Any activity out there?
May 12, 2019 09:30:46 #
I am as guilty as anyone not posting here, but starting to wonder if interest in wedding photography is declining. It has with me as I am down to 1 or 2 weddings per year, but I am always doing events. Bob & Ed, how about expanding to Wedding and Event Photography?
May 12, 2019 19:00:16 #
Hey Jay!
Yes! it has been slow in this section and some of that may be my fault because the moderators or managers in these specialized sections are supposed to promote their sections and perhaps I have been remiss in doing that. I don't like to blame these things on members, conditions, or the industry at large, at least not until first I see if I am doing anything wrong or have been negligent first. That the way I have been running my business for over 50 years- when things are not going along well, I look to myself first and then, if I feel I have done my best, I look for other causes.
As long as I have been contributing to this site, the wedding section has never been heavily trafficked. There is only a handful of us that were frequenting the section along with the occasional visitor. Some folks would post questions about wedding photography in the main section and I would try to direct them or invite them to participate here but mostly they never showed up.
Sadly, many of the posts were somewhat negative- folks complaining about something they saw go down at weddings such as a rude, inept or fumbling photographer where the amateurs had to come to the rescue, etc. There were many posts by disgruntled ex-wedding shooters and always the comments like "... I would not touch a wedding witha bargepole...etc, etc". All very discouraging or a bit demoralizing to read.
Then, of course, there are always the folks who were asked to shoot a wedding, don't know the first thing about the job, asking for foolproof methods and these are then followed by a litany of discouraging posts. What's worse is some others chime in an advise the rank amateur to "...go ahead and do it anyway and have fun..." I no longer bother to inject the fact that lawsuite and disgruntled brides are not fun"! There is no use in discouraging anything because folks will do what the want anyway!
As far as the industry itself is concerned, it varies greatly as to geographic location, buying habits of the folks in these places, traditions in different ethnic, cultural and socioeconomic groups and the availability of good professionals in any given area.
GOOD wedding photography, aside from artistic and technical savvy and prowess, requires a lot of people skills, kindness, and passionate dedication to the work at hand and not every photographer, regardless of their talents, is cut out for the job. Every time I hear the " word "bridezilla" uttered by a photographer "my blood boils and my skin crawls"! This shows a horrible dispassionate attitude, disrespect and a complete misunderstanding of the job.
Generally, speaking, pertaining to this entire site, I have come to the conclusion that there is little interest in professional photography and in some circles, pros are resented or under-appreciated. There is little action in the Advanced and Pro Portrait and Commercial sections as well. The folks that have posted there seemed to have benefited from the experience.
There are still very successful and highly competent wedding shooters doing well financially. There seems to be no middle-ground- either there are top pros at one end of the spectrum and a whole bunch of well meand folks kinda floundering around, perhaps because they are not promoting and pricing their work properly and profitability. Also not every wedding couple or family prioritize photography in there plans and budgets so the will accept anything at a low price, that is until they receive bad results!
So that's all the bad side! On the good side, I think your idea of "Weddings and Events..." is great. I'll tell you why I like the concept. What many photographers fail to realize, even if they never even entertained the idea of shooting a wedding, there is SO MUCH to learn from experienced wedding photographers. In my own case, I started off as a wedding shooter and soon became interested in fine portraiture, I began to combine the techniques and soon learned to produced good portraits, even under somewhat rushed or time-constrained circumstances. I became a fast candid shooter and later on in ny career, I work as a press photographer using many of the technique I learned at weddings. Wedding photography, if done right, entails a bit of journalism, portraiture fashion photography, architectural work, flash technique, low light techniques and lots more.
I never separated wedding photography for other events. I have photographed, wedding in many cultures, Bar Mitzvahs, Sweet-Sixteen Parties, Baptisms, First Communions, Confirmations, Investitures, Ordinations, Quinceaneras, anniversaries, corporate events of every kind, conventions, trade shows, funerals, memorial services, military events, graduations, athletic events and more. If you can do BIG full-fledged society or ethnic weddings and can always come out unscathed and with good results on a consistent basis, all the rest is a piece of cake. For me, it was easier when compared to the onus that comes with weddings- It ain't a job for the lazy photographer or those who are faint of heart! co-conspirator in this section. BK will soon chime in and let's see what he thinks.
Yes! it has been slow in this section and some of that may be my fault because the moderators or managers in these specialized sections are supposed to promote their sections and perhaps I have been remiss in doing that. I don't like to blame these things on members, conditions, or the industry at large, at least not until first I see if I am doing anything wrong or have been negligent first. That the way I have been running my business for over 50 years- when things are not going along well, I look to myself first and then, if I feel I have done my best, I look for other causes.
As long as I have been contributing to this site, the wedding section has never been heavily trafficked. There is only a handful of us that were frequenting the section along with the occasional visitor. Some folks would post questions about wedding photography in the main section and I would try to direct them or invite them to participate here but mostly they never showed up.
