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Is mirrorless really better thand DSLR? (modern versions only)
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Apr 3, 2021 17:16:40   #
Ysarex
 
larryepage wrote:
Shorter flange distance as a benefit is actually one of the most bogus arguments in favor of the new designs.

Complete BS. It's a very old design and well proven. Leica M series cameras have always been mirrorless and their superior wide angle lenses aren't a secret. The SLR arrived and created a problem for wide angle lenses. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angénieux_retrofocus The solution results in lenses with more distortion.

I'm very happy with my Fuji XF 14mm f/2.8 for my mirrorless Fuji X cameras.
Here's a lab test of that lens from Imaging Resource: https://www.imaging-resource.com/lenses/fujinon/xf-14mm-f2.8-r/review/
And here's the results for distortion:
"Distortion
Remarkably, there is no distortion at all for images shot with the 14mm ƒ/2.8 R."

That's 90 degree angle of view on an APS-C camera. I'll withdraw my BS remark just as soon as you post a link to any lab test for a DSLR FX or DX camera lens with a similar 90 degree angle of view and 0 distortion.

Apr 3, 2021 17:20:54   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
We all should hope to leave our footprints on the shores of a mirrorless land.

Apr 3, 2021 17:25:31   #
JohnR Loc: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
 
rmalarz wrote:
Camera considerations are accurate shutter speed, accurate ISO settings, good glass, and accurate aperture settings. Weight has nothing to do with the quality of an initial captured image.

If one wants to take weight into consideration, the more weight the less the camera is influenced by small internal or external vibration. Though, it's actually mass that is involved in this part.

The EVF of mirrorless cameras would be a distraction, to me. I prefer to see what's happening in real-time.
--Bob
Camera considerations are accurate shutter speed, ... (show quote)


I do so agree however I find I like the EVF on my Olympus better than the optical viewfinder on my Nikon. I particularly like the level display as it helps me stop the sea running out of the side Cheers JohnR

 
 
Apr 3, 2021 17:31:40   #
JohnR Loc: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
 
CHG_CANON wrote:
You said 'modern' versions, and yet, you mention a mirrorless battery issue of the past. All the major players have resolved this issue in all releases in the past 2+ years, soon eventually to be the distance past.


I get over 1000 shots out of a battery in my Nikon. Barely 200 out of my Olympus. (Reminds me to put its battery on charge!) Anyway doesn't affect image quality one way or the other - I never suggested it would!

Apr 3, 2021 17:36:00   #
JohnR Loc: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
 
Ysarex wrote:
Complete BS. It's a very old design and well proven. Leica M series cameras have always been mirrorless and their superior wide angle lenses aren't a secret. The SLR arrived and created a problem for wide angle lenses. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angénieux_retrofocus The solution results in lenses with more distortion.

I'm very happy with my Fuji XF 14mm f/2.8 for my mirrorless Fuji X cameras.
Here's a lab test of that lens from Imaging Resource: https://www.imaging-resource.com/lenses/fujinon/xf-14mm-f2.8-r/review/
And here's the results for distortion:
"Distortion
Remarkably, there is no distortion at all for images shot with the 14mm ƒ/2.8 R."

That's 90 degree angle of view on an APS-C camera. I'll withdraw my BS remark just as soon as you post a link to any lab test for a DSLR FX or DX camera lens with a similar 90 degree angle of view and 0 distortion.
Complete BS. It's a very old design and well prove... (show quote)


Mmm all well and good but are you able to see the difference on your monitor????? Fortunate you are indeed if you can afford such luxuries There is actually a real world out here where lab tests are completely ineffective. WYSIWYG is the only real test.

Apr 3, 2021 18:00:50   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
JohnR wrote:
I do so agree however I find I like the EVF on my Olympus better than the optical viewfinder on my Nikon. I particularly like the level display as it helps me stop the sea running out of the side Cheers JohnR


My Sony a7II, not renowned for a great battery, can fill a 32GB card at about 1000 RAW images on one battery charge, if I'm focused on shooting and not image review. The EOS R5s are reporting battery life better than EOS DSLRs, some experiencing 10s of thousands images before exhausting the battery.

