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Jun 3, 2019 10:08:44   #
BebuLamar
 
burkphoto wrote:
Nikon Df... $2700 body... no video.

That said, as a guy who grew up in the 1960s-‘70s with full manual cameras, and separate video cameras in the 1980s-2012, I’m VERY happy with my Lumix GH4 setup.

Study the history of digital still cameras and you’ll find their roots in digital video camera production.

The cost of adding video is less per unit than leaving it out, because they can sell more units of a more versatile camera. Everybody wins, but a few purists are annoyed...
Nikon Df... $2700 body... no video. br br That s... (show quote)


You can compare the price of the Df with the D850 and Z7. The price of both the D850 and Z7 are $50 more or 1.82% higher than that of the Df. The Df has 16MP and the D850 and Z7 both have 45MP. Both can shoot higher frame per second. Both can do video in 4K. So there is no saving there.

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Jun 3, 2019 10:12:40   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
LFingar wrote:
Exactly what structures and mechanisms within the camera do you think a stills only model would eliminate? So far as I know video capability is provided by the camera's firmware and simply uses the available capabilities the camera. I know of no components that are dedicated to video alone. If anything, a stills only model of any particular camera would cost more.


Dedicated video components include:

Microphones (usually awful)
External Microphone Jack
Headphone jack (often missing)
HDMI output
A/V or USB output
Software embedded in firmware

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Jun 3, 2019 10:37:49   #
LFingar Loc: Claverack, NY
 
burkphoto wrote:
Dedicated video components include:

Microphones (usually awful)
External Microphone Jack
Headphone jack (often missing)
HDMI output
A/V or USB output
Software embedded in firmware


Ah, yes, the various interfaces. Missed that. Thanks! I was thinking more of the actual production of the video, which I don't shoot. The only way I transfer data is via card removal so I missed those components. Still, eliminating them from a particular camera would almost certainly raise the price, not lower it.

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Jun 3, 2019 10:41:34   #
riderxlx Loc: DFW area Texas
 
HRBIEL wrote:
Just some food for thought. In the old days (pre digital) personal cameras registered images on film but they didn't record video on film. Today, almost any personal camera you can buy can shoot stills as well as record video. I wonder if there would be a market for photographers who only shoot stills and would buy a camera that had no video capability? Marketing a camera with no video capabilities could probably cost less, maybe weigh less, have a smaller form factor, and be less complicated to operate. I know I would be interested in such a camera as I'm not interested in video. Any thoughts from hoggers?
Just some food for thought. In the old days (pre d... (show quote)


This is an interesting idea you present. Since digital imaging is electronic, I do not think this will be something we will see because I think the video feature is just part of the imaging process. Very little if any extra cost and manufacturing involved to add the video feature on the current devices. I really do not think there would be much of a market for a cheaper camera lacking the video feature. I am with Bobprez, I too have a Nikon D200 which I bought for $147.00 a couple of years ago and it is like new and a very good camera. My old film lenses match right up to it. It has no Video feature due to being older technology, I think 2006 model. Me ! I do like to have the video feature as an option. There are times it would help. So, I use a cheap point'n shooter for the video feature. So saying this it is possible to obtain an older camera without the video feature if you desire to not have that feature. As Bobp noted, the D200 is no light weight but a full size DSPR. I think there could be some older small cameras without video. But in today's current offerings, the video feature is just part of the device. You do not have to use it. So to answer your question, I do not think there would be a market for a 'just single shots only' camera because there just would not be savings in cost and manufacturing to eliminate this feature. Just my thoughts. This is a good post and topic you presented.
bruce.

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Jun 3, 2019 10:47:45   #
jackpinoh Loc: Kettering, OH 45419
 
HRBIEL wrote:
Just some food for thought. In the old days (pre digital) personal cameras registered images on film but they didn't record video on film. Today, almost any personal camera you can buy can shoot stills as well as record video. I wonder if there would be a market for photographers who only shoot stills and would buy a camera that had no video capability? Marketing a camera with no video capabilities could probably cost less, maybe weigh less, have a smaller form factor, and be less complicated to operate. I know I would be interested in such a camera as I'm not interested in video. Any thoughts from hoggers?
Just some food for thought. In the old days (pre d... (show quote)

Digital cameras are basically a sensor, shutter, sometimes a mirror, switches and software. The cost of adding video to a digital camera is negligible. Basically it is the cost of minor additional software and better heat management. Once those software and heat management design changes are made in one camera, porting those changes to all digital cameras from that manufacturer is probably much, much less than the cost of supporting multiple camera software configurations. The same applies to microwave ovens. They have lots of features most people don't use, but taking features out and supporting multiple configurations doesn't make any sense. The same applies to spreadsheets, word processing software, and photo processing software.

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Jun 3, 2019 11:27:59   #
Robert1 Loc: Davie, FL
 
I have the Nikon Df. Why? Just because of its looks and perfect ergonomics to my hands/brain coordination. Plus, Whenever I want to shoot a video, it's a no brainer, I pull my video camcorder and I do much better and easier than any camera with video capabilities.
The right tool for the job at hand. Do you see TV or Motion picture professionals shooting video with a camera?

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Jun 3, 2019 11:32:00   #
Haydon
 
Robert1 wrote:
The right tool for the job at hand. Do you see TV or Motion picture professionals shooting video with a camera?


