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How Important Is Subject Matter in Photography?
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May 20, 2020 13:01:48   #
photoman022 Loc: Manchester CT USA
 
Few of my photos "tell a story" but people seem to appreciate them. By the way, I also haven't "found my voice" in photography, even though I've been doing photography since 1972.

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May 20, 2020 13:06:23   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
JohnSwanda wrote:
Then how can subject be "everything" if a great subject can result in a bad photo?


I just looked at my reply. Nowhere do I see any words from my computer saying, subject is everything. I wonder where you get that notion when I never said it.

Actually my friend I was somewhat AGREEING with you in that poor focus and so on makes a photo not so hot no matter the subject. How did you miss that?

Is it possible you are taking my opinions, completely different from yours in The Attic and transferring them to actual photography? I don't know about you but most of us here are able to separate political opinion from our opinions regarding photography and every other subject discussed by mankind. Just the other day I expressed an opinion of excellence for a photograph taken by one of the most vile and crude people ever to grace The Attic. But my opinion of photographs taken are completely different. Her photos or at least this one was excellent.

If that is your problem then you really do have a problem. Nothing I or anyone other than a qualified psychiatrist can help you.

Dennis

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May 20, 2020 13:10:45   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
FotoHog wrote:
Does a photo need to tell a story? The obvious answer is “no it does not need to, but it does so anyway".

What I find interesting about the posted images is that they raise the equally important question “does a photographer have to be an artist first?” My answer to that is: not necessarily, it depends entirely on what kind of photographer he/she is.

Visual art always has to be created, whereas pushing the release button on a camera does not require that. What the camera does is give you the image of a subject that is already there for the taking. Art comes into play when the subject has to be artfully created and staged beforehand. A photographic image of that subject can then be interpreted as to what the artist was thinking or the statement he/she intended to make, similar to musing about what the poet had in mind when reading his poetry.

I realize this could be fodder for endless debating that I do not wish to pursue at length. All I want to say is that the OP managed to skillfully combine art and photography. . . .
Does a photo need to tell a story? The obvious ans... (show quote)


I am with you. There is not a story in every photograph nor does there need to be in my opinion. I go to the Grand Canyon to photograph its excellent rock formations and viewpoints formed over millions of years of erosion from wind and water. I don't see a story but I do see and try to record as best I can the beauty God gave us to admire.

A man and his granddaughter walking on a beach does tell a story, maybe many stories. But just the beach without the man and his granddaughter, not to me. Still pretty but not much of a story.

Dennis

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May 20, 2020 13:22:03   #
cambriaman Loc: Central CA Coast
 
A photograph needs purpose. Otherwise, just close your eyes, spina round, click the shutter and pray!

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May 20, 2020 13:35:57   #
JohnSwanda Loc: San Francisco
 
dennis2146 wrote:
I just looked at my reply. Nowhere do I see any words from my computer saying, subject is everything. I wonder where you get that notion when I never said it.

Actually my friend I was somewhat AGREEING with you in that poor focus and so on makes a photo not so hot no matter the subject. How did you miss that?

Is it possible you are taking my opinions, completely different from yours in The Attic and transferring them to actual photography? I don't know about you but most of us here are able to separate political opinion from our opinions regarding photography and every other subject discussed by mankind. Just the other day I expressed an opinion of excellence for a photograph taken by one of the most vile and crude people ever to grace The Attic. But my opinion of photographs taken are completely different. Her photos or at least this one was excellent.

If that is your problem then you really do have a problem. Nothing I or anyone other than a qualified psychiatrist can help you.

Dennis
I just looked at my reply. Nowhere do I see any w... (show quote)


My first reply was to Nicholas DeSciose who wrote: "Subject matter is everything". I replied "Even if it's poorly composed, poorly lighted, unsharp?" You replied, "Well then it is just a bad photo isn't it?" I replied, "Then how can subject be "everything" if a great subject can result in a bad photo?" I assumed you had seen my first reply to Nicholas.

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May 20, 2020 13:39:39   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
joer wrote:
I heard this story about Joe McNally. Early in his career he ask his editor "How can I make my images more interesting?" The editor replied " Put yourself in front of more interesting subjects."

As for your images...


I'm fond of that quote too, Joe. But I think it may narrowly apply to landscapes. Not even sure if it applies to nature in general although a good looking bird or critter is a great thing for a subject one could point his camera at the ground anywhere if he were shooting macro.

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May 20, 2020 13:46:10   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
Earnest Botello wrote:
In my opinion a good photographer can make simple subject look good, a great photographer can make a sow's ear into a silk purse, the subject matter is everything.


I made a silk purse out of a sow's ear once. It is still not a great shot.


(Download)

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May 20, 2020 13:50:40   #
Picture Taker Loc: Michigan Thumb
 
creativity matters

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May 20, 2020 13:57:09   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
BuckeyeBilly wrote:
Does anyone remember a photo from just a few years back that was of just a particular section of sky and water, no land, nothing else? It was bought for about 1 million dollars, I think. I didn't get it then and still don't, but it was important enough to the buyer.


