John Howard Loc: SW Florida and Blue Ridge Mountains of NC.

I was following an earlier thread on this topic but it seems to have been deleted. Anyway, I was wondering about the best sequence of steps to sharpen/denoise when you have had to modestly push the ISO to say, 2000 or 3200. I anticipate being in some locations where tripods are not permitted, which means hand holding is a must (or balancing on a rail). For interiors with a wide angle lens, say 16-35 F4, at 20mm, and F5.6, the hyperlocal point of just over 20 feet will give you a DoF of just over 2 feet to infinity. F5.6 is the sweet spot for that lens I believe. But if the interior is dim natural light, and you push the ISO a bit so you are at at least 1/50 sec, how do you deal with the noise and sharpening without making the situation worse. Do you address the noise first, so you don't sharpen that? Or do you address the sharpening first? Is LR good enough or do you go to PS or Topaz or some other special software? Happy to learn from all of you, thanks. FYI shooting either a D850 or Z7, and surprised that both show a lot of color noise.

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

That topic was posted to main discussion:
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-599887-1.html

You commented in it, so the link should be in your watched topics list at the top of any page. However, always happy to see you in PP Forum. Hopefully, anyone who missed the other topic can assist you here. I personally never sharpen anything (see a new discussion on softer stories here)

R.G. Loc: Scotland

I suspect that in this day and age, AI may be producing the best results. I don't have any of the current AI offerings so I can't comment. However, there may be quite a few of us who want to know how to get the best out of what we've already got. I have Lr and I'll give a quick rundown on my MO. Much depends on how bad the noise is, but since you mention high ISOs I'll describe what I'd do in an extreme situation.

Too much softness can spoil a shot and high ISOs can soften an image so avoiding sharpening a noisy image won't be the answer that most are looking for. My answer is to use generous amounts of masking which keeps the sharpening edge-based. For a VERY noisy image I'd turn the masking up full to 100, but in less extreme situations I'd go up to about 95 or so. Even for normal sharpening I'll turn the masking up (holding Alt down to see what's happening) until the smooth areas aren't included, since there's nothing to be gained from sharpening stuff that doesn't need it, and it will aggravate any noise that's there (most noticeable in the smooth areas). For moderate amounts of noise I find that masking values round about 80-85 work well.

With the masking turned up high you can apply quite a lot of sharpening, even with a noisy image. However, undesirable side-effects can sneak in without you realising it, so sharpening should always be added while viewing a representative portion at 100%. Provided you're keeping an eye on things, values of sharpening over 100 are a possibility if your masking is set high, even with a noisy image. But for VERY noisy images the sharpening should be kept to somewhere around the 50 mark. If all that you manage to achieve is some enhancing of the main edges, that will be a significant improvement.

For normal denoise I would apply about 5-10 and then lower the Details slider from 100 until the softness was starting to have a detrimental effect (usually about 80-85 or so). For a very noisy image I would try Denoise values above 20, but only tentatively, experimenting to find the lowest value that will kill the worst of the noise, and keeping the Details value above 85.

Contrast will aggravate noise, and for a very noisy image you should use the luminosity sliders (Shadows, Highlights etc) to get as much contrast as you can before using the Contrast slider. The worst culprit for aggravating noise is the Shadows slider so it might be a good idea to avoid lifting the shadows in a noisy image, or at least do it selectively via the Adjustments brush.

For extreme situations the objective is to find the optimum balance. Don't aim for removing noise completely and don't aim for producing perfect sharpness. With a noisy image you'll have to forgo globally sharpening fine textures because doing so would aggravate the noise too much. However, it may be possible to apply sharpening to just the areas that you want using the Adjustments brush, and likewise with denoise. The Denoise slider in the Adjustments brush works on very fine noise, and for coarser noise such as grain, going negative (i.e. left) with the Sharpen slider will work for that (to be used with moderation).

kenievans Loc: Dallas

Terrific info RG. Thanks for sharing.

R.G. Loc: Scotland

You're welcome.

RichardTaylor Loc: Sydney, Australia

For myself
Remove any sharpening LR does when images are imported.
After basic adjustments I dowsize the image first, as most of my pics are for web or smaller print (10x8") use. This hides a lot of faults.
In PS if the image is noisy I will create a new layer, and use Topaz Denoise to remove a lot (if not all) of noise. By use of a layer mask I may make this noise reduction selective.
Always the final step is sharpening.

Delderby Loc: Derby UK

With an ISO at 3200, you could be looking to reduce noise without any sharpening - which is what I think you are saying. Depending on the amount of data in the pic will depend on whether to sharpen or not - I guess it could be try it and see.

abc1234 Loc: Elk Grove Village, Illinois

I leave others to comment on the post-processing. What surprises me is that the OP is using two very high-end cameras and thinks they are noisy. I would like to see examples and know exactly what he expects. Could he be overly critical or unrealistic in expectation? How will he display the final pictures? That can affect whether he even needs to sharpen or remove noise.

He also mentions the hyperfocal distance. First of all, the sweet spot is more likely to be f/8 though the difference in sharpness from f/5.6 is probably insignificant. Regardless, the depth of field is much more than needed because having something of interest at 2' is not likely to happen. I would be more concerned about shooting technique. If I would be shooting a lot of dim interiors, I would take a monopod or tripod. You can always use the tripod as a monopod. I would be a lot more concerned about motion blur than noise. In addition to bracing against a rail, you can lean against a wall or post. I actually like hugging a post. You should also experiment with VR to see how slow you can comfortably go with the shutter speed.

For myself, I would plan to shoot manual: f/5.6, 1/50 with VR, and auto ISO. I am more concerned with motion than noise or depth of field. I would also bracket exposures because if the interior is sun-lit and a lot of shadows, you might have to use something like HDR to capture that extreme range. I would bracket at 0 compensation with plus and minus one stop and shoot at high-speed. That way, you get all three shots very rapidly with one push of the button. Once home, I will deal with the noise.

Regarding the post's title, this is about shooting interiors, not landscapes or urban-scapes.