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Editing in a Nikon
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Apr 15, 2018 13:35:54   #
Acufine3200 Loc: Texarkana USA
 
Gene51 wrote:
(1) I've never bothered, tiny screens are not color corrected, too small to see any detail, very difficult to see if your edits make sense.
(2) No.
(3) Good question. My results are so much better after I have properly edited a raw file on my computer, I can't see myself using the camera to do this.

If I happen to have my Sony RX10M4, I will use the NFC sharing function to share a raw file to social media. Upon transfer, it will convert from .arw to .jpg according to my camera's setting.

I have no use for SOOC - my results are considerably better with raw, especially in high contrast or very low contrast lighting. Either way I always expose to protect highlights, similar to exposing to the right, which, in those two specific circumstances, would yield damn ugly jpgs that I would be ashamed to share...
(1) I've never bothered, tiny screens are not colo... (show quote)


Excellent example Gene51. Though I’m always impressed with the folk who can achieve vaguely similar shots SOOC, this illustrates good use of the creative tools many of us desired back in the film-only days. I’m not sure the second shot could be accomplished using in-camera editing tools. And if they do, why bother laboring with such a small screen? Just IMO.

That said, I’m sure there are those who need to produce shots on the fly, and must rely on in-camera editing. In that case—go for it—since a modicum of tools exists.

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Apr 15, 2018 15:39:42   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
The user can modify an image considerably in camera, but I suspect it only the jpg. My guess is that it does not affect the RAW file. I've tried various settings and none have changed the RAW in either my D700 or D800e just to see what happens. Essentially, nothing happens to the RAW file.

As for why brings to mind the adage, "just because one can do something doesn't mean they should".
--Bob

rehess wrote:
In another thread here, the OP asks about 'trimming' a photo while it is still in his Nikon D500. This leads me to three questions:

(1) how much can the user of a modern Nikon camera modify an image while it is still in his/her camera?

(2) does this affect the NEF version of an image or just the JPEG version?

(3) why would someone spend valuable time in the field doing such a thing when s/he could do it later on a much larger screen??

Reply
Apr 15, 2018 15:55:47   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
Gene51 wrote:
(1) I've never bothered, tiny screens are not color corrected, too small to see any detail, very difficult to see if your edits make sense.
(2) No.
(3) Good question. My results are so much better after I have properly edited a raw file on my computer, I can't see myself using the camera to do this.

If I happen to have my Sony RX10M4, I will use the NFC sharing function to share a raw file to social media. Upon transfer, it will convert from .arw to .jpg according to my camera's setting.

I have no use for SOOC - my results are considerably better with raw, especially in high contrast or very low contrast lighting. Either way I always expose to protect highlights, similar to exposing to the right, which, in those two specific circumstances, would yield damn ugly jpgs that I would be ashamed to share.

Also, when I am in the field and do multi-row panos, which is fairly often, I can't do any adjusting in camera.

Here is an example of a high contrast shot, high contrast, and adjusted in post processing, and you can see why the SOOC image would not do me any good, not to mention that this is a 3 row pano, 5 shots each row.

It's the reason I abandoned jpgs out of camera 12 yrs ago, and never take raw + jpg. As you can see the raw file has all the info I need. If it was shot as jpg with a single lens, there is no way any in-camera setting could give me this result. I suppose the SOOC crowd will double down and either like the first unaltered image, or simply declare it to be an exposure mistake and not worth spending less than 10 minutes to make any adjustments (I may have spent less time) - and ending up deleting it.

Shooting raw opens up a whole other range of creative possibilities that just don't work with SOOC. I recently looked at camera review on Ken Rockwell's site, and was quickly reminded why I don't use SOOC. His stuff is downright ugly - oversaturated, super blown highlights with false colors in them, and either noisy or lacking fine detail due to high noise reduction settings. Ugly indeed . . .

.
(1) I've never bothered, tiny screens are not colo... (show quote)


Nicely done Gene.

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Apr 15, 2018 16:06:32   #
ecurb1105
 
via the lens wrote:
I can never figure out why photographers on this site appear to be so judgmental and so narrowly focused (no pun intended, actually) on what they do and why it is the only way to do things, this in reference to #3. I say this in spite of agreeing with you on this point but I really don't care why other photographers do what they do as long as it does not affect me in some way. We are all different and I respect that, even when I don't think it is the best approach or agree with it.

1) As much as the camera software allows (which may depend on the camera) if that is their preference.
2) The camera creates and works on a JPEG version.
3) It is beyond my knowledge what special use or requirements a photographer might have, but I'm fairly certain someone would most likely do this at some point in time for some good reason unknown to me.
I can never figure out why photographers on this s... (show quote)


The great thing about our hobby, profession, obsession is the infinite number of ways to capture or create images. After fifty years of photography I'm still learning.