So, it depends on how you use the mirrorless and probably the model and maybe the brand.

Apr 3, 2021 18:33:49   #
Ysarex
 
JohnR wrote:
Mmm all well and good but are you able to see the difference on your monitor?????

Absolutely -- very visible on my monitor or in a print. I take a lot of photos of architecture and architectural detail in close quarters. You'd be surprised how much of that can be found in the real world.
JohnR wrote:
Fortunate you are indeed if you can afford such luxuries
Fortunate indeed that the better wide lenses for mirrorless cameras actually cost less that their inferior counterparts for DSLRs as I noted replying to Longshadow: https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-691831-1.html#12131634
JohnR wrote:
There is actually a real world out here where lab tests are completely ineffective. WYSIWYG is the only real test.

 
 
Apr 3, 2021 18:41:06   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Who can have a positive attitude without a mirrorless camera?

Apr 3, 2021 19:11:25   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA
 
CHG_CANON wrote:
Who can have a positive attitude without a mirrorless camera?

Like, I'm positive I don't need a mirrorless camera?

Apr 3, 2021 19:12:13   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Longshadow wrote:
Like, I'm positive I don't need a mirrorless camera?


LOL

Apr 3, 2021 19:15:08   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
JohnR wrote:
Just a little food for thought

Looking completely dispassionately which is better photographically – for image quality?

First the significant differences (Comparing APS-C and full frame only):

DSLR bodies are bigger and heavier than mirrorless bodies.
DSLRs take many more photos per battery charge than mirrorless
DSLRs have mirrors :)
Mirrorless don’t have mirrors :) :)
Mmmm – can’t think of any other significant differences.

Second important similarities:

Both have sensors
Both have viewfinders
Both have LCDs
Both have lenses
Mmmm – can’t think of any other important similarities.

So how does any of this make a mirrorless better than a DSLR?? Well IMHO it doesn’t, it can’t and it won’t as far as image quality of photographs is concerned. Excluding the photographers skill levels and the many personal preferences involved, the image quality of a photograph is directly proportional to the quality of the lens and the sensor.
Mirrorless do not have better sensors than DSLRs. Mirrorless do not have better lenses than DSLRs. So photographs from mirrrorless cannot have better image quality than those from DSLRs.
Just a little food for thought br br Looking comp... (show quote)


So you listed the similarities and ignored the differences ... Great Troll!


---

 
 
Apr 3, 2021 19:30:23   #
BebuLamar
 
JohnR wrote:
Just a little food for thought

Looking completely dispassionately which is better photographically – for image quality?

First the significant differences (Comparing APS-C and full frame only):

DSLR bodies are bigger and heavier than mirrorless bodies.
DSLRs take many more photos per battery charge than mirrorless
DSLRs have mirrors :)
Mirrorless don’t have mirrors :) :)
Mmmm – can’t think of any other significant differences.

Second important similarities:

Both have sensors
Both have viewfinders
Both have LCDs
Both have lenses
Mmmm – can’t think of any other important similarities.

So how does any of this make a mirrorless better than a DSLR?? Well IMHO it doesn’t, it can’t and it won’t as far as image quality of photographs is concerned. Excluding the photographers skill levels and the many personal preferences involved, the image quality of a photograph is directly proportional to the quality of the lens and the sensor.
Mirrorless do not have better sensors than DSLRs. Mirrorless do not have better lenses than DSLRs. So photographs from mirrrorless cannot have better image quality than those from DSLRs.
Just a little food for thought br br Looking comp... (show quote)


It's you! If you think it's better then it is.
I don't want a mirrorless but it's me!

Apr 3, 2021 19:32:00   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Those who don't want a mirrorless camera don't want to succeed.

Apr 3, 2021 19:32:13   #
JohnR Loc: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
 
Bill_de wrote:
So you listed the similarities and ignored the differences ... Great Troll!


---


I listed both differences and similarities - no ignorance involved. I did not suggest either as being better or worse according to their differences and similarities but was actually trying to show that one was not better than the other as far as photographic image quality is concerned whether having a mirror or not.

Apr 3, 2021 19:33:19   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Very shortly now, we'll have trouble remembering cameras ever were burdened by mirrors.

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