Big production companies have used cameras for filming. House had it's final episode filmed using a Canon 5D2.

https://petapixel.com/2010/04/09/house-season-finale-filmed-entirely-with-canon-5d-mark-ii/

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Jun 3, 2019 11:59:27   #
Pickles3 Loc: Washington State
 
I have the Df...I purchased it shortly after it's introduction for very specific reasons:
1. No video
2. Low light photography capabilities
3. Lighter and smaller than the D4
5. It takes virtual any lens made by Nikon
6. I can use the Nikon bellows that I purchased in the mid-70s
7. With manual lens, I can use my "old" polarizer, also purchased in the 70's
8. Superb image quality with the D4 season
9. No bult in flash
10. No built-in GPS
11. No wireless capability
12. I can use my "old" cable release
13. The older Nikon glass works on my Niko F4s

There are other reasons as well. Today, the "newest" lens in my arsenal is the Nikon 50mm 1.8 purchased in 2010 or 2011.

Over time I have collected a number of old Nikon glass, e.g., 28mm f2.0, 35mm f2.0, 85mm f2.0, 105mm 2.5 and the 55 2.8 micro lens.

With the exception of the 85mm and the 105mm (both pre-AI), the other lens are with AI or AIS.

My daily walk around lens are the 28mm and the 85mm.

I still have the original 24-85 2.8 zoom wihich is ok on the DF but absolutely shines on the Nikon F4..

Yes, the camera was (and still is) expensive but I have no buyer regrets and is used on a weekly basis. If I ever upgrade the camera, it will be for the Z6. Even then, I will still use the Df.

The old glass, much cheaper than new glass, has remarkable contrast and saturation qualities and are the main reason I have switched to shooting manual with old glass.

Sorry to so long winded but I personally feel the Nikon Df, for the reasons stated above, is my go-to camera and will be for a long time to come.

Tom

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Jun 3, 2019 12:02:47   #
rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania
 
mwsilvers wrote:
You misconstrued the meaning of my post. I was not being critical of the OP, nor did I suggest he should have searched anywhere before posting. I was merely giving him an historical perspective of the subject. Was I being inaccurate? If it sounded critical it was unintentional.


Ok. It's just that there are so many people who complain about other people posting topics that have been discussed before. It's one of my pet peeves. I just don't understand why anyone would discourage a decent discussion. This is a social media site and its purpose is on-line conversation. Why then do some members get all bent out of shape when someone wants to talk about something that's already been discussed?! Does it make them feel insecure if another poster may say something similar or better than they said!? I just don't get it. As I pointed out, if they don't care for the conversation, don't join in, just move on to the next.
So, I apologize for my inaccurate reaction and hope you understand why I reacted as I did.

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Jun 3, 2019 12:08:47   #
Robert1 Loc: Davie, FL
 
Do you see all of the ancillary equipment/ extra preparations in order to do that?
I'm aware of some professionals doing that..great exercises with the available cameras that are able to give professional results, but at a much higher technical/job involment in order to produce that shoot. Why? Because they could, I guess; but they could do it much easier for the job with motion picture equipment. Until the day the industry feels that camera is just as easy/technically equivalent in ease of operation, and of course.. $$ price. I don't think we will be seeing TV/motion pictures companies shooting with a camera as a standard practice; other than the occasional: because let's prove we can do it as a technical accomplishment.
I'm not knocking video on cameras at all. It is fine for most people for the occasional few minutes shoot. I do have a Nikon D750 that can do that, but if I want video..nothing like my Sony camcorder.

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Jun 3, 2019 12:12:45   #
Bill P
 
would happily pay for a digital camera with no video, no built in "filters" and simple menus written by native english speaking photographers. Engineers that deesign cameras are too proud of themselves and too bossed by marketing people. The camera companies could save a lot of money by laying off the needless engineers that design that needless crap and get new cameras with tings that matter a whole lot quicker to market.

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Jun 3, 2019 12:15:17   #
rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania
 
Haydon wrote:
Big production companies have used cameras for filming. House had it's final episode filmed using a Canon 5D2.

https://petapixel.com/2010/04/09/house-season-finale-filmed-entirely-with-canon-5d-mark-ii/


There's another phrase I just don't get. Why do people always say filming or make reference to film as the recording media, when digital cameras are used!? How can one film something with a digital camera?! Is it that difficult to say record or recorded. I guess it may be because the word record can be pronounced two ways with different yet related meanings.

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Jun 3, 2019 12:21:18   #
Haydon
 
rmorrison1116 wrote:
There's another phrase I just don't get. Why do people always say filming or make reference to film as the recording media, when digital cameras are used!? How can one film something with a digital camera?! Is it that difficult to say record or recorded. I guess it may be because the word record can be pronounced two ways with different yet related meanings.


You're a little pedantic today Morrison. First mwsilvers & now me :)

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Jun 3, 2019 12:27:03   #
MW
 
The goal can be simply stated:
Create a digital clone of the Olympus XA.

“Full Frame” in your shirt pocket.

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Jun 3, 2019 12:28:11   #
BebuLamar
 
Bill P wrote:
would happily pay for a digital camera with no video, no built in "filters" and simple menus written by native english speaking photographers. Engineers that deesign cameras are too proud of themselves and too bossed by marketing people. The camera companies could save a lot of money by laying off the needless engineers that design that needless crap and get new cameras with tings that matter a whole lot quicker to market.


How much are you willing to pay for a camera like that? I think some of the engineers would love to design cameras like that but their bosses would say it doesn't make business sense.

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