As Jerry already showed, This picture by Andreas Gursky, Rhine, sold for $4.3 Million. It's very big, 7 or 8 feet long and very sharp up close, every blade of grass. Not my favorite composition but apparently very modern art looking. Compare to the Kenneth Noland painting from the sixties. Art prefigures photography I guess.


(Download)


(Download)

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May 20, 2020 14:01:48   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
E.L.. Shapiro wrote:
It's psychological! My day job is in commercial photography and corporate portraiture. The clients want everything to look pristine, smooth, elegant, new, appetizing/yummy, perfect, beautiful! Ahhhhhhhhhugh #**%#%^&^**... it's enough to drive a photographer crazy! So...in my off-duty photography time, it's off to the junkyards, second-hand stores, demolition sites, and yes- sometimes an enticing garbage can or dumpster in search of "props"!

Some photographers take on what I like to call a "false ethic"...every photograph must make a profound statement, a photojournalistic record of a historical event, every image must be "relevant", the shutter must be released at the "decisive moment"...! OK- all good but not all the time. A pile of rusty junk is a static subject- it ain't gonna run away. move around, or escape- you can take all day to arrange it and you can release the shutter any time you feel like it!

Talk about "still-life"- this stuff is dead, buried, and dug up! If there is a creative or artistic element or challenge it is to render texture, creat dimensionality, practice composition, and convincing you significant other to allow you to bring this stuff into your home and actually store it there.

I am big-time into slow oxidation (rust), dilapidated wood, parts of old farming implements, and corroded car parts- those are some of my favorites.

Denoise- my foot! Grain, noise adds to the texture! Topaz textures are cool- all little gunge never hurts!

Just remember- wash your hands and don't touch your face, especially before you disinfect some of this stuff.

What with the lockdown, isolation, quarantine, etc. now is the time to check out the cellar, attic, barn, or messy closet and find some stuff and go to it!

Well- it's 8:45- time for me to go into the studio and shoot some fancy jewelry:sm25.
It's psychological! My day job is in commercial p... (show quote)


I think what you said was my goal, "to render texture, creat dimensionality, practice composition". Then, I wondered if that would be enough to hold interest as a photograph.

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May 20, 2020 14:06:41   #
JohnSwanda Loc: San Francisco
 
Fotoartist wrote:
I think this may be the picture you mentioned. Andreas Gursky, Rhine, $4.3 Million. It's very big, 7 or 8 feet long and very sharp up close, every blade of grass. Big layer cake, not my favorite composition but apparently very modern art looking.


I haven't seen a print of that photo, but I saw a print of another Gursky photo in person, and it was amazing up close. I'm not sure it still justifies the price, but I wish people who think it is ridiculous based on seeing it online wouldn't make a judgement without actually seeing it.

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May 20, 2020 14:08:27   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
BuckeyeBilly wrote:
Why was photography invented in the first place? Why was the Hubble spacecraft invented? Of course the subject matters. If you happen to see the most vivid, stunningly colorful sunset EVER, do you want to capture it in black and white or for that matter just let it slip on by? You could but what would really be the point? Anyone with a camera is out there to record that one particular moment in time that captures the attention and imagination. Subjects in life, really, hold the key to everything--what car you want, what spouse you want, where you want to go on vacation, what you want to eat, looking in a mirror to see if all that parsley is gone from your teeth or you blew out all the boogers. Subjects are ALL important and EVERYTHING has its own story to tell
Why was photography invented in the first place? W... (show quote)


I agree. Subject is very important. And the objects I shot, I had collected for some reason because they were interesting to me. I will add one more thought. The Idea is important too. Don't know if that is part of the subject, or not.

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May 20, 2020 14:16:36   #
sirlensalot Loc: Arizona
 
IMO - subject matter is photography.

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May 20, 2020 14:25:29   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
MrMophoto wrote:
IMHO; This all depends on the photographers intent. Why was the photograph taken in the first place? If it was to tell a story or communicate, than that's paramount and composition may be secondary If it's strictly to convey or make a statement or feeling etc. then composition is very important.
I tell my students that the job of the photographer (or any artist) is to keep the viewer interested in their image. If you you look at an image for a few seconds and move on the photographer didn't do a good job. If you spend time looking at a single image, exploring all the subtleties and nuances then the photographer (or artist) did a good job. I believe composition is one vehicle to achieve the latter.
IMHO; This all depends on the photographers intent... (show quote)


I think composition moves you around the picture and if you don't have a subject you can't move around. So composition cannot stand purely by itself like a pure subject can. In only a few cases can I think of pictures that are dominated by composition. Check out these shots by Arnold Newman.


(Download)


(Download)

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May 20, 2020 14:30:36   #
Bill P
 
JohnSwanda wrote:
Even if it's poorly composed, poorly lighted, unsharp?


By whose standards? There are no immutable laws of those things in photography, or any other art.

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