Archival Inks (Page 2): This is the sad fact of life in the inkjet printing market: You Get What You Pay For. Precision Colors is mentioned here often.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

Imageandart wrote:

I'm using a Canon Pixma Pro 100 printer and due to the cost of original Canon ink cartridges CLI42 I've been buying third party suppliers on Ebay. The sellers all have very high positive responses in the tens of thousands. What I've noticed lately is that there has been fading on some of the prints that were not very old (less than a year). They were kept in regular room light and not in direct sunlight. Can any of you recommend a third party supplier whose inks do not fade and are archival?

This is the sad fact of life in the inkjet printing market: You Get What You Pay For.

Precision Colors is mentioned here often.

https://www.precisioncolors.com/PC42.html

BUT BEFORE YOU ORDER:

https://www.aardenburg-imaging.com has studies of both Precision Colors and Canon inks that show the scientifically tested differences in light fading between the two. Their tests result in "megalux hours" ratings, a measure of how much light the print can stand to receive before perceptively annoying fading. Full details are in reports on their site.

To make a (very) long report short, these third party inks fade about ten times faster than the Canon OEM CLI-42 ink set! Go sign up and read the report. I did. It's very well illustrated, analyzed, and documented. It's free, but it's copyrighted, so I can't post it here.

YES, OEM inks are expensive. But if you want long-lasting prints, they're the best you can get. If you're just making prints for immediate use, and they'll be discarded soon, as in a proofing scenario or for temporary displays, they can be a good value. But if you want them to last and tag you as someone who cares about quality, think about using OEM inks.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

Ink shouldn't fade that quickly. Of course, how the picture is stored makes a big difference.

If I had the inclination, I'd do a test of different ink prints stored in different ways - darkness, room light, sunlight, etc. I'm sure that's available somewhere online. Of course, it wouldn't be possible with third party inks because I'm sure their formulas often change. Where is a guy buying the ink he puts into his cartridges?

bsprague Loc: Lacey, WA, USA

No one yet has pointed out that the Canon Pixma Pro-100 uses dye inks. Dye inks don't have near the archival properties of pigment inks that are used in printers one step up from the Pro-100. (Was it the Pro-10?)

My thought is that my prints from my Pro-100 are for me to hang on my wall for awhile, maybe a few months. I give a few away, but not many.

If I ever decided that my work was worthy of selling to others, it would require the longevity of pigment inks. It does not seem ethical to expect money for something I know has a shorter life.

In today's printer choices for 13" prints, using pigment ink, it means a Canon imagePROGRAF PRO-300 with a current price of $900! The Canon Pro-100 discussed in this topic has been replaced by the Canon PIXMA PRO-200 using dye inks for "only" $600. Epson has similar choices at similar price points.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

jerryc41 wrote:

Ink shouldn't fade that quickly. Of course, how the picture is stored makes a big difference.

If I had the inclination, I'd do a test of different ink prints stored in different ways - darkness, room light, sunlight, etc. I'm sure that's available somewhere online. Of course, it wouldn't be possible with third party inks because I'm sure their formulas often change. Where is a guy buying the ink he puts into his cartridges?

Jerry, that's what Aardenburg and Wilhelm Research do... They test printer-paper-ink combinations for lightfastness. Their rating systems are entirely different, but they do give us a good idea of print longevity under lighting conditions and dark storage conditions.

So many factors affect longevity... UV and IR exposure, visible spectrum exposure, chemically contaminated atmosphere exposure, acidic or acid-free mounting materials, framing under glass before or after "outgassing" during the first 48 hours after printing, storage temperature and humidity, and type of album sleeves or pages used.

That said, the two main testing services mentioned above DO test various combinations under controlled conditions, so their results are comparable (Aardenburg to Aardenburg or Wilhelm to Wilhelm, not across those companies).

one_eyed_pete Loc: Colonie NY

Imageandart wrote:

I'm using a Canon Pixma Pro 100 printer and due to the cost of original Canon ink cartridges CLI42 I've been buying third party suppliers on Ebay. The sellers all have very high positive responses in the tens of thousands. What I've noticed lately is that there has been fading on some of the prints that were not very old (less than a year). They were kept in regular room light and not in direct sunlight. Can any of you recommend a third party supplier whose inks do not fade and are archival?

