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Full frame versus cropped camera
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Aug 28, 2018 15:25:40   #
wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado
 
Crombie wrote:
A few years back a client needed 30x40 color prints for display in the lobby of their City Hall. I'd shot with a humble MFT Panasonic G1 which was just fine for their website. I'm a pro and the JPEGs were good straight out the camera and the question was what would they look like as 30x40's???


There was a public reception gig and in attendance were members of the local camera club who had a close-up look and after critical examination I was asked if I'd shoot with a 4x5 camera and a news shooter with a brace of D4's flat-out questioned my honesty!

If a photographer is sloppy then RAW files from a FF camera will certainly help in corrective PP, a harsh judgement on my part but I'm too not far of the mark with this observation.
A few years back a client needed 30x40 color print... (show quote)


I know it is a bit of a side issue, but you and your client have added evidence of what Burkphoto, Cdouthitt, myself, and other 4/3rds users have been saying. One can buy a 4/3rds camera and still be capable of producing a perfectly acceptable 30 X 40 print. Quite a few UHHs do not believe a 4/3rds camera is capable of such.

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Aug 28, 2018 15:58:08   #
jwn Loc: SOUTHEAST GEORGIA USA
 
they like full frame.....because medium format is too expensive....

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Aug 28, 2018 16:25:33   #
wmurnahan Loc: Bloomington IN
 
I have both, an a7II and an a6500. Find I use the a6500 with my big lenses to get more reach and the a7ii with my normal and wide. I'm using the big lenses in good light, the a7ii always comes out for low light.

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Aug 28, 2018 16:26:33   #
gwilliams6
 
wdross wrote:
I know it is a bit of a side issue, but you and your client have added evidence of what Burkphoto, Cdouthitt, myself, and other 4/3rds users have been saying. One can buy a 4/3rds camera and still be capable of producing a perfectly acceptable 30 X 40 print. Quite a few UHHs do not believe a 4/3rds camera is capable of such.


I have seen excellent large prints and stunning video from micro 4/3rds cameras ,and I will never say they cant create professional quality images under the right conditions. Cheers

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Aug 28, 2018 18:23:18   #
ken_stern Loc: Yorba Linda, Ca
 
burkphoto wrote:
It costs more... has snob appeal for some.

It performs about one f/stop better in low light than APS-C (there’s less noise, better color) and nearly two stops better than Micro 4/3.

Manufacturers can cram more sensor sites on the imaging chip. This allows bigger prints, tighter cropping, or some of each.

You use a longer lens to get the same field of view at the same distance from a subject. This creates shallower depth of field at the same aperture.

These qualities may, or may not, appeal to you. FF gear is bigger and heavier than APS-C, and MUCH bigger and heavier than Micro 4/3. It is generally more expensive.

There is nothing wrong with any format, so long as it serves its purpose for your needs. Get what makes sense.

Most Photo Labs will tell you that <5% of prints sold are larger than 11x14. Over 90% of images are bound for Internet sharing sites (Facebook, Instagram, etc.). Few of us spend much of our time photographing in dark places.

That said, if you want room to crop, or if you make LARGE landscape images, or if you photograph scenes that will be printed huge and examined from a foot away, full frame gear becomes desirable.
It costs more... has snob appeal for some. br br... (show quote)


As he always does "burkphoto" has provided you with an excellent "why" full vs crop frame analyses ----
However he missed my reason for going full frame --- The lenses you already had -- In my case all but one lens was acquired when I shot slide film -- I had just purchased the 35mm 1.4 L & wanting to go digital but asked myself -- Would I pay $1300 for a 56mm lens? So I waited until Canon came out with the 5D MkII. I have no regrets - but - Without the existing lenses I probably would be just as happy with a Canon Crop Frame camera

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Aug 28, 2018 18:43:13   #
tomcat
 
With the new AI Gigapixel plugin from Topaz, the size of the sensor is now no longer relevant. 60" prints from a cellphone sensor. I'm going to charge up my Sony RX100MII battery and start taking it on trips again.

