Be Very, Very, Afraid - - - shooting in public: If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have...

lesdmd Loc: Middleton Wi via N.Y.C. & Cleveland

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

The man, 59 years old, a PhD, a pillar of his community in Sweden was visiting a friend, the nice lady I mentioned, in Florida. He carries his camera everywhere and takes as many as 100 photos/day, the best of which he posts; and has been posting on his website for years. The subjects are all over the place: including landscapes, street shots, architectural captures, and people . . . essentially anything he find interesting.

This tourist went out one day to an ocean front community, took a swim at the public beach and then sat on a wall, in his bathing suit, taking photos of "things". It was early and he was about 20 shots into his daily routine when the police came running up to him demanding his camera and memory card because he looked suspicious shooting from waist level using the articulating live view screen on the back of his camera. He relinquished the requested materials and was told he would be going to jail because he was now accused of pedophilia and perversion---one of the photos was of two young girls washing off in a very public shower/fountain. These girls were fully covered and were fully visible to anyone in the area, and, having seen the photo, were doing nothing even vaguely sensual. The man, who was interrogated for two hours at the beach and explained that he did not know American laws, in Europe he had taken shots at resort areas with no problems, that virtually everyone at a Beach walks around scantily dressed, that one of the earlier photos on the memory card was of two fat men washing sand off in the same shower/fountain, that he wanted to cooperate, that he would relinquish his laptop to prove there was nothing incriminating on it, and that the police were welcome to visit his website. The laptop was produced with difficulty since his friend had to drive it over from her home where he was visiting, the evidence was inspected, and the man was hauled off to jail - - - despite explaining that he had a return flight to Sweden scheduled for the next morning. He was charged with "disturbing the peace" (despite the police report that confirms he was doing nothing of the sort), apparently a catch-all that is used to describe anything the police do not like and to justify the time they spent investigating it , his camera and card was confiscated, his wallet taken, and his bail refused even though he had the cash ($25) on his person. He was detained over night, forced to miss his flight, never received any sort of apology, and eventually returned home without the confiscated equipment which was being held as evidence pending his return to answer the charges.

He now has his camera back in Sweden which had to be sent to him by his friend, but the memory card remains with the police. He sought legal help mainly because he is now afraid to ever travel back to this country with the pedophilia insinuations hanging over his head; and because the excessive actions by the police are a violation of numerous Constitutional Protections, more worthy of a Fascist State than the State of Florida. His lawyer, who is seeking to have all charges thrown out and then plans to sue for damages, has already run up bills of several thousand dollars, but is confident that his client will eventually walk away with a substantial award.

There must be something in the air in Florida, because this sort of thing is not an isolated matter. The Police do not appear to understand the differences between doing something that might be considered suspicious versus acting illegally. See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

richnash46 Loc: Texas

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

The man, 59 years old, a PhD, a pillar of his community in Sweden was visiting a friend, the nice lady I mentioned, in Florida. He carries his camera everywhere and takes as many as 100 photos/day, the best of which he posts; and has been posting on his website for years. The subjects are all over the place: including landscapes, street shots, architectural captures, and people . . . essentially anything he find interesting.

This tourist went out one day to an ocean front community, took a swim at the public beach and then sat on a wall, in his bathing suit, taking photos of "things". It was early and he was about 20 shots into his daily routine when the police came running up to him demanding his camera and memory card because he looked suspicious shooting from waist level using the articulating live view screen on the back of his camera. He relinquished the requested materials and was told he would be going to jail because he was now accused of pedophilia and perversion---one of the photos was of two young girls washing off in a very public shower/fountain. These girls were fully covered and were fully visible to anyone in the area, and, having seen the photo, were doing nothing even vaguely sensual. The man, who was interrogated for two hours at the beach and explained that he did not know American laws, in Europe he had taken shots at resort areas with no problems, that virtually everyone at a Beach walks around scantily dressed, that one of the earlier photos on the memory card was of two fat men washing sand off in the same shower/fountain, that he wanted to cooperate, that he would relinquish his laptop to prove there was nothing incriminating on it, and that the police were welcome to visit his website. The laptop was produced with difficulty since his friend had to drive it over from her home where he was visiting, the evidence was inspected, and the man was hauled off to jail - - - despite explaining that he had a return flight to Sweden scheduled for the next morning. He was charged with "disturbing the peace" (despite the police report that confirms he was doing nothing of the sort), apparently a catch-all that is used to describe anything the police do not like and to justify the time they spent investigating it , his camera and card was confiscated, his wallet taken, and his bail refused even though he had the cash ($25) on his person. He was detained over night, forced to miss his flight, never received any sort of apology, and eventually returned home without the confiscated equipment which was being held as evidence pending his return to answer the charges.