Sadly, many of the posts were somewhat negative- folks complaining about something they saw go down at weddings such as a rude, inept or fumbling photographer where the amateurs had to come to the rescue, etc. There were many posts by disgruntled ex-wedding shooters and always the comments like "... I would not touch a wedding witha bargepole...etc, etc". All very discouraging or a bit demoralizing to read.
Then, of course, there are always the folks who were asked to shoot a wedding, don't know the first thing about the job, asking for foolproof methods and these are then followed by a litany of discouraging posts. What's worse is some others chime in an advise the rank amateur to "...go ahead and do it anyway and have fun..." I no longer bother to inject the fact that lawsuite and disgruntled brides are not fun"! There is no use in discouraging anything because folks will do what the want anyway!
As far as the industry itself is concerned, it varies greatly as to geographic location, buying habits of the folks in these places, traditions in different ethnic, cultural and socioeconomic groups and the availability of good professionals in any given area.
GOOD wedding photography, aside from artistic and technical savvy and prowess, requires a lot of people skills, kindness, and passionate dedication to the work at hand and not every photographer, regardless of their talents, is cut out for the job. Every time I hear the " word "bridezilla" uttered by a photographer "my blood boils and my skin crawls"! This shows a horrible dispassionate attitude, disrespect and a complete misunderstanding of the job.
Generally, speaking, pertaining to this entire site, I have come to the conclusion that there is little interest in professional photography and in some circles, pros are resented or under-appreciated. There is little action in the Advanced and Pro Portrait and Commercial sections as well. The folks that have posted there seemed to have benefited from the experience.
There are still very successful and highly competent wedding shooters doing well financially. There seems to be no middle-ground- either there are top pros at one end of the spectrum and a whole bunch of well meand folks kinda floundering around, perhaps because they are not promoting and pricing their work properly and profitability. Also not every wedding couple or family prioritize photography in there plans and budgets so the will accept anything at a low price, that is until they receive bad results!
So that's all the bad side! On the good side, I think your idea of "Weddings and Events..." is great. I'll tell you why I like the concept. What many photographers fail to realize, even if they never even entertained the idea of shooting a wedding, there is SO MUCH to learn from experienced wedding photographers. In my own case, I started off as a wedding shooter and soon became interested in fine portraiture, I began to combine the techniques and soon learned to produced good portraits, even under somewhat rushed or time-constrained circumstances. I became a fast candid shooter and later on in ny career, I work as a press photographer using many of the technique I learned at weddings. Wedding photography, if done right, entails a bit of journalism, portraiture fashion photography, architectural work, flash technique, low light techniques and lots more.
I never separated wedding photography for other events. I have photographed, wedding in many cultures, Bar Mitzvahs, Sweet-Sixteen Parties, Baptisms, First Communions, Confirmations, Investitures, Ordinations, Quinceaneras, anniversaries, corporate events of every kind, conventions, trade shows, funerals, memorial services, military events, graduations, athletic events and more. If you can do BIG full-fledged society or ethnic weddings and can always come out unscathed and with good results on a consistent basis, all the rest is a piece of cake. For me, it was easier when compared to the onus that comes with weddings- It ain't a job for the lazy photographer or those who are faint of heart! co-conspirator in this section. BK will soon chime in and let's see what he thinks.
May 13, 2019 10:02:30 #
Ed, your replies are always so well presented and the points you make are right on target. I do shoot weddings for families occasionally (I do know what I'm doing!) and have benefitted from advice in this column from time to time. Thanks to all who have contributed and I think the addition of "Events" is a great idea.
May 13, 2019 11:09:59 #
E.L.. Shapiro wrote:
Hey Jay! br br Yes! it has been slow in this se... (show quote)
Ed, you are very talented not only in photography, but your ability to compose and communicate your thoughts. As you retire from your business as I believe you stated is upcoming, maybe you could write an instructional book or blog.
Anyway, maybe the best way to start things up again is to share specific challenges (many in weddings and events) and how they were dealt with. Also, inviting others to share how they overcame these issues.
May 13, 2019 19:23:08 #
jaysnave wrote:
Ed, you are very talented not only in photography, but your ability to compose and communicate your thoughts. As you retire from your business as I believe you stated is upcoming, maybe you could write an instructional book or blog.
Anyway, maybe the best way to start things up again is to share specific challenges (many in weddings and events) and how they were dealt with. Also, inviting others to share how they overcame these issues.
Anyway, maybe the best way to start things up again is to share specific challenges (many in weddings and events) and how they were dealt with. Also, inviting others to share how they overcame these issues.
Jay! Thanks for your kind words. I am not retiring from my BUSINESS any time soon- I'm just turning the wedding department over to my younger crew. As per my morbid sense of humor, I always joke that my retirement party will coincide with my funeral...and the camera a strobe is going into the box with me so when the archaeologists dig up my bones thousands of years from now, they will know what I was up to!