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Aug 28, 2018 18:50:42   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
I'd suggest that you check out the system requirements to run that software. https://help.topazlabs.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012811791

It takes a bit of horsepower to run that software. I've seen it used and it's impressive. However, I don't think you're going to be pleased with a cellphone 60" print. It does have its limits. Thus, I'm working on my own approach to large prints.
--Bob
tomcat wrote:
With the new AI Gigapixel plugin from Topaz, the size of the sensor is now no longer relevant. 60" prints from a cellphone sensor. I'm going to charge up my Sony RX100MII battery and start taking it on trips again.

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Aug 28, 2018 19:11:29   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
tomcat wrote:
With the new AI Gigapixel plugin from Topaz, the size of the sensor is now no longer relevant...


No sir. It’€™s not just about the size of the enlargement, it’s about the DR and noise/high ISO performance. Sensor size IS relevant, and size DOES matter with respect to sensors, no matter how much you don’t want to believe it. Here’s a graph of the DR of the Sony RX100 vs a FF Sony A9.



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Aug 28, 2018 19:24:32   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
duplicate

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Aug 28, 2018 19:30:56   #
ken_stern Loc: Yorba Linda, Ca
 
TriX wrote:
duplicate


By the way Trix -- Thanks for the info on M-Discs -- Updated my stuff & am now using them to archive my photos -- now - Need more folks to buy them to bring the price down
Again
THANKS
PS: SIZE MATTERS !!!

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Aug 28, 2018 19:32:46   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
ken_stern wrote:
By the way Trix -- Thanks for the info on M-Discs -- Updated my stuff & am now using them to archive my photos -- now - Need more folks to buy them to bring the price down
Again
THANKS
PS: SIZE MATTERS !!!


Thanks Ken, I’m doing my best (buying MDisks) 😺.

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Aug 28, 2018 19:56:00   #
gwilliams6
 
TriX wrote:
Thanks Ken, I’m doing my best (buying MDisks) 😺.


Want to get those M-Disks, my LG drives will burn them. Which ones are you folks using and where are you buying them from. Cheers

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Aug 28, 2018 20:16:33   #
tomcat
 
rmalarz wrote:
I'd suggest that you check out the system requirements to run that software. https://help.topazlabs.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012811791

It takes a bit of horsepower to run that software. I've seen it used and it's impressive. However, I don't think you're going to be pleased with a cellphone 60" print. It does have its limits. Thus, I'm working on my own approach to large prints.
--Bob


I wouldn't have believed it either, if I had not seen the demo. It does take horsepower if you process from a raw. But this demo used a jpg. It was the Topaz webinar from today with John Barclay. He took an iPhone image originally sized as a 2x3 and at the end had a 60" print size on the screen. With a discount, it's $80 and heck, I've wasted more than that on junky software before.

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Aug 28, 2018 20:20:16   #
tomcat
 
TriX wrote:
No sir. It’€™s not just about the size of the enlargement, it’s about the DR and noise/high ISO performance. Sensor size IS relevant, and size DOES matter with respect to sensors, no matter how much you don’t want to believe it. Here’s a graph of the DR of the Sony RX100 vs a FF Sony A9.


yeah, well there's always that situation on landscape photos, but this was an iPhone portrait of a little girl. The resulting 60" image scale-up from that iPhone image was stunning. If you were willing to live with the original DR deficiency of the RX100 sensor to begin with, then scaling it up to a larger print is not going to make any difference to you.

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Aug 28, 2018 20:21:31   #
tomcat
 
TriX wrote:
No sir. It’€™s not just about the size of the enlargement, it’s about the DR and noise/high ISO performance. Sensor size IS relevant, and size DOES matter with respect to sensors, no matter how much you don’t want to believe it. Here’s a graph of the DR of the Sony RX100 vs a FF Sony A9.


What is the source for this graph comparison? I want to see how my D3s compares to the D750--just for kicks. Thanks.

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