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Apr 15, 2018 16:47:46   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
FiddleMaker wrote:
Wow, incredible, Gene - the SOOC versus edited.
I am using a stand-alone version Lightroom 5.7 but I really need to upgrade to something more current such as Lightroom Classic CC, for example. But I am afraid that there will be a conflict with my current Lightroom 5 Catalog with any new catalogs that would be associated with a subscription version of Lightroom. Of course, all I would need to do is speak with someone at Adobe about this.


Thanks!

There won't be a conflict, but once you commit to the LR7, the catalog will be copied and the new version will be converted to LR7's version of the catalog. You will still be able to open your old catalog with LR 5. That would be pointless. I just move to the new version, replacing the old one. You don't need to call Adobe - this is how it has worked through all the previous upgrades - which I have done since LR 3.

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Apr 15, 2018 16:48:00   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
joer wrote:
Nicely done Gene.


Thanks!

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Apr 15, 2018 16:48:49   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
ecurb1105 wrote:
The great thing about our hobby, profession, obsession is the infinite number of ways to capture or create images. After fifty years of photography I'm still learning.


I've been at it 51 yrs, and I feel exactly the same way - not a day goes by - literally - that I don't learn something new about photography.

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Apr 15, 2018 16:59:26   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Acufine3200 wrote:
Excellent example Gene51. Though I’m always impressed with the folk who can achieve vaguely similar shots SOOC, this illustrates good use of the creative tools many of us desired back in the film-only days. I’m not sure the second shot could be accomplished using in-camera editing tools. And if they do, why bother laboring with such a small screen? Just IMO.

That said, I’m sure there are those who need to produce shots on the fly, and must rely on in-camera editing. In that case—go for it—since a modicum of tools exists.
Excellent example Gene51. Though I’m always i... (show quote)


I cannot imagine any scenario that can create an image like the one I posted within a camera, or with a SOOC approach. The fact that it is a 12,939x10,204 px - or 132 mp image - taken with a 36 mp camera is the first thing. Then the various manipulations to dodge and burn both color and tone into the shadows, and add structure to the sky - all local adjustments, would not have been possible, even in the days of film, at last not on a color image, much less a digital SOOC image. Cameras cannot be made to respond to the wide variety of tone and color selectively - with simple, coarse camera settings, or even with some very coarse editing.

BTW, this was my final image, which came after a first scouting trip a couple of days earlier. It took me a couple of shots to get to the composition I was looking for, but the sky was wrong and too distracting. I came back two days later and everything, including the sky was as I wanted it to be. Luckily this is about 40 mins from my home. See attached below.

.


(Download)


(Download)

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Apr 15, 2018 17:32:27   #
adamsg Loc: Chubbuck, ID
 
Beautiful photographs!!!

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Apr 15, 2018 17:35:19   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
Gene51 wrote:
I cannot imagine any scenario that can create an image like the one I posted within a camera, or with a SOOC approach. The fact that it is a 12,939x10,204 px - or 132 mp image - taken with a 36 mp camera is the first thing. Then the various manipulations to dodge and burn both color and tone into the shadows, and add structure to the sky - all local adjustments, would not have been possible, even in the days of film, at last not on a color image, much less a digital SOOC image. Cameras cannot be made to respond to the wide variety of tone and color selectively - with simple, coarse camera settings, or even with some very coarse editing.

BTW, this was my final image, which came after a first scouting trip a couple of days earlier. It took me a couple of shots to get to the composition I was looking for, but the sky was wrong and too distracting. I came back two days later and everything, including the sky was as I wanted it to be. Luckily this is about 40 mins from my home. See attached below.

.
I cannot imagine any scenario that can create an i... (show quote)

My original thought was that artists like you need a very precise view of the image, and I don't see your getting that from any camera. In-camera processing has traditionally worked for automated activities, where humans provide direction, but not detailed control.

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Apr 15, 2018 21:28:17   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
adamsg wrote:
Beautiful photographs!!!


Thanks!

Reply
 
 
Apr 15, 2018 22:03:00   #
Jules Karney Loc: Las Vegas, Nevada
 
rehess wrote:
In another thread here, the OP asks about 'trimming' a photo while it is still in his Nikon D500. This leads me to three questions:

(1) how much can the user of a modern Nikon camera modify an image while it is still in his/her camera?

(2) does this affect the NEF version of an image or just the JPEG version?

(3) why would someone spend valuable time in the field doing such a thing when s/he could do it later on a much larger screen??


Try to get it right in the camera and minimum editing.

Reply
Apr 15, 2018 22:05:10   #
Jules Karney Loc: Las Vegas, Nevada
 
Gene51 wrote:
I cannot imagine any scenario that can create an image like the one I posted within a camera, or with a SOOC approach. The fact that it is a 12,939x10,204 px - or 132 mp image - taken with a 36 mp camera is the first thing. Then the various manipulations to dodge and burn both color and tone into the