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Exposure Triangle Spreadsheet Updated
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Dec 27, 2023 17:47:27   #
Spirit Vision Photography Loc: Behind a Camera.
 
Timmers wrote:
This is all vary well and to some it is a delight I'm certain of that.

That said, I have been doing photography for 50 years and looking back I read about EV systems and then studied the EV system back about 35 years ago. Sitting at a desk in the evening after dinner I could understand how it worked and I did grasp what it had to offer.

At the same time I was getting deeper into some rather intellectual pursuits. I revisited an earlier idea that was deeply rooted in science, it was a type of intellectual view on all of the scientific method, in fact it is one of the oldest corner stones to influence the our modern scientific views. Vary old and it's name is Occam's Razor, named for a monk named William of Occam from many hundreds of years ago. Occam's razor can be taken in it's most simplified manner to inform us with a rather simply idea. When confronted by two similar ideas (explanations), the one that is less complex is the better (proffered) explanation.

So, I came to a realization throes many years ago, the rule of 16 was a much better tool for exposure that the EV system offered. This is my own personal evaluation. Perhaps it is because I'm dyslexic and find using math or things involving the use of math rather debilitating when my real purpose was to be creative in my work as a photographic artist. It may just be that I had livid in the practical world of the everyday and I was shown the face of KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid). Or perhaps it just comes from watching too much popular culture in film form, that devil Clint Eastwood's portrayal of Dirty Harry movies where like the San Francisco Version of an avenging flatermouse, he spoke truth to the world with "A man must know his limitations", minus the 357 Magnum canon he toted. I must have simplicity so as not to be distracted from my main effort and goal, to create important and meaning full creative views with a camera.

So, the Sunny 16 rule was good enough for the past greats like Ansel Adams, Ed Weston, Imogene Cunningham and Weegee, so it should be just as useful to a new generation of image makers.

Another thing, I've been doing images for a life time. I have taught photography in it's most basic manner and have been vary good at it. I use the old term, the sunny 16 rule. I never discuss nor bother with the new stupid 'exposure triangle', what triangle? The two parts are: f stops and shutter speed, that is all. Occam's Razor again or is you like Sgt. Rock, 'Nuff Said!'.
This is all vary well and to some it is a delight ... (show quote)



Is the Exposure Triangle some newfangled thing? I've been shooting since the mid 70's, and it's only recently that I keep hearing about it. As long as you know the relationship between aperture and f/stop, you're good to go. :-)

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Dec 27, 2023 17:52:24   #
srt101fan
 
EJMcD wrote:
For all:

YOU DO YOU I'LL DO ME, EVERYONE CAN BE RIGHT.


Words of wisdom from Mount Olympus....🤔

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Dec 27, 2023 18:10:57   #
srt101fan
 
User ID wrote:
Your offer of simple facts will not enlighten the true believers. Theyre immunized against fact.


Not a problem of facts. It's just too many people strutting and puffing about the poor old misnamed triangle. The critics are pole vaulting over mouse turds.

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Dec 27, 2023 18:45:00   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
User ID wrote:
A thorough edumacation, followed by a zillion years in multiple aspects of the bidnez. Thaz the short summary, and is all you get. I know you want detailed credentials, but youre not really entitled to them. Plus, Im arrogant and unobliging as a rule. That is all.


Actually, that wasn’t what I was asking, just clarification concerning your comment about the zone system. As for your “credentials”, I could care less - your few posted images tell us all we need to know about the quality of your work. But even if it were remarkable, it wouldn’t compensate for being just another old, mean spirited, snarky jerk with nothing to offer but juvenile sarcasm and silly childish grammer.

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Dec 27, 2023 18:46:59   #
selmslie Loc: Fernandina Beach, FL, USA
 
srt101fan wrote:
Not a problem of facts. It's just too many people strutting and puffing about the poor old misnamed triangle. The critics are pole vaulting over mouse turds.

Most of the puffing is about the name Brian Peterson gave it. Forget about the word "exposure" that everyone is hung up on. Call it anything you like, maybe just "Fred". The name is not important.

It's the concept that is important. The spreadsheet already covers everything.

There are actually six variables at play. Shutter speed(1) and aperture(2) define exposure value(3). Then we have filter factor(4) and ISO(5) defining light value(6). That's not a triangle, more like Chinese checkerboard.

The spreadsheet lets you make one of four of those (1, 2, 5, or 6) the final dependent variable.

If someone can't follow this, just leave the camera on Auto.

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Dec 27, 2023 18:47:50   #
User ID
 
Spirit Vision Photography wrote:
Is the Exposure Triangle some newfangled thing? I've been shooting since the mid 70's, and it's only recently that I keep hearing about it. As long as you know the relationship between aperture and f/stop, you're good to go. :-)

Are you citing UHH or the real world ?
Huge difference.

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Dec 27, 2023 18:49:01   #
User ID
 
TriX wrote:
Actually, that wasn’t what I was asking, just clarification concerning your comment about the zone system. As for your “credentials”, I could care less - your few posted images tell us all we need to know about the quality of your work. But even if it were remarkable, it wouldn’t compensate for being just another old, mean spirited, snarky jerk with nothing to offer but juvenile sarcasm and silly childish grammer.

Exactly whats meant by "youre not entitled".

Trixie really does think he actually knows some schidt. His ideas about photography always make my late shoot outa my nose.
Trixie really does think he actually knows some sc...
(Download)

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Dec 27, 2023 18:53:57   #
Hip Coyote
 
selmslie wrote:
Most of the puffing is about the name Brian Peterson gave it. Forget about the word "exposure" that everyone is hung up on. Call it anything you like, maybe just "Fred". The name is not important.

It's the concept that is important. The spreadsheet already covers everything.

There are actually six variables at play. Shutter speed(1) and aperture(2) define exposure value(3). Then we have filter factor(4) and ISO(5) defining light value(6). That's not a triangle, more like Chinese checkerboard.

The spreadsheet lets you make one of four of those (1, 2, 5, or 6) the final dependent variable.

If someone can't follow this, just leave the camera on Auto.
Most of the puffing is about the name Brian Peters... (show quote)


I guess I am stuck for life on auto (I shoot Aperture mostly and sometimes Manual but now I am not sure I'm doing things correctly.) The ISO, SS and Aperture work ok in my limited hard drive head. I do ok on occasion. Kinda like a guy playing golf who shoots par on a hole once in a while.

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Dec 27, 2023 19:02:02   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
lamiaceae wrote:
Yes, I completely understand the relationship between ISO (ASA), Shutter Speed, Aperture, and their number series and why. I've known about the Ć’-numbers being multiples of the square root of 2 or approximately 1.414 and why since shortly after starting to do photography in 1978. The Din exposure system is a German Log-based film speed system of x+3 "DIN" = 2x "ASA". ISO uses both numbers. I learned how to use Exposure meters because I do think in "Stops". I know there are Light Meters that measure Lux, Ft-Candles and all sorts of weird units. On a daily basis I don't need to do more than a little math in my head as my digital cameras have extremely accurate metering systems. Film is harder to work with. I usually shoot close-ups and Macro with full manual Exposure and Focus. For many other uses I will use AE & AF. I thought I would play around with your Spread-sheet for fun and to occasionally check my calculations. As I said before, I think I have it figured out now with you further explanations.
Yes, I completely understand the relationship betw... (show quote)


Thanks for the history!

---

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Dec 27, 2023 20:31:24   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
Why is it discussions on the UHH can not stay polite? And right after Christmas to top it off. Santa must have given out a lot of lumps of coal this year. So much rude, insulting, opinionated, disrespectful, and downright incorrect and nonsensical talk and language. The trolls are no longer under the bridges.

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Dec 27, 2023 21:05:50   #
User ID
 
lamiaceae wrote:
Why is it discussions on the UHH can not stay polite? And right after Christmas to top it off. Santa must have given out a lot of lumps of coal this year. So much rude, insulting, opinionated, disrespectful, and downright incorrect and nonsensical talk and language. The trolls are no longer under the bridges.


(Download)

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Dec 27, 2023 21:39:07   #
BebuLamar
 
Anyone has a copy of the "Understanding Exposure" book by Bryan Peterson third edition or earlier? I would like to make sure that he did write "The Exposure Triangle" because I searched the entire fourth edition and found no mention of it, only the "Photographic Triangle".

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Dec 27, 2023 22:25:51   #
User ID
 
srt101fan wrote:
Not a problem of facts. It's just too many people strutting and puffing about the poor old misnamed triangle. The critics are pole vaulting over mouse turds.

Verrrrry pitcheresk !

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Dec 28, 2023 03:05:39   #
imagextrordinair Loc: Halden, Norway
 
Simply choose ISO based on the brightness of your scene and accept noise as an editable variable, motion blur a possible deterrent, and your depth of focus a predetermined choice. Aperture and shutter speed become a strait forward balancing act. "Auto ISO" is proof of that...

It's not a threesome, it's a traditional marriage

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Dec 28, 2023 06:42:42   #
EJMcD
 
srt101fan wrote:
Words of wisdom from Mount Olympus....🤔


Thanks so much

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