buckscop Loc: Bucks County PA

Amateur. Canon T7i, Canon EF-S18-135. Shot RAW+Jpg, . I use PSE19. Took sports photo in the AM and the PM. AM sunny, PM cloudy. Most shots were zoomed to 135. Used Shutter priority to freeze action, AM 1/1000 girls softball, PM 1/1600 boys hardball. ISO was on Auto, AWB, Spot Metering, High Speed Continuous Shutter. I used 1600 because I thought the action in boys hardball was faster (ball movement, running etc). At the time, I did not think of the cloud over effect on my shooting. Morning shots came out fantastic. It’s the baseball shots where my question lies. The only setting difference between am and pm was the shutter speed.

In post processing via PSE19 Raw (first go-round with PSE Raw), where I crop heavy to get ‘closeups’, I noticed that the hardball pics looked grainy, even before processing/cropping. As this continued pic after pic, I ‘assumed’ that I should have taken the cloud over into consideration re: the shutter speed. On one pic, I noticed that I cropped to tight and wanted to reverse my crop. I couldn’t find a ‘reverse’ button as on the regular PSE19 cropping (I know now how to), so I decided to use the same corresponding jpg shot to get the crop I wanted. When I brought up the same jpg file, I noticed that it DID NOT seem grainy. Even after cropping the jpg, it seemed way clearer than the RAW image. Checked others and it was the same, jpg’s seemed clearer than the RAW’s.

So, my question is…. If all the files were grainy, I would have understood. But the jpg’s being better ‘quality’ than the RAW bewilders my Amateur mind. Any thoughts? Hopefully the pics attached are good enough to tell the difference as easy it is to do on my screen.

raw 1


jpg 1


raw 2


jpg 2

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

Jpg's have processing applied in-camera. When you edited the raw, did you do any kind of noise reduction? PSE has noise reduction sliders available in the second tab near top right in the raw editor section (ACR).

There is also an option in one of the drop-down menus of the main editing area when in "expert" mode.

Settings: if afternoon was cloudy and you used a faster shutter speed, then aperture and/or ISO should be different than your morning shoot. Folks can help if you upload per suggestions that came after my note, but you can check on your computer, too.

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

First, you can't display raw so what you are really showing us is four jpeg files, Hopefully the raw images were unprocessed before you exported them to jpegs, otherwise it will be difficult for us to know what adjustments you made to them in camera raw or PSE 19 to cause the noise. Secondly, resubmit them, but this time select Store Original before attaching them. Make the images you store as high a resolution as you can with a maximum size of less than 20mb each. If you get an error loading them reduce the size a bit. Raw images are unprocessed before editing and jpegs are processed in camera so there will be a difference straight out of the camera. Without high resolution copies and store original marked it will be difficult for us to analyze what happened in your case.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

The RAW file is from the sensor data with no processing, including no sharpening and no noise processing. The JPEG exhibits the camera's native capabilities for toning, noise and sharpening, with some settings available for refinement, in the camera, by you -- the photographer.

Aside - this discussion and the community's abilty to effectively help would be greatly enhanced if you had posted your examples images and had stored the originals. We can see RAW 1 is grainy. But, without being able to download and review the details of the image at 100%, no one can really say / see 'how grainy' and certainly can make no tangible comparison to the JPEG.

When using PSE RAW, what actions did you the photographer and image editor take relative to adjusting the noise? Adjusting the sharpening? Adjusting the White Balance (WB)? When you shoot in RAW, these actions are now your responsibility in your post processing.

BebuLamar

I think because you use Auto ISO. Cloudy isn't as bright as sunny and all the other settings are the same the ISO must go up and more noise so the pics look grainy.

rjaywallace Loc: Wisconsin

If the .jpg shots work better for sports (assuming identical crop which was not true for photos #2 especially and for #4) then, gee whiz, shoot .jpg for sports and turn Raw off. No major crisis here.

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

You don't find any value in the OP's learning what is happening and why? How to edit raw, or what happens to f/stop and ISO when using shutter priority under varying light and shutter speeds?

buckscop Loc: Bucks County PA

I found a set that I did not PP, and when zoomed in, show the grain well in comparison, but what can I save the cr2 as to be able to load it?

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

The file size will probably be too large (needs to be around 20 mb). Any non-jpg that's within the file size limit can be uploaded to UHH. There is no special save; the only difference is there will be no thumbnail to view, just a download link and the words "attached file."

Another option: don't move any sliders when you open the raw in ACR, just go to bottom right and click "open." Once your main editor section opens, do "save as" jpg. Upload that file.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

Just "File / Save As" and set the output to JPG, say at 90% quality. You just need to get the file size under 20MB per individual file.

Relative to a few comments already, what actions have you made in the RAW processing of the CR2 images? You might capture a screen print of these settings, if possible.

Check too the file size of the CR2. If less than 20MB, just attach the CR2 directly. We can give the most help on adjustments to the RAW by working directly on the RAW.

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

One more note while I think of it: don't crop while in ACR; do it in the main editing section. This makes it easier to re-work the raw in future.

buckscop Loc: Bucks County PA

I tend to only use the first tab in PSE Raw, clarity, color, shadow, some white balance. However on the pics in question, I noticed the grainyness right off without touching them. Hopefully these 2 pics work out. I did not choose to use these 2, so I did not PP them at all. FYI.....Even though I didn't use this image, my typical crop here would have been the batter, catcher, ump, with some room in front of the batter.

raw

(Download)

jpg

(Download)

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

ISO on this was 5000. Bottom line is you need to edit the raw for noise reduction if you want to compare results against the jpg.

buckscop Loc: Bucks County PA

Because the am shots were beautiful in RAW, most only cropping was necessary and it was a finished image, and the pm cloudy ones tended to be grainy off the bat, was it mainly due to the higher shutter speed calling for more ISO due to less natural light? (Linda)... are you saying to 'normally' crop in the main and not while in raw?

Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington

question 1 - yes, but stand by for more in-depth analysis from Chg_Canon. He may find more.

To compare the noise issue, what is the ISO on your morning shots?

question 2 - yes, it's just an easier workflow should you decide to go back and do an edit differently. Once you're in the main section, you will be saving as jpg or other file type. The raw remains uncropped.