Power supply (Page 2): I have an APC UPS on each computer, and I just ordered one for the TV. During the recent storm, the power flickered on and off, and the TV wouldn't work. Leaving...

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

I have an APC UPS on each computer, and I just ordered one for the TV. During the recent storm, the power flickered on and off, and the TV wouldn't work. Leaving it unplugged overnight got it working again.

docerz

Something to consider----Some new PSUs require a pure sine wave to function properly when on battery.
There are many on the market...here is one...CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD PFC Sinewave UPS System, 1500VA/1000W, 12 Outlets, AVR, Mini Tower

cdayton

docerz wrote:

Something to consider----Some new PSUs require a pure sine wave to function properly when on battery.
There are many on the market...here is one...CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD PFC Sinewave UPS System, 1500VA/1000W, 12 Outlets, AVR, Mini Tower

Thanks. I'll check this out.

larryepage Loc: North Texas area

Gene51 wrote:

Make sure you get something that has the amperage to let your computer run long enough to shut it down. For most people a 650 VA UPS is not going to get it done. I would go higher. I would also remind you that a UPS or SPS has a battery that needs to be replaced over time - usually about every three years. You want to schedule replacement rather than wait until it fails. Towards the end of life the amount of time it will run your gear without a power source diminishes greatly.

You can figure out what you need in VoltAmps - VA, by taking the wattage load and multiplying it by 1.6. Not all backup power is a UPS. The least expensive is at SPS - or standby power supply - which has a switchover speed of around 40 ms. These are cheap and dirty solutions - and most of the time the switchover speed is short enough.

If your power is noisy and dirty and fluctuates, you'll want a line-interactive UPS. These cost more but can protect against brownouts and momentary voltage drops which could damage equipment.

The most expensive is the online UPS - which is actually a battery used to run your equipment and uses the grid to top off the battery - so essentially it is running off the battery 100% of the time, and no switchover occurs. Your equipment runs off exceptionally clean pure DC power inverted to AC with zero interaction with the line voltage at the wall outlet.

You'll also probably want to think about a good surge protector. Most cheap UPS and SPS devices have awful surge protection. I have had a surge blow through an APC UPS causing a small fire, and damaging a printer and computer that was connected to it. Something similar also happened to a friend, but in his case it was some seriously expensive high end audio gear - though in both our cases it could have cost us our homes had we not been home to use a fire extinguisher. When I opened the UPS up, the multi-stage MOV had completely fried. MOV (Metal Oxide Varistor) based devices are cheap to make, but wear out over time, and when they fail it can be quite spectacular - but you'll never know when that will happen.

I recommend, without hesitation, ZeroSurge out of Frenchtown, NJ. They were the first to use an inductive-type surge protector which, by design, is not sacrificial in nature. There are a few others on the market now, but they were the first.

https://zerosurge.com/plug-in-products-solutions/

They have other products but I think this may be the least expensive.

Make sure you get something that has the amperage ... (show quote)

This is an excellent analysis. There is one more important factor that gets overlooked almost 100% of the time. We learned about it the hard way at the plant where I worked before retiring.

Most UPS units use lead-acid batteries. As Gene indicated, these batteries are generally good for somewhere around three or four years. The gel electrolyte gradually changes and dries out, allowing the battery plates to short together and kill the cells. This is just a natural part of the gel cel life cycle.

What is not generally made very clear, even in the documentation we received with our UPS units, is that all gel cells are not created equal, and all applications for them are not equal. In particular, the current drain on the batteries in a UPC is very high...generally about 8-10 amps. (The higher capacity UPSs have higher voltage batteries to prevent the current from having to be even higher.) The ordinary gel cell batteries available for sale at common outlets cannot and will not provide this level of current for an extended time, and the UPS is very likely to simply shut down if operated anywhere near their intended capacity. So when it comes time to replace the batteries, it is important to select the special high-current batteries made for UPS and other high load applications. DO NOT just buy the cheapest battery that will fit in the space left by the old one.

We usually ordered replacement batteries from APC, because it was easier and because the price was about the same as for proper batteries bought anywhere else. We were occasionally able to find high-output gel cells at Batteries Plus, but they saved us only a few dollars and generally failed after only a couple of years.

My suggestion is that you put a sticker on your UPS with the date you received it, and that you update that sticker each time you replace the battery. Battery replacement needs to be done proactively. A final thought...most higher-end APC units have a very annoying audible alarm that will sound when the battery fails. Some of them offer an interface to your computer that will trigger software to automatically shut it down when power fails.

cdayton

larryepage wrote:

This is an excellent analysis. There is one more important factor that gets overlooked almost 100% of the time. We learned about it the hard way at the plant where I worked before retiring.

Most UPS units use lead-acid batteries. As Gene indicated, these batteries are generally god for somewhere around three or four years. The gel electrolyte gradually changes and dries out, allowing the battery plates to short together and kill the cells. This is just a natural part of the gel cel life cycle.

What is not generally made very clear, even in the documentation we received with our UPS units, is that all gel cells are not created equal, and all applications for them are not equal. In particular, the current drain on the batteries in a UPC is very high...generally about 8-10 amps. (The higher capacity UPSs have higher voltage batteries to prevent the current from having to be even higher.) The ordinary gel cell batteries available for sale at common outlets cannot and will not provide this level of current, and the UPS is very likely to simply shut down if operated anywhere near their intended capacity. So when it comes time to replace the batteries, it is important to select the special high-current batteries made for UPS and other high load applications. DO NOT just buy the cheapest battery that will fit in the space left by the old one.

