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Lightroom or photoshop
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Sep 16, 2018 08:12:26   #
dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl
 
out4life2016 wrote:
So after a year of just using the basic editing program that came with my computer I have decided to look into a more advanced photo editing program. My biggest reason is to have the ability to stack multiple exposures. Im really not into drastic computer created images but I want the ability to create an image that looks of a professional quality in color. I have been doing my research on the two but of course the videos only tell so much and move along very fast. Any advice would be helpful


Personally, I have subscribed to the Adobe Cloud ($9.99) per month since it was started.. Prior to that I had a retail copy of Adobe Lightroom... was the version prior to the "Cloud". Adobe provided several updates before the "Cloud" started... I subscribed to the Cloud Photography Plan and got Lightroom, Photoshop, ACR and a couple of other programs for my $10 per month. Last Year, I had a project that required the use of Dream Weaver and several other web development tools. I called Adobe and they upgraded my subscription to the full Cloud at the $65 per month price. I used that for 6 months then called Adobe again and they moved me back to the $9.99 Photography Plan.... This kept me from having to purchase a couple of thousand dollars worth of programs. For me, the Cloud is a good solution. Also, Adobe told me that if/and when I needed to, I could upgrade again... The point is that EVERYTHING resides on my computer.. the Cloud is just for updates and to use the "Cloud Storage" if you want to upload your work. I rarely use the Cloud Storage but I do like having the constant updates for all of my current Adobe software.. Lightroom CC, Lightroom CC Classic (this is the one that I use most), Photoshop, and Camera Raw CC. For me, the $9.99 is an easy budget item. It is roughly the same as a tank of gas for my motorcycle or a meal at McDonalds, Burger King or some other fast food place. And it is easily budgeted. It automatically comes out of my checking account once a month and I never worry about it. I did the full package purchase of Lightroom once and it was okay but that was Lightroom 4.3 or something and they updated it through LR 4.9 then I would have had to purchase LR 5.0 to get the new version. Now it is constantly updated and upgraded.

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Sep 16, 2018 08:38:06   #
Nikon1201
 
As they say , you can’t have one with the other. Lightroom is where all the magic happens . Someone might have to assist you in setting up LR but on e you have it you will. Ever look. Ack.

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Sep 16, 2018 09:08:36   #
sodapop Loc: Bel Air, MD
 
Lightroom and Photoshop subscription is a good deal in my opinion. Remember Classic is for Computers and CC is for Mobil Most of us have found that Lightroom is simply not a program that you can wade into with no instruction. You must check out someone who can clearly walk you through it, especially the cataloging part. Anthony Morganti is an excellent resource for that along with many others

out4life2016 wrote:
So after a year of just using the basic editing program that came with my computer I have decided to look into a more advanced photo editing program. My biggest reason is to have the ability to stack multiple exposures. Im really not into drastic computer created images but I want the ability to create an image that looks of a professional quality in color. I have been doing my research on the two but of course the videos only tell so much and move along very fast. Any advice would be helpful

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Sep 16, 2018 09:27:25   #
mizzee Loc: Boston,Ma
 
Adobe subscription. Lightroom has an easier learning curve. The subscription is updated regularly.

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Sep 16, 2018 09:36:08   #
NCMtnMan Loc: N. Fork New River, Ashe Co., NC
 
If you want to get your feet wet with Adobe, but not ready for the full subscription service, you can create an Adobe account and download and install Bridge. This will allow you to also download and install Camera RAW which is the backbone of all the RAW file editing in both LR and PS. Bridge does several of the file management tools that LR does as well.

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Sep 16, 2018 10:01:20   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
out4life2016 wrote:
So after a year of just using the basic editing program that came with my computer I have decided to look into a more advanced photo editing program. My biggest reason is to have the ability to stack multiple exposures. Im really not into drastic computer created images but I want the ability to create an image that looks of a professional quality in color. I have been doing my research on the two but of course the videos only tell so much and move along very fast. Any advice would be helpful


Ps & Lr together for a subscription, yes! But remember the stand alone purchased Photoshop Elements (PSE), unless they recently changed it is only for processing 8-bit image files. Not the 16-bit ones Ps & Lr work in. You can even create 32-bit PSD files with Ps!

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Sep 16, 2018 10:49:22   #
Domtom999
 
ronichas wrote:
An alternative to ps & lr is Skylum's Luminar. It is a one time charge. If interested you can use a trial to see if you like it. I have a discount code if interested, pm me.

https://skylum.com/luminar


If you go with Luminar you better try the trial first to see if it will run on your system. I bought Luminar a while ago, and the first free update they made stopped it from working on my system. I have a laptop, core i7 16 gl ram, 1 tb had. The problem is no separate video card. Though my gpu supports open gl 3.3, Luminar wouldn’t run. Skylum was reasonable about it and refunded my purchase price.