He now has his camera back in Sweden which had to be sent to him by his friend, but the memory card remains with the police. He sought legal help mainly because he is now afraid to ever travel back to this country with the pedophilia insinuations hanging over his head; and because the excessive actions by the police are a violation of numerous Constitutional Protections, more worthy of a Fascist State than the State of Florida. His lawyer, who is seeking to have all charges thrown out and then plans to sue for damages, has already run up bills of several thousand dollars, but is confident that his client will eventually walk away with a substantial award.

There must be something in the air in Florida, because this sort of thing is not an isolated matter. The Police do not appear to understand the differences between doing something that might be considered suspicious versus acting illegally. See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, t... (show quote)

I just posted this yesterday in reply to another post which clearly exemplifies that we here in the U.S. do indeed live in a "police state!" Anyone who has traveled extensively to other parts of the world and in particular if they have the experience of having lived in another country for an extended period of time, has to recognize that here in the U.S. more than almost any other non third world country (and even in some of them) will a person be constantly in jeopardy of some type of harassment or wrong-doing from the "police!" Certainly this Swedish citizen would not want to visit the U.S. again, what rational person would after such treatment? In over forty years of travel throughout the world and the taking of thousands of photographs I have NEVER ONCE experienced the type of negative experience with local police wherever I happened to be that people experience thousands of times daily here in our home country! What's wrong with that picture?

Yesterday's post:

"Another example of what transpires on a daily basis in a "police state!" There are thousands of incidents every day and the vast majority of them unfortunately go unreported. An unarmed man was shot and killed by the police a week or so ago in Dallas, and after two days of reporting by the media, you don't hear another word about the autopsy/investigation results or about any action taken against the officer. It's just back to business as usual, another civilian casualty in the war against drugs! I would be willing to wager that if a statistician tallied up the civilian deaths incurred in this country as a result of the war against drugs, it would comprise a much larger number than our military has experienced from both Iraq wars and Afghanistan! IMHO this makes NO SENSE whatsoever!" :-( :-(

Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.

richnash46 wrote:

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

The man, 59 years old, a PhD, a pillar of his community in Sweden was visiting a friend, the nice lady I mentioned, in Florida. He carries his camera everywhere and takes as many as 100 photos/day, the best of which he posts; and has been posting on his website for years. The subjects are all over the place: including landscapes, street shots, architectural captures, and people . . . essentially anything he find interesting.

This tourist went out one day to an ocean front community, took a swim at the public beach and then sat on a wall, in his bathing suit, taking photos of "things". It was early and he was about 20 shots into his daily routine when the police came running up to him demanding his camera and memory card because he looked suspicious shooting from waist level using the articulating live view screen on the back of his camera. He relinquished the requested materials and was told he would be going to jail because he was now accused of pedophilia and perversion---one of the photos was of two young girls washing off in a very public shower/fountain. These girls were fully covered and were fully visible to anyone in the area, and, having seen the photo, were doing nothing even vaguely sensual. The man, who was interrogated for two hours at the beach and explained that he did not know American laws, in Europe he had taken shots at resort areas with no problems, that virtually everyone at a Beach walks around scantily dressed, that one of the earlier photos on the memory card was of two fat men washing sand off in the same shower/fountain, that he wanted to cooperate, that he would relinquish his laptop to prove there was nothing incriminating on it, and that the police were welcome to visit his website. The laptop was produced with difficulty since his friend had to drive it over from her home where he was visiting, the evidence was inspected, and the man was hauled off to jail - - - despite explaining that he had a return flight to Sweden scheduled for the next morning. He was charged with "disturbing the peace" (despite the police report that confirms he was doing nothing of the sort), apparently a catch-all that is used to describe anything the police do not like and to justify the time they spent investigating it , his camera and card was confiscated, his wallet taken, and his bail refused even though he had the cash ($25) on his person. He was detained over night, forced to miss his flight, never received any sort of apology, and eventually returned home without the confiscated equipment which was being held as evidence pending his return to answer the charges.

He now has his camera back in Sweden which had to be sent to him by his friend, but the memory card remains with the police. He sought legal help mainly because he is now afraid to ever travel back to this country with the pedophilia insinuations hanging over his head; and because the excessive actions by the police are a violation of numerous Constitutional Protections, more worthy of a Fascist State than the State of Florida. His lawyer, who is seeking to have all charges thrown out and then plans to sue for damages, has already run up bills of several thousand dollars, but is confident that his client will eventually walk away with a substantial award.