We usually ordered replacement batteries from APC, because it was easier and because the price was about the same as for proper batteries bought anywhere else. We were occasionally able to find high-output gel cells at Batteries Plus, but they saved us only a few dollars and generally failed after only a couple of years.

My suggestion is that you put a sticker on your UPS with the date you received it, and that you update that sticker each time you replace the battery. Battery replacement needs to be done proactively. A final thought...most higher-end APC units have a very annoying audible alarm that will sound when the battery fails. Some of them offer an interface to your computer that will trigger software to automatically shut it down when power fails.

This is an excellent analysis. There is one more ... (show quote)

Great advice. Thanks.

foggypreacher Loc: Dickinson, Texas

cdayton wrote:

Have construction in my area and today, again, there was a momentary interruption to the electrical service that messed up my desktop computer work. Does anyone have a recommendation for a power supply to remedy the problem? Thanks for any input.

A UPS has save my bacon on my computer equipment, TV and such equipment and if you have on on your router/modem you will have cable/internet for as long as the UPS's battery lasts.

ecurb Loc: Metro Chicago Area

cdayton wrote:

Thanks. I think I’ll order an APC.

Then consider a standby generator tied to an automatic transfer switch. Get one big enough to power your whole house.

cdayton

ecurb wrote:

Then consider a standby generator tied to an automatic transfer switch. Get one big enough to power your whole house.

I’ve priced that out in the past - about $6K for our house, as I recall.

larryepage Loc: North Texas area

cdayton wrote:

I’ve priced that out in the past - about $6K for our house, as I recall.

And the OP would still need a UPS...it takes a number of seconds for the generator to start up and for power to transfer over. Data would still probably be lost during the process.

PHRubin Loc: Nashville TN USA

Not all models have a connector for the computer to see it needs to shut down due to line power interruption.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

cdayton wrote:

Have construction in my area and today, again, there was a momentary interruption to the electrical service that messed up my desktop computer work. Does anyone have a recommendation for a power supply to remedy the problem? Thanks for any input.

Look at all the power requirements specification labels on the backs of your equipment, or look up the power requirements online. (Most devices have a little plate with model #, serial #, power line frequency, voltage input range, and wattage.)

Add up the total wattage of all critical items (computer, one monitor, external drives, cable modem, router...). Then add 50% to 100% more to that figure. That's the SIZE of the UPS (uninterruptible power supply) that you need.

Be advised that these things can be heavy, so it may be to your advantage to buy them at a local office supply or computer store. They often contain (usually replaceable) lead-acid gel cell batteries. The better ones have surge protectors for a cable modem and Ethernet network.

Then look at these:

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=apc+ups&crid=2NZL5UKJGPO8H&sprefix=APC+%2Caps%2C710&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_4

Ollieboy

Gene51 wrote:

Make sure you get something that has the amperage to let your computer run long enough to shut it down. For most people a 650 VA UPS is not going to get it done. I would go higher. I would also remind you that a UPS or SPS has a battery that needs to be replaced over time - usually about every three years. You want to schedule replacement rather than wait until it fails. Towards the end of life the amount of time it will run your gear without a power source diminishes greatly.

You can figure out what you need in VoltAmps - VA, by taking the wattage load and multiplying it by 1.6. Not all backup power is a UPS. The least expensive is at SPS - or standby power supply - which has a switchover speed of around 40 ms. These are cheap and dirty solutions - and most of the time the switchover speed is short enough.

If your power is noisy and dirty and fluctuates, you'll want a line-interactive UPS. These cost more but can protect against brownouts and momentary voltage drops which could damage equipment.

The most expensive is the online UPS - which is actually a battery used to run your equipment and uses the grid to top off the battery - so essentially it is running off the battery 100% of the time, and no switchover occurs. Your equipment runs off exceptionally clean pure DC power inverted to AC with zero interaction with the line voltage at the wall outlet.

You'll also probably want to think about a good surge protector. Most cheap UPS and SPS devices have awful surge protection. I have had a surge blow through an APC UPS causing a small fire, and damaging a printer and computer that was connected to it. Something similar also happened to a friend, but in his case it was some seriously expensive high end audio gear - though in both our cases it could have cost us our homes had we not been home to use a fire extinguisher. When I opened the UPS up, the multi-stage MOV had completely fried. MOV (Metal Oxide Varistor) based devices are cheap to make, but wear out over time, and when they fail it can be quite spectacular - but you'll never know when that will happen.

I recommend, without hesitation, ZeroSurge out of Frenchtown, NJ. They were the first to use an inductive-type surge protector which, by design, is not sacrificial in nature. There are a few others on the market now, but they were the first.

https://zerosurge.com/plug-in-products-solutions/

They have other products but I think this may be the least expensive.

Make sure you get something that has the amperage ... (show quote)

Cyber power 1350 with 810 wh is what I have. About $200. Works great. It has all the bells and whistles too with power conditioning and sine wave correction.

cahale Loc: San Angelo, TX

cdayton wrote:

Have construction in my area and today, again, there was a momentary interruption to the electrical service that messed up my desktop computer work. Does anyone have a recommendation for a power supply to remedy the problem? Thanks for any input.

And now we come to the second advantage of laptops. Power interruption doesn't affect them immediately. The first advantage is that you can take them with you. Other than these 2, I don't know any other. A UPS will give you a bit of time to shutdown, but not really continue operation. Also, something which doesn't help you now, but after every critical element of work on a computer take a moment to save it.