CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

Success is most often achieved by those who don't admire their failures.

RWR Loc: La Mesa, CA

Thanks. Perhaps because no pictures were posted?

RWR Loc: La Mesa, CA

And the title is now misleading.

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

If you read the opening paragraph carefully, there should be no doubt (despite current evidence to the contrary) which section of UHH the OP is discussing. Now that you are aware that Admin will move topics to the appropriate section - per his definition and guidelines - you will be better prepared 😊

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

The only real mistake is the one from which we learn nothing.

GerryER Loc: Virginia USA

You really are a philosopher!!

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

I can't understand why there is so much confusion about finding the topics and section folks are interested in and the ones they wish to participate in. This forum is extremely easy to naigate- all the sections and topics are clearly, either directly listed on the home page or via the "all sections" click on. Each section is well described. The sections that are subscribed to will appear on the member's home page.

Everything that exists in cyberspace has trolls, hacks, and troublemakers. Here it is comparatively minimal. There are criminals out there that hack into vital sties committing fraud, invasion of privacy, identity theft, tampering with health and medical records, taxation records, and worse. All this can impact of people's lives and well being. Around here the troublemakers are just an occasional pain in the backside so just ignore them!

If some folks would just learn to use the "reply with quote" feature and, check off the "Store Original" box when they are seeking technical assistance with a posted image, and actually post an image, rather than only writing about an issue or a technical flaw, the information would flow easier and more concisely- one can only hope!

Personally, I don't really mind certain threads going "off-topic"- it's part of any normal conversation. Sometimes this leads to more interesting technical and aesthetic discussions. What does annoy me is long, lengthy, protracted arguments about forum procedures that completely overpower the original topic. It's disheartening when a perfect decent thread about technique, equipment, or emotional content of images, ends up in or about "the Attic".

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

You are what your images say you are.

RWR Loc: La Mesa, CA

Not to make a big deal of it, but if I hadn’t read it, I wouldn’t have commented. Let’s quit while we’re ahead! (Or at least before we get any farther behind).

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

Scruples Loc: Brooklyn, New York

I learned early on, the camera does 1% of the work. The remaining 99% is done by the nut in the viewfinder. Criticism is harsh and meant to discourage learning. Critique is much gentler and meant to improve. There is a big difference. When I offer critique I will always apologize if the person was offended. I was taught that way was gentler.

Happy Shooting!

GerryER Loc: Virginia USA

Unfortunately, today, younger people are taught that anything-everything they do is "awesome," and therefore, anything goes. This is supposedly to build their self-esteem. This leads to a very unteachable spirit not conducive to critique or criticism. When you do critique their work, into their "safe rooms" they go. Of course, this isn't universally true, but true enough to see shoddy results in almost any field today, and photography is no different. I am not a professional photographer, but have experienced some pretty poor work done by so called professionals. I was taught that you need to get the technical aspects down first, and then you can explore the artistic realm. JMO.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

With all due respect, I am not a big fan of generalizations. Not every young person has the same personality and attitude, nor does every middle-aged, or senior person share exactly the same attitude. I have taught and trained many young and aspiring professional photographers and found that most of them were eager to learn, craved knowledge of the craft, and saught and accepted constructive criticism.

I am an old man with a gray beard so I refer to my students and trainees as "kids". Not every kid is the same- each has their unique personality- even if they conform to popular speech patterns. Rather than negatively criticize all the young folks as a group and paint the majority with the same brush, I think it behooves the more mature folks and teachers to educate and inspire them and in some cases, simply set them straight. Some kids don't need too much coaxing to learn the basics and hone their skills, other need to be gently reminded that everything they do in photograhy or life is not necessarily "awesome" and some even require a "boot camp" approach.

I always start off their training by explaing that I can not TEACH them talent- I can only help them develop their own. I further explain the need for basic technical skills in terms they can relate to. If the were studying musical performance, they can't just pick up a musical instrument or sit down at a piano and become an instant virtuoso. First, they would need to do the exercises, the etudes, learn the sales and all the theory, and practice their heads off! If you want to become a professional athlete, you can be naturally strong, well-coordinated and agile but you need to learn and the technical aspects of the game, build your body, do the diet, and again- practice your head off! In all cases LISTEN to your teachers and coaches and heed their criticisms. Photography is an art, a science, and a complement of skill sets. The technicalities need to be mastered before the art can emerge. The kids get it!

Every generation has its lingo. "Awesome" has replaced may older or perhaps obsolete hackneyed expressions like "cool, crazy, the bee's knees, the cat's meow, perfect, and Huba-Huba"! I can say to my students, "excise me I have to go to the bathroom" and someone is gonna say "awesome"! Well- at my age, that can be an awesome experience"! If you haven't got a sense of humor- don't attempt to teach- you'll end up suffering a nervous breakdown!

Anyway- who's teaching all theses youn folks that everyth the do is "awesome"? Their parents, their teachers, society? I don't see it! Today's kids are smart and savvy and the don't respond well to dogma and demands to unquestionng obedience or sycophantic behavior. They respond well to logic and common sense.

As for the "so-called professionals", who's calling them professionals? If the are continuously producing dissapointg and unsatisfactory work, they are hacks and quacks passing themselves off as real pros. Just because a hack accepts money for their labor does not cannote true professionalism. Consumers need to be educatiod too!

As a kid, I alwas aspired to a career in commercial photography. At 14-years old, I wanted to take courses at the New York Institute of Photograhy- I almost made it but sadly, my mom became ill, this depleted my family's finances and that year, mom passed away causing much sadness and disruption in the family dynamic. So...I managed to secure an after-school, evening, weekend and summer job as "gofer" in a local photographic studio. I was janitor, messenger, maker of passport pictures and darkroom swabie. I assisted at weddings. I did as much photography as I was allowed to do and sought out critiques from the staff photographers. I gotta admit, theses guys used me, the rookie kid- well at least my pictures- as a punching bag- but this was my kinda free early photographic education- and I got paid as well! I was extremely fortunate in that theses old seasoned pros took out time to tech me the ropes and "break me in" to the business. Later on, I did enjoy the advantages of a formal education but the values I leaned from those old toughguys could not be found in any classroom. Yes, the made fun of my tight bluegens and t-shirts, and I quickly learn all the current photo slang; pulling prints, souping negatives and passing proofs" and every weekend I "cleaned up- dressed up, and wore a suit to weddings!

GerryER Loc: Virginia USA

I think we said the same thing, but I did it with fewer words. I'm an old man, too, but I shave regularly :)