There must be something in the air in Florida, because this sort of thing is not an isolated matter. The Police do not appear to understand the differences between doing something that might be considered suspicious versus acting illegally. See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, t... (show quote)

I just posted this yesterday in reply to another post which clearly exemplifies that we here in the U.S. do indeed live in a "police state!" Anyone who has traveled extensively to other parts of the world and in particular if they have the experience of having lived in another country for an extended period of time, has to recognize that here in the U.S. more than almost any other non third world country (and even in some of them) will a person be constantly in jeopardy of some type of harassment or wrong-doing from the "police!" Certainly this Swedish citizen would not want to visit the U.S. again, what rational person would after such treatment? In over forty years of travel throughout the world and the taking of thousands of photographs I have NEVER ONCE experienced the type of negative experience with local police wherever I happened to be that people experience thousands of times daily here in our home country! What's wrong with that picture?

Yesterday's post:

"Another example of what transpires on a daily basis in a "police state!" There are thousands of incidents every day and the vast majority of them unfortunately go unreported. An unarmed man was shot and killed by the police a week or so ago in Dallas, and after two days of reporting by the media, you don't hear another word about the autopsy/investigation results or about any action taken against the officer. It's just back to business as usual, another civilian casualty in the war against drugs! I would be willing to wager that if a statistician tallied up the civilian deaths incurred in this country as a result of the war against drugs, it would comprise a much larger number than our military has experienced from both Iraq wars and Afghanistan! IMHO this makes NO SENSE whatsoever!" :-( :-(

quote=lesdmd If I hadn't seen the details, the po... (show quote)

It is sad, but ever since 911 we have willfully allowed this police state to develop thinking that would somehow keep us safe... Instead we have allowed ourselves to become victims of the state and of the politically correct attitude that is popular in our society.... It is true that we do not like sexual predators, but taking picts at the beach even of two young girls showering in the open public shower is not sexual predation.

Ben Franklin - "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

Here's a radical idea: Have the police solve crimes that already been committed rather than having them commit crimes themselves.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

Blurryeyed wrote:

It is sad, but ever since 911 we have willfully al... (show quote)

Maybe Congress can spend months debating a new law. At what age may people be photographed? Imagine the rhetoric that they could come up with for that.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

richnash46 wrote:

Yesterday's post: br br "Another example of ... (show quote)

And exactly what can we do about it? Zilch!

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

lesdmd wrote:

See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

Although the link is dated July, 2012, this is a very old story. It was discussed her quite a while ago.

richnash46 Loc: Texas

Blurryeyed wrote:

richnash46 wrote:

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

The man, 59 years old, a PhD, a pillar of his community in Sweden was visiting a friend, the nice lady I mentioned, in Florida. He carries his camera everywhere and takes as many as 100 photos/day, the best of which he posts; and has been posting on his website for years. The subjects are all over the place: including landscapes, street shots, architectural captures, and people . . . essentially anything he find interesting.

This tourist went out one day to an ocean front community, took a swim at the public beach and then sat on a wall, in his bathing suit, taking photos of "things". It was early and he was about 20 shots into his daily routine when the police came running up to him demanding his camera and memory card because he looked suspicious shooting from waist level using the articulating live view screen on the back of his camera. He relinquished the requested materials and was told he would be going to jail because he was now accused of pedophilia and perversion---one of the photos was of two young girls washing off in a very public shower/fountain. These girls were fully covered and were fully visible to anyone in the area, and, having seen the photo, were doing nothing even vaguely sensual. The man, who was interrogated for two hours at the beach and explained that he did not know American laws, in Europe he had taken shots at resort areas with no problems, that virtually everyone at a Beach walks around scantily dressed, that one of the earlier photos on the memory card was of two fat men washing sand off in the same shower/fountain, that he wanted to cooperate, that he would relinquish his laptop to prove there was nothing incriminating on it, and that the police were welcome to visit his website. The laptop was produced with difficulty since his friend had to drive it over from her home where he was visiting, the evidence was inspected, and the man was hauled off to jail - - - despite explaining that he had a return flight to Sweden scheduled for the next morning. He was charged with "disturbing the peace" (despite the police report that confirms he was doing nothing of the sort), apparently a catch-all that is used to describe anything the police do not like and to justify the time they spent investigating it , his camera and card was confiscated, his wallet taken, and his bail refused even though he had the cash ($25) on his person. He was detained over night, forced to miss his flight, never received any sort of apology, and eventually returned home without the confiscated equipment which was being held as evidence pending his return to answer the charges.

