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Time to toss PS11 & Photos
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Jan 9, 2019 14:28:56   #
BobHartung Loc: Bettendorf, IA
 
Raz Theo wrote:
G. Brown, your wisdom is exactly what I was hoping for. My issue with PS 11, and other programs I've read about, is that it/they are heavily weighted toward stuff I have no interest in or need for. As you suggest, I need to identify what I need first. The tutorial ring file idea is excellent. Much appreciation.
Thank you


All of these editors have way more than most of us need. The key is discerning what you need to know and not clogging our brains with useless facts. IMHO

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Jan 9, 2019 14:38:26   #
Raz Theo Loc: Music City
 
BobHartung wrote:
All of these editors have way more than most of us need. The key is discerning what you need to know and not clogging our brains with useless facts. IMHO

Amen brother.

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Jan 9, 2019 15:18:04   #
bsprague Loc: Lacey, WA, USA
 
When I get up on my soapbox and rant, it is about learning choices. All this software we use to edit is logical and intuitive if we establish a consistent learning path. Teachers will call it a "class". It has a beginning where a foundation is laid and knowledge is built on that with "lessons".

Jumping from book, to website to quicky YouTubes is the exact opposite. Jumping between applications makes it worse.

When I had Photoshop Elements 11 I took this course from Jan Kabili. https://www.lynda.com/Photoshop-Elements-tutorials/Up-Running-Photoshop-Elements-11/108968-2.html?srchtrk=index%3a4%0alinktypeid%3a2%0aq%3aphotoshop+elements%0apage%3a1%0as%3arelevance%0asa%3atrue%0aproducttypeid%3a2

I paid $20 for it but you should be able to do it through your library or as a free trial.

At risk of repeating myself, it is that confusion and frustration go away with learning. Jan's course may or may not be the best. The point is that a course or class with an investment of learning time is what is needed. The solution is NOT switching to another brand or even version of software.

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Jan 10, 2019 08:20:05   #
bobmcculloch Loc: NYC, NY
 
Raz Theo wrote:
The only editing system I have (ever) used is Photoshop Elements 11. Recently it dawned on me that I have hardly used it lately, substituting instead the basic program, Apple's Photos. The reason for this is that I was never comfortable with PS (probably a little lazy) and lacked the interest and persistence to really learn it. Photos is just simpler. But you get what you pay for right? I want a little of the creative post-production I see from many of you Hogs and on other sites. But I need help. What's out there? What program do you find most intuitive? Most efficient? Most flexible without breaking the bank?
Thanks in advance for your advice.
The only editing system I have (ever) used is Phot... (show quote)


I could never get the hang of Adobe products, PSP ( Paint Shop Pro) works for me, tried others it's the easiest and most complete IMHO, I usually upgrade every other year, Bob.
BTW, On their website you can usually get 30 days free to try.

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Jan 10, 2019 09:58:23   #
olemikey Loc: 6 mile creek, Spacecoast Florida
 
Raz Theo wrote:
Linda, thanks for your recommendation; there's seems to be an early trend toward PS & Lightroom. I probably would be more comfortable using something with which I have a (little) basic understanding. I think I'll start with that download now.
Much appreciation.


Linda always provides good, been there done that type of information. You might find (from the download) a renewed interest in processing. Good luck and have fun!

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Jan 10, 2019 10:38:18   #
ABJanes Loc: Jersey Boy now Virginia
 
I would agree! Many of these courses tend to be a bit broad brushed but they give you some idea on what can be done. Example: I wanted to do a fine edge section of my grandson and change the background. I read and studied over and over and found one video that was excellent in micro-techniques used by graphic designers. I used that in connection with the Elements Guided Section and got it to work quite nicely. A friend of mine once said "Most of us will use 10% of what any software package offers for features."


bsprague wrote:
When I get up on my soapbox and rant, it is about learning choices. All this software we use to edit is logical and intuitive if we establish a consistent learning path. Teachers will call it a "class". It has a beginning where a foundation is laid and knowledge is built on that with "lessons".

Jumping from book, to website to quicky YouTubes is the exact opposite. Jumping between applications makes it worse.