I am surprisingly healthy for a 75-year-old geezer and I can still hold my own in a shoot. Thing is, I haven't had a weekend off with my lovely wife in over 50 years and when you have wedding commitments, you can't even get away for a couple of weeks at a time. I still get requests to BE THERE at weddings but I realize the lovely young brides would rather have a dashingly handsome young dude or a pretty woman photographer at their wedding, not this old guy with a walrus mustache and gray beard. My first young feller/ staffer and my pretty daughter qualify. So the old man is gonna phase himself out of the wedding business- perhaps I'll just come in to do the portraits and formals for a while. I still work full-time on portraiture and commercial assignments. So...this summer will be my last season walking down the aisle backward with a camera in hand.
A book? I don't know that I have the patience to write a complete book. Also- I never became a popular wedding celebrity kinda shooter. I did lots of training, speaking and professional association stuff but I never sought the publicity on the circuit so to speak. That would not be good for book sales. Also- I may be perceived as "too old school" although I have indeed kept up with more contemporary trends and styles. Another also- I don't believe in endorsing equipment for sponsorships. I stress technique and dedications- the equipment comes later and has to be personal preference. A good wedding shooter can do a bang-up job with relatively modest gear. A blog to answer questions, troubleshoot issues and advise new folks may be cool!
May 17, 2019 08:07:42 #
I have no issues with adding events as well. I do both.
I feel bad for not posting more lately, but I think with others it's kind of the same thing. Life in general gets in the way.
After 20 years at my current day job (the one that supplies my health insurance) I find out Monday if I even still have a job after a merger. If that happens, with my health history, I will NEED to get a job with health insurance, as I couldn't afford anything that wants a diabetic cancer survivor that had an aggressive form of the disease.
The up side is, that after taking last year off from weddings... (tearing down and rebuilding after a flood) this year is looking up. I'm turning away business at this point. I'm still doing the race photos (5K through marathons) Parties for businesses, open houses, real estate, and the commercial work, but thankfully, the weddings are now coming back. Honestly, even though I really enjoy the other stuff, weddings are still my passion, but they take so much work afterwards with editing, etc. I decided having a roof over my head over the course of last year, was more important.
If I do end up needing to find a new job, my time here may be even less. Our new home only has satellite internet available, with data caps, etc. Until something like 5G comes along to the middle of nowhere, I'll be conserving my data for business use.
Of course, if they decide that nothing is going to change (yeah right) then I will be free to check in during breaks, lunch, or just down times.
So, that's basically where I stand. If you want to start discussing events, we can change it in the "about this section" but I'm not sure if we can get the title changed or not. Admin for the whole site can be difficult to reach.
Until then, maybe we should all be ambassadors for this section like we did early on, and keep trying to promote this section. The more people posting that we exist, the more people will find us here.
Of course, with more people, could invite more trolls. As of now, I think Ed and I have a pretty good handle on that, but again, I may not have access to patrol the negative Nellies out there.
I feel bad for not posting more lately, but I think with others it's kind of the same thing. Life in general gets in the way.
After 20 years at my current day job (the one that supplies my health insurance) I find out Monday if I even still have a job after a merger. If that happens, with my health history, I will NEED to get a job with health insurance, as I couldn't afford anything that wants a diabetic cancer survivor that had an aggressive form of the disease.
The up side is, that after taking last year off from weddings... (tearing down and rebuilding after a flood) this year is looking up. I'm turning away business at this point. I'm still doing the race photos (5K through marathons) Parties for businesses, open houses, real estate, and the commercial work, but thankfully, the weddings are now coming back. Honestly, even though I really enjoy the other stuff, weddings are still my passion, but they take so much work afterwards with editing, etc. I decided having a roof over my head over the course of last year, was more important.
If I do end up needing to find a new job, my time here may be even less. Our new home only has satellite internet available, with data caps, etc. Until something like 5G comes along to the middle of nowhere, I'll be conserving my data for business use.
Of course, if they decide that nothing is going to change (yeah right) then I will be free to check in during breaks, lunch, or just down times.
So, that's basically where I stand. If you want to start discussing events, we can change it in the "about this section" but I'm not sure if we can get the title changed or not. Admin for the whole site can be difficult to reach.
Until then, maybe we should all be ambassadors for this section like we did early on, and keep trying to promote this section. The more people posting that we exist, the more people will find us here.
Of course, with more people, could invite more trolls. As of now, I think Ed and I have a pretty good handle on that, but again, I may not have access to patrol the negative Nellies out there.
May 17, 2019 17:02:20 #
OK, well I am going to post a specific challenge I recently had and let's see how many contributors we get. Maybe just keeping it to specific aspects of wedding & event photography we can all learn from each other. I aint afraid of no trolls 
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