As an aside, I’ve noticed companies like topaz labs are building into their apps the capability of running thru the cpu, rather than the gpu, if the program won’t run. Maybe skylum would consider this to get more users. This work around runs slower, but at least gives you the option of being able to use the program until you have the hardware to run thru the gpu. Unfortunately with a laptop, upgrading the hardware usually means buying a new machine.

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Sep 16, 2018 10:55:12   #
Bike guy Loc: Atlanta
 
Luminar and ON 1 though a “one” time cost, charge for updates.

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Sep 16, 2018 10:59:13   #
Domtom999
 
Bike guy wrote:
Luminar and ON 1 though a “one” time cost, charge for updates.


Actually Luminar never charged me for an update. They advertised updates were free, but I don’t know how long that will last.

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Sep 16, 2018 11:50:30   #
Bike guy Loc: Atlanta
 
Domtom999 wrote:
Actually Luminar never charged me for an update. They advertised updates were free, but I don’t know how long that will last.


Interesting. I bought the 2017 version and had to pay an update for the 2018. I also bought the ON1 2017 and they charged for the 2018.
Oh well I won't pay for any more of those updates should they occur.

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Sep 16, 2018 12:02:49   #
Bike guy Loc: Atlanta
 
As mentioned in a previous post, I have a LR Photoshop plan, 10/month. I don't worry about it, updates come free and for nearly all of my work, that is all I need. I don't use Photoshop much, if at all, but do rely on PSE for things LR can't do.

And, my subscription works on my older PC and newer Mac.

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Sep 16, 2018 12:25:18   #
FiddleMaker Loc: Merrimac, MA
 
amfoto1 wrote:
Considering your level of experience, you might also want to look at Adobe Elements (currently version "2018", though they usually release a new version each Fall).

Elements is comprehensive and includes aspects of both Lightroom and Photoshop. It also has built in support.... a "guided" Beginner mode, less guided Intermediate mode and an unguided Expert mode. You choose which you want to use and can switch between them at any time. Elements is designed to be a stand alone program that's fairly easy to use and able to meet most peoples' actual image editing needs.

LR and PS actually are two different programs, designed to work together and complement each other. LR is primarily an organizing and archiving program, with light image editing and batch RAW conversion capabilities. It's not really designed to "finish" images to a high degree. PS is the "Mack Daddy" of all image editing and optimizing programs, highly complex and full featured for those purposes, but with minimal organizing and archiving capabilities. LR is designed to rapidly work through a large volume of images, spending only a few seconds to a couple minutes on each, sorting and selecting among them, adding keywords, building and maintaining your library of images, batch uploading proofs/thumbnails to online galleries, making catalogs or slide shows, etc. Photoshop is more "one image at a time", possibly spending hours working on it to fully finish it for high usage such as printing.

LR is fairly complex, but not bad and probably no more difficult to learn than Elements (though Elements contains more automation). With either of them, one or two books and a month or so working with them and you'll likely feel comfortable.

Photoshop is far more complex... I seriously doubt anyone actually uses all its features and capabilities. I've been working with it since version 4 in the mid-1990s and would guess I don't use more than about 20 or 25% of what it can do. With PS you should plan to buy a small stack of books, take a years worth of college level classes and probably spend most of a year óf regularly working with it to get truly comfortable.

Neither LR nor PS have any "built in support". You have to look elsewhere for guidance learning to use them. They also don't contain a whole lot of automation.

There is extensive outside support for all three... books, classes, online tutorials (best, IMO, to learn specific techniques... not for general learning and familiarization). There are also a variety of plug-ins for all three. Most for Photoshop, but also quite a few for LR and Elements.

Elements is sold outright... perpetually licensed... for about $90 (sometimes goes on sale for less). There are limited updates and usually a new version each year (which you don't need to update to unless you get a new camera that's not supported by an older version of Elements or unless the new one has some new features added that you want).

PS and LR are now only available via subscription.... $120 a year. You get them both for that (not available individually). If you let the subscription lapse, they stop working (but your images remain... though you may have trouble finding specific ones without your LR catalog).

Elements is referred to as an "8-bit" program. This means that it can only save 8-bit types of image files, once you are done post-processing them. LR and PS can provide 16-bit files.

Actually, at the core of all three is Adobe Camera Raw (ACR), used to convert camera RAW files into a usable format (assuming you set your camera to save RAW, in addition to or instead of JPEGs). This is fully integrated into both Elements and Lightroom. In order to update ACR in either of them, you have to update the entire program. Photoshop has a sub-module containing ACR... that can be updated separately.