When I had Photoshop Elements 11 I took this course from Jan Kabili. https://www.lynda.com/Photoshop-Elements-tutorials/Up-Running-Photoshop-Elements-11/108968-2.html?srchtrk=index%3a4%0alinktypeid%3a2%0aq%3aphotoshop+elements%0apage%3a1%0as%3arelevance%0asa%3atrue%0aproducttypeid%3a2

I paid $20 for it but you should be able to do it through your library or as a free trial.

At risk of repeating myself, it is that confusion and frustration go away with learning. Jan's course may or may not be the best. The point is that a course or class with an investment of learning time is what is needed. The solution is NOT switching to another brand or even version of software.
When I get up on my soapbox and rant, it is about ... (show quote)

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Jan 10, 2019 10:54:17   #
dandev Loc: Enumclaw, WA
 
I just went through the exercise of evaluating replacements for LR6 and PS6.
I ended up purchasing Affinity Photo which was $39 on special. I'm going to use it as the replacement for PS6 as it doesn't have a DAM (Digital Asset Manager) and I'm not crazy about their raw editor. Their tutorials are mostly good. I also bought their book. It's a bit of a learning curve - but I have to remember that I've had a 4 year learning cycle with LR and PS. A lot of the principles are the same as PS.

For a LR6 replacement, I'm leaning towards Capture One Pro. It's pricey at $299 but it has good color management tools. I think LR CC Classic is still a backup option.
I also evaluated ON1, which didn't run well on my laptop. I may try again in a year. I also tried Luminar but didn't bond with it. And a few others.

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Jan 10, 2019 11:39:54   #
tomad Loc: North Carolina
 
Raz Theo wrote:
The only editing system I have (ever) used is Photoshop Elements 11. Recently it dawned on me that I have hardly used it lately, substituting instead the basic program, Apple's Photos. The reason for this is that I was never comfortable with PS (probably a little lazy) and lacked the interest and persistence to really learn it. Photos is just simpler. But you get what you pay for right? I want a little of the creative post-production I see from many of you Hogs and on other sites. But I need help. What's out there? What program do you find most intuitive? Most efficient? Most flexible without breaking the bank?
Thanks in advance for your advice.
The only editing system I have (ever) used is Phot... (show quote)


Luminar

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Jan 10, 2019 11:56:46   #
dsmeltz Loc: Philadelphia
 
Linda From Maine wrote:
I found PS Elements totally comfortable (and intuitive) after having dealt with Corel Paintshop Pro for a year. You could download the current version for a free trial, if you're curious what has changed since ver. 11


If the camera has not changed the old PSE 11 should still be OK. So if you are NOW motivated, reinstall PSE and give it a whirl. Start with what Adobe already provides in training:

https://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop-elements/archive/pse-11-tutorials.html

Then look at the tons available on YouTube

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Jan 10, 2019 13:49:35   #
photogeneralist Loc: Lopez Island Washington State
 
I use Apples's "Photos" as my first level post processor. I find that it does everything I need for whole photo adjustments. For changes to a portion of the photo (without effecting the rest) I have a choice of software installed but I find that my go to app is Creative Kit 2016 Which was sold by Macphun software before they changed their name to Skylum. It's actually a suite of apps, each specializing in a specific area of post processing. The apps are accessed from within Photos as installed extensions. Within the Creative Kit suite, I find that I use "Intensify" and "Snapheal" and pretty much ignore the others. I find that this combination (Photos, Intensify, Snapheal) does everything that I want to do , and all within Photos.
I bought the entire Creative Kit suite directly from MacPhun but with 20-20 hind site I would have just purchased Intensify and Snapheal from the apple app store where they were available as individual apps. I think that they were about $10 each, They may still be available on the app store.

MacPhun became Skylum and combined the Creative Kit Suite into single app , Luminar. Luminar (IMHO) tries to do everything for everyone and adds few niceties not present in Creative Kit. Because of this "scope bloat", and the complexities it engenders, Luminar has lost some of the ease of use inherent in the more targeted individual apps in Creative Kit.
Since you already have "Photos" on your Mac and IF Intensify and Snapheal are still available on the Mac app store, then I would recommend that combination as a low $ risk and easy to use post processing, setup.
Of course Adobe dominates the market and most of the "Press" is about their products but for my purposes (inexpensive, easy to use, , intuitive no frills functionality) they are not the best.
That's my opinion, and my experience. On this site you will get many other opinions. Read them all (including this one) with skepticism, digest the information, make a choice and go for it.