I think you got some really bad ink. Perhaps a fox got in the hen house. I suggest you check out JToolman you tube videos on printing and ink longevity. As others have said the best you can get is OEM and if you sell your prints your customers deserve the best. For personal use there are several quality alternatives (also mentioned by others) that will out live you. Air contaminants can accelerate fading. If the air in your enviornment causes fading of quality ink that fast You may need to move.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

bsprague wrote:

No one yet has pointed out that the Canon Pixma Pro-100 uses dye inks. Dye inks don't have near the archival properties of pigment inks...

I think the name gives a hint of its longevity - "dye."

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

bsprague wrote:

No one yet has pointed out that the Canon Pixma Pr... (show quote)

If you deal with high end pro labs and service bureaus who offer inkjet prints, or "giclee" prints, they are most likely pigment prints. The finest photographers, labs, art museum gift shops, and boutique service bureaus all use pigment inks for their prints. OEM pigment inks generally last about twice as long as the same companies' best dye inks.

The 30,000+ year old cave art drawings found by archeologists are all made with natural pigments. Of course, caves are cool and dark, so...

yssirk123 Loc: New Jersey

SuperflyTNT wrote:

And where is your data to back up that assertion?

Not my data, but you can search for either Wilhelm Research or Aardenburg Imaging (or both). Also stop by Luminous Landscape's printing forum for good discussions by very knowledgeable people.

Hope that helps.

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

unlucky2 wrote:

I print with a pro 100 and I use precision color "signature series" inks on Canon paper without a fading problem. I spray my prints with Hahnemuhle protective spray ($20 + for 400ml can). Refilling the cl42 cartridges is easy, fast and very economical. I think the key is the Hahnemuhle spray.

hrblaine

Imageandart wrote:

I'm using a Canon Pixma Pro 100 printer and due to the cost of original Canon ink cartridges CLI42 I've been buying third party suppliers on Ebay. The sellers all have very high positive responses in the tens of thousands. What I've noticed lately is that there has been fading on some of the prints that were not very old (less than a year). They were kept in regular room light and not in direct sunlight. Can any of you recommend a third party supplier whose inks do not fade and are archival?

Back when I was printing, I used Cone inks and they worked for me. Harry

Nigel7 Loc: Worcestershire. UK.

This is all very interesting. Here in the UK I have just started sourcing my ink from OctoInkjet (octoinkjet.co.uk). Having read the above links re Precision Inks, I suspect the 2 companies are connected.

My printer is the Canon Pixma Pro 9500 Mk2 which uses pigment inks. These will always last much longer than dye inks and would be the best choice if you are selling your prints. However Canon dye ink should last way better than Imageandarts' examples above. It has to be said that pigment inks tend to lack the saturation of dye inks if you want really strong stand out colours on high gloss paper. However for more arty images on art papers etc. they beat dye ink IMHO.

I researched numerous compatible ink suppliers in the UK and with the exception of OctoInkjet all the others had several different suppliers of their ink and could not guarantee that ink ordered next month would be the same as that available now. In other words, quality aside, it would be impossible to calibrate my printer and then rely on consistent results following cartridge changes.

Too early yet to review OctoInkjet but discussions with them were very encouraging and continuity of the same inks is guaranteed.

bwilliams

You could try spraying the prints with uv protecting lacquer.

Goldyrock

unlucky2 wrote:

I print with a pro 100 and I use precision color "signature series" inks on Canon paper without a fading problem. I spray my prints with Hahnemuhle protective spray ($20 + for 400ml can). Refilling the cl42 cartridges is easy, fast and very economical. I think the key is the Hahnemuhle spray.

It's the spray. Depending on the paper, you might need to spray both sides. An area with high UV, and Ozone will fade faster. Pigment inks have more longevity than dye based inks. Precision Color SE Inks are probably the best 3rd party inks, but are still subject to fading. A good UV spray always helps. Cheap 3rd party inks like LD will fade faster than PC SE inks. I refill with PC SE inks. If I am going to sell anything, I use OEM inks on papers with no OBA'S

Drbobcameraguy Loc: Eaton Ohio

Imageandart wrote:

I'm using a Canon Pixma Pro 100 printer and due to the cost of original Canon ink cartridges CLI42 I've been buying third party suppliers on Ebay. The sellers all have very high positive responses in the tens of thousands. What I've noticed lately is that there has been fading on some of the prints that were not very old (less than a year). They were kept in regular room light and not in direct sunlight. Can any of you recommend a third party supplier whose inks do not fade and are archival?

Precision Color. Best in the business of third party inks.