When you work on a RAW file, all three treat it similarly. While there are a few functions that are not usable in Elements until an image has been converted to an 8-bit file, it's mostly just when you go to save the image that Elements limits you to 8-bit files such as JPEG or GIF or PNG and similar. Frankly, this is all most photographers ever actually need. JPEGs are required by a lot of printers and are the standard for online display, slide shows, email attachments and much more.

16-bit files which both LR and PS can produce (such as TIFF or PSD and similar) may be needed for commercial work. If wanting to close a file and re-open it for additional work later, it can be advantageous to save it in one or the other of the 16-bit formats. Sometimes a client specifies one of these formats so that additional work can be done on the image later, to suit their purposes.

You can download a 30-day trial of any of these direct from the Adobe website. That would be good with Elements, to see how you like it. 30-days might also be adequate to try out Lightroom. But in either case, for anyone who has never used them, I'd recommend buying in advance and at least scanning through one or more of the guide books for the specific program, and then keeping the book(s) handy to make best use of the trial period. I would not recommend trying to evaluate both at the same time. And a 30-day trial of Photoshop is probably not sufficient time for anyone other than experienced users. A new user would only be getting started and not really up to speed using it, in just 30 days.

Photoshop in its perpetually licensed version used to cost upwards of $600 for the initial full installation, then major version upgrades costing around $200 to $250 were rolled out every few years. Several years ago Adobe switched to the subscription only model with PS.... tried asking more at first, but finally ended up bundling it with LR for $10 a month (when you prepay for a year).

Lightroom hasn't been around as long, but went through 6 major versions, each selling for around $150, before it too was converted to only selling by subscription last year (and only bundled with PS). You'll hear various things about this from users... good and bad... about havign to subscribe. Using PS for nearly 25 years and LR since it was introduced, but only upgrading PS every other version... because it was being rapidly developed, LR more frequently (I think I only skipped one version)... my cost probably worked out about the same as what the subscription now costs. I budgeted roughly $350 every three years for PS and LR, before it went subscription-only.

At one time PS was pretty much "pro only", due to its initial cost. At 1/4 the price, Lightroom probably saw much wider sales, but was used by a lot of people as a stand-alone (which is possible, though pretty limiting). Now that the subscription sounds like a bargain (it's really no different for me), there are lots and lots of far less experienced buyers. There's been a huge increase in "help me with PS/LR" posts on photography forums the last few years. I can't help but wonder how many try PS... in particular... only to find it overwhelming and eventually give up or only use it in a very limited way. Adobe doesn't care... they've made a fortune with the subscription sales model and vastly expanded number of buyers... uh, subscribers, I guess! (Not "users"... because, who knows if they really do use it.)

Hope this helps you make a decision.
Considering your level of experience, you might al... (show quote)

Alan, real nice write-up where you compare the two products. I recently subscribed to Lr/Ps for $10 a month. I know nothing about Ps. Just Lr and I am only an intermediate user at that. But I learned what I know by watching these free internet-based tutorials.

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Sep 16, 2018 13:34:07   #
dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl
 
Bike guy wrote:
Interesting. I bought the 2017 version and had to pay an update for the 2018. I also bought the ON1 2017 and they charged for the 2018.
Oh well I won't pay for any more of those updates should they occur.


I bought the 2017 version... paid about $40 for the 2018 version.. used it for a while and then quit using it.. mainly because I was working on a project. Got the pre/upgrade to 2019 for about $40 then realized that my 2018 version quit working. I am working through that issue with Skylum but haven't resolved it yet.. I suspect it has to do with me replacing the motherboard, memory and Cpu on my computers but neither Skylum nor I can resolve it yet. Don't get me wrong, Aurora is a nice product and I want to use it... its just not working on my machine yet. Having said that, I use it with the Lightroom plugin and it works (worked) great. I am looking forward to the 2019 version and have it on 4 machines.. (note: the other 3 work fine which tends to support an issue with this cpu.)

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Sep 16, 2018 14:17:15   #
Georgeski
 
I have been using photoshop for thirty years to create layered images--using two or more source images; lightroom wouldn't d o you any good in this regard, as I understand it--hope this helps!

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Sep 16, 2018 18:05:09   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
out4life2016 wrote:
So after a year of just using the basic editing program that came with my computer I have decided to look into a more advanced photo editing program. My biggest reason is to have the ability to stack multiple exposures. Im really not into drastic computer created images but I want the ability to create an image that looks of a professional quality in color. I have been doing my research on the two but of course the videos only tell so much and move along very fast. Any advice would be helpful

It is not "Lightroom or Photoshop"! It is "Lightroom AND Photoshop". Both have their strengths and work together for a complete solution to photo editing.

You might also take a serious look at Affinity Photo. Highly rated on Apple platforms and recently released on Windows. It is very competitive to Photoshop and has some features beyond those in Photoshop.

bwa

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