really did not look at all the added charges, just assuming they were mandatory dealer costs added to all new car purchases.

We told him he could stuff it and please let his supervisor know that and get that back to Subaru corporate office as well. And also to tell them that the $3,500 charge made us decide never to buy a Subaru product and that we were happy to give our money to any other car maker, except Subaru. What a terrible thing to do to customers, gauging them because they were accepting it, knowingly or unknowingly.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Same with Rolls Royce.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Accepting of and wanting are two different meanings. I would suspect that the majority do NOT want it, but they are accepting of it. Not the same thing. Many probably feel they have no option, because they have not bothered to look around and see what has developed, in the last few years.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

Not really, it means that white is included in the price. Other colours are not. So, free as in, no additional cost. That would be the better way of stating it.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

Dealers like to add made-up charges. Buying a Fit, there was a $100 charge for wheel locks. I had them removed. If I had wanted locks, I could have bought them for $10.00.

Lucian Loc: From Wales, living in Ohio

For your needs maybe that is true, but many if not most users did not have to have the latest update and many were happy using their version for many years before feeling a need to upgrade. Therin lies the difference between what your needs are and what it seemed the majority were needing. The majority were not commercial user and an older copy would suffice for their needs for a number of years.