PS excuse my typing, my hands shake and I have trouble with missed or repetaed keystrokesss.

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Jan 10, 2019 18:45:33   #
Bill P
 
PS is like the kitchen sink, there's everything in a big pile. Dig through it and just pick what you need. I use Bridge and PS and I know how to use about 15% of it. But that's just what I need. I have noticed that there are other competing programs, but when I research thme I read things like "XYAphoto is great for post editing sharpening." "ABC program is great for color correction." Maybe each one of these programs is incrementally better than PS but I spend $10 a month and I get the whole meal deal. I have the luxury of just learning what I need to know for my own purposes, and ignore the rest. Sign up, go for it.

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Jan 10, 2019 19:39:22   #
sodapop Loc: Bel Air, MD
 
I agree . Use what you need. Trying to learn ever thing a program does is like trying to understand every word in the dictionary before you write a story. This is Particularly true with Photoshop.


Raz Theo wrote:
G. Brown, your wisdom is exactly what I was hoping for. My issue with PS 11, and other programs I've read about, is that it/they are heavily weighted toward stuff I have no interest in or need for. As you suggest, I need to identify what I need first. The tutorial ring file idea is excellent. Much appreciation.
Thank you

Reply
Jan 10, 2019 20:44:17   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
Raz Theo wrote:
Linda, thanks for your recommendation; there's seems to be an early trend toward PS & Lightroom. I probably would be more comfortable using something with which I have a (little) basic understanding. I think I'll start with that download now.
Much appreciation.


Good move. You may never need anything else. If you do decide to move up to PhotoShop it will be a pretty easy transition.

--

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Jan 10, 2019 22:48:07   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
Usually this type of posts brings a horde of Lightroom (LR) Classic users touting the virtues of LR. It’s a nice editing program but I would not apply the word intuitive to it. Maybe that is why.

I use LR Classic, as well as LC Creative Cloud (CC) and Photoshop (PS). I have used Elements and it is more like Photoshop. LR CLassic is more like Apple’s defunct Aperture RIP :(.

LR Creative Cloud (CC) is the most intuitive of the the three, the experience is more like Photos but it has good adjustment features as well. And it’s also has mobile versions. You can run LR CC on on your phone, your tablet and your computer. And they will sync. It does not have as many retouching features as LR classic, but it is more “intuitive” and easier to use. It has good mobile sharing options as well. The more I use it the more I like it.

Most software vendors offer a free trial. For example Adobe offers a 30 day free trial. I recommend you try several different programs, things you see recommended here, and pick the one you like best.

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Jan 11, 2019 04:47:49   #
dpullum Loc: Tampa Florida
 
Linda From Maine wrote:
I found PS Elements totally comfortable (and intuitive) after having dealt with Corel Paintshop Pro for a year. You could download the current version for a free trial, if you're curious what has changed since ver. 11


As usual good advice. Personally, I have used Paintshop Pro for a long time and have PSE to do some things that PSPro has screwed up in the name of progress? My fall back is Topaz... the classic Topaz plugins, not the new Studio. We, as editors, develop a routine to clean up and stamp photos with our signature look. To do this efficiently we know where our favorite item is in the dropdown menus and do our tricks.

After using PSE for a while as Linda says, "totally comfortable and intuitive." Yes, while all editing programs are cluttered with extras and more so with each edition, as said, "only use a few of the many."

Remember that Crop is your most valuable tool... crop to the story. No story, then delete the photo. Keep your life simple [KIS] and learn to use a few basics. Yes, kick the color, yes brighten, etc but learn the basics. Analyze the photo before you start the edit. Make a checklist if needed so as to know where you are going before you mindlessly start editing. [My biggest complaint about Webinars... they just start editing... never say my end goal is to make the photo look like this ... showing the end result... then telling us how they got there. No, unfortunately, they, the experts, just start mucking around]

The new trend is Ai... to clean up the noise one press of the button and presto based on many thousands of cleanings the program knows how the photo should look. Humm, reminds me of graphing in Excel, historically I was a master, now the program imposes the "What you really want is..." and screws up the works !! Our future as creative photographers in control of our images looks bleak. Perhaps it is not "Time to toss PSE11" perhaps we just need to develop a step 1, 2, 3 routines and follow those steps, writing ourselve directions if needed.

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