photoman022 Loc: Manchester CT USA

Watching television lately I've noticed that a lot of "photographers" in programs and movies shoot on camera flash with the flash elevated about 45 degrees, the way you would bounce flash off of a ceiling. My question is have any of you ever shot this way outdoors and does it work?

I'm curious because I would think that the light would go up at 45 degrees, but wouldn't come down because there is nothing to bounce off of. The other explanation I can think of is that a "kiss of light" would go forward (toward the subject) and make a difference in the photo. The times I shoot an external, on camera flash I reduce the flash to about 1/4 power and make sure that the subject is away from any background that would catch the shadow. Other times I will use a white foam bouncer that I made; the foam bouncer wraps around 3 sides of the flash and the top of the foam faces forward toward the subject (like a Rogue Flash Bouncer, but cheaper).

The other explanation I can think of is that the flashes popping would interfere with the cameras filming the program or movie (like you see all the flashes going off at the Super Bowl).

As a note. When outdoors shooting people, I normally use off camera flash with shoot through umbrellas.

rb61 Loc: Maple Grove, MN

Way back when I taught beginning photography I usually threw in a joke question on the final. "Bounce flash will work outdoor if there are enough clouds T or F"

Every year someone got this wrong...

Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States

BlueMorel Loc: Southwest Michigan

Seems to me the "photographers" in the movies are more interested in making the flash visible to us, not necessarily for effective photos. Hopefully no one is copying their technique to learn photography!

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

speters Loc: Grangeville/Idaho

I have bounced it off my hand to give it a bit of warmth, but to bounce it in "the air" does not make any sense and is just a waste of time ( and battery power)!

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

A lot of "photographers" bounce flash.

But many professional photographers avoid it like the plague or use a very controlled form of bounce.

Bounce flash is highly unpredictable. And one of the secrets of successful photography is predictability. Bounce depends upon whatever surface it's being reflected off of, as well as the distance to that surface. The light has to travel much farther, so a lot of the flash's power is simply wasted. There's also light absorbed more or less by different surfaces and colors. Plus any color of the bounce surface will tint the subjects.

Outdoors, bounce is impossible. There's no ceiling to bounce the light! So anyone using that technique might as well just leave the flash in their camera bag, because it's doing them no good what-so-ever.

I suspect some people doing that are actually using a small card on the flash to create a catchlight.

Outdoors, in particular, I use fill flash and I always use it directly. It's dialed back by about 1-2/3 stops, so is very unnoticeably. It simply opens up shadows and puts a catchlight in subjects' eyes.

With shorter focal lengths I often use a diffuser of some sort. Sometimes it's just the wide angle diffuser built into my flashes. Other times it's something else placed in front of the flash. For extreme close-up work I will use plain white gauze wrapped over the flash head, so that it doesn't overpower the subject. I can control the amount of diffusion by adding or subtracting layers of gauze.

When I'm using a telephoto... 200mm or longer on APS-C or 300mm or longer on full frame... I often also use a Flash Extender. It's a Fresnel lens that's positioned in front of the flash to concentrate it's output and increase it's reach.

There are a variety of light modifiers available that can be used if direct flash is too harsh. Some of those are used to diffuse the flash... such as your shoot-through umbrellas. There are also flash attachments that serve as a bounce surface, allowing the flash to be tilted upward, but minimizing waste and giving consistent exposures and neutral color effects. Those are what I mean by "controlled bounce".

catchlight.. Loc: Wisconsin USA- Halden Norway

The bounce card may be pulled out ad you didn't notice it...

Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina

Flash duration is usually too short to be easily captured in video. Yes, you would likely need some sort of modifier to direct the flash where you want it...unless you have fog or some very low clouds perhaps.

sb Loc: Florida's East Coast

Depends on how big your flash is! Some of the huge strobes developed by Doc Edgerton for night-time aerial reconnaissance in WWII were pretty large!

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

Although it not like bouncing the light off a white ceiling, I suspect the flash will add some light to the scene, and maybe that's all they want.

CO

That 45 degree angle would work if there's a bounce card there. See the lower diagram. Your technique of firing the flash into umbrellas is the best technique.

khorinek

I use flash outdoors, mostly as fill flash to counter shadows and the flash is turned down 1/3 to 2/3 stop. But I don't bounce the flash with a flash card outdoors I doubt the flash would do much good if turned at 45 degrees even with a flash card out. I do use a strobe outdoors.

bobmcculloch Loc: NYC, NY

TV is not real life!

CO

I do that a lot also for fill flash. I usually have about -1 to -1.7 flash compensation dialed in