He now has his camera back in Sweden which had to be sent to him by his friend, but the memory card remains with the police. He sought legal help mainly because he is now afraid to ever travel back to this country with the pedophilia insinuations hanging over his head; and because the excessive actions by the police are a violation of numerous Constitutional Protections, more worthy of a Fascist State than the State of Florida. His lawyer, who is seeking to have all charges thrown out and then plans to sue for damages, has already run up bills of several thousand dollars, but is confident that his client will eventually walk away with a substantial award.

There must be something in the air in Florida, because this sort of thing is not an isolated matter. The Police do not appear to understand the differences between doing something that might be considered suspicious versus acting illegally. See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, t... (show quote)

I just posted this yesterday in reply to another post which clearly exemplifies that we here in the U.S. do indeed live in a "police state!" Anyone who has traveled extensively to other parts of the world and in particular if they have the experience of having lived in another country for an extended period of time, has to recognize that here in the U.S. more than almost any other non third world country (and even in some of them) will a person be constantly in jeopardy of some type of harassment or wrong-doing from the "police!" Certainly this Swedish citizen would not want to visit the U.S. again, what rational person would after such treatment? In over forty years of travel throughout the world and the taking of thousands of photographs I have NEVER ONCE experienced the type of negative experience with local police wherever I happened to be that people experience thousands of times daily here in our home country! What's wrong with that picture?

Yesterday's post:

"Another example of what transpires on a daily basis in a "police state!" There are thousands of incidents every day and the vast majority of them unfortunately go unreported. An unarmed man was shot and killed by the police a week or so ago in Dallas, and after two days of reporting by the media, you don't hear another word about the autopsy/investigation results or about any action taken against the officer. It's just back to business as usual, another civilian casualty in the war against drugs! I would be willing to wager that if a statistician tallied up the civilian deaths incurred in this country as a result of the war against drugs, it would comprise a much larger number than our military has experienced from both Iraq wars and Afghanistan! IMHO this makes NO SENSE whatsoever!" :-( :-(

quote=lesdmd If I hadn't seen the details, the po... (show quote)

It is sad, but ever since 911 we have willfully allowed this police state to develop thinking that would somehow keep us safe... Instead we have allowed ourselves to become victims of the state and of the politically correct attitude that is popular in our society.... It is true that we do not like sexual predators, but taking picts at the beach even of two young girls showering in the open public shower is not sexual predation.

Ben Franklin - "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

quote=richnash46 quote=lesdmd If I hadn't seen t... (show quote)

:thumbup: :thumbup:

richnash46 Loc: Texas

jerryc41 wrote:

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

Here's a radical idea: Have the police solve crimes that already been committed rather than having them commit crimes themselves.

:thumbup: :thumbup:

petermerny Loc: Whitby UK

Link to You Tube what happens in the UK when you try to photograph a factory

http://youtu.be/BjTBYdJwQ4I

altheman Loc: Christchurch, New Zealand

Shouldn't you guys be careful about what you saying. NSA and all that. Just saying

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

altheman wrote:

Shouldn't you guys be careful about what you saying. NSA and all that. Just saying

Yes, but it's too late now. :D

LaughBrian Loc: Tn

Blurryeyed wrote:

richnash46 wrote:

lesdmd wrote:

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, the victim's narrative, his web site, and his lawyers petition, I never would have believed the nice lady who related the story. I will exclude names to avoid prejudicing the case which is now going through the legal system.

The man, 59 years old, a PhD, a pillar of his community in Sweden was visiting a friend, the nice lady I mentioned, in Florida. He carries his camera everywhere and takes as many as 100 photos/day, the best of which he posts; and has been posting on his website for years. The subjects are all over the place: including landscapes, street shots, architectural captures, and people . . . essentially anything he find interesting.

This tourist went out one day to an ocean front community, took a swim at the public beach and then sat on a wall, in his bathing suit, taking photos of "things". It was early and he was about 20 shots into his daily routine when the police came running up to him demanding his camera and memory card because he looked suspicious shooting from waist level using the articulating live view screen on the back of his camera. He relinquished the requested materials and was told he would be going to jail because he was now accused of pedophilia and perversion---one of the photos was of two young girls washing off in a very public shower/fountain. These girls were fully covered and were fully visible to anyone in the area, and, having seen the photo, were doing nothing even vaguely sensual. The man, who was interrogated for two hours at the beach and explained that he did not know American laws, in Europe he had taken shots at resort areas with no problems, that virtually everyone at a Beach walks around scantily dressed, that one of the earlier photos on the memory card was of two fat men washing sand off in the same shower/fountain, that he wanted to cooperate, that he would relinquish his laptop to prove there was nothing incriminating on it, and that the police were welcome to visit his website. The laptop was produced with difficulty since his friend had to drive it over from her home where he was visiting, the evidence was inspected, and the man was hauled off to jail - - - despite explaining that he had a return flight to Sweden scheduled for the next morning. He was charged with "disturbing the peace" (despite the police report that confirms he was doing nothing of the sort), apparently a catch-all that is used to describe anything the police do not like and to justify the time they spent investigating it , his camera and card was confiscated, his wallet taken, and his bail refused even though he had the cash ($25) on his person. He was detained over night, forced to miss his flight, never received any sort of apology, and eventually returned home without the confiscated equipment which was being held as evidence pending his return to answer the charges.

He now has his camera back in Sweden which had to be sent to him by his friend, but the memory card remains with the police. He sought legal help mainly because he is now afraid to ever travel back to this country with the pedophilia insinuations hanging over his head; and because the excessive actions by the police are a violation of numerous Constitutional Protections, more worthy of a Fascist State than the State of Florida. His lawyer, who is seeking to have all charges thrown out and then plans to sue for damages, has already run up bills of several thousand dollars, but is confident that his client will eventually walk away with a substantial award.

There must be something in the air in Florida, because this sort of thing is not an isolated matter. The Police do not appear to understand the differences between doing something that might be considered suspicious versus acting illegally. See this link: http://www.murthalawfirm.com/mother-3-arrested-pictures-tourist-attraction-airport to discover how a mother with a point and shoot can be thought to be a terrorist.

If I hadn't seen the details, the police report, t... (show quote)

I just posted this yesterday in reply to another post which clearly exemplifies that we here in the U.S. do indeed live in a "police state!" Anyone who has traveled extensively to other parts of the world and in particular if they have the experience of having lived in another country for an extended period of time, has to recognize that here in the U.S. more than almost any other non third world country (and even in some of them) will a person be constantly in jeopardy of some type of harassment or wrong-doing from the "police!" Certainly this Swedish citizen would not want to visit the U.S. again, what rational person would after such treatment? In over forty years of travel throughout the world and the taking of thousands of photographs I have NEVER ONCE experienced the type of negative experience with local police wherever I happened to be that people experience thousands of times daily here in our home country! What's wrong with that picture?

Yesterday's post:

"Another example of what transpires on a daily basis in a "police state!" There are thousands of incidents every day and the vast majority of them unfortunately go unreported. An unarmed man was shot and killed by the police a week or so ago in Dallas, and after two days of reporting by the media, you don't hear another word about the autopsy/investigation results or about any action taken against the officer. It's just back to business as usual, another civilian casualty in the war against drugs! I would be willing to wager that if a statistician tallied up the civilian deaths incurred in this country as a result of the war against drugs, it would comprise a much larger number than our military has experienced from both Iraq wars and Afghanistan! IMHO this makes NO SENSE whatsoever!" :-( :-(

quote=lesdmd If I hadn't seen the details, the po... (show quote)

It is sad, but ever since 911 we have willfully allowed this police state to develop thinking that would somehow keep us safe... Instead we have allowed ourselves to become victims of the state and of the politically correct attitude that is popular in our society.... It is true that we do not like sexual predators, but taking picts at the beach even of two young girls showering in the open public shower is not sexual predation.

Ben Franklin - "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

quote=richnash46 quote=lesdmd If I hadn't seen t... (show quote)

You always seem to hit the nail on the head. I really enjoy reading anything you post. and sir you are right in saying 911 changed it all.. And i dont think it was all for the best.

Nikonhermit Loc: In This Place

It's not just the police. Even worse, it's the wannabe-police private security people. Not so long ago, I raised a simple, pocket-size point-and-shoot to take a picture of the new building in front of Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston. The security guy, who was directing traffic, simply yelled at me: "You can't take pictures here." This idiot (though a young, muscular idiot) had absolutely no idea that he was wrong, that I was standing in a public place, not obstructing traffic or interfering with anybody, and that too in a city where the courts had ruled that a photographer could even record police in the course of their duties. I did not have the time, so I let the matter go.

Nic42 Loc: Cardiff, Wales

Over this side of the pond the Metropolitan Police publish information for photographers regarding what powers the police actually have. Street photographers here tend to keep a copy with them so that if Mr Plod tries to exceed his authority they can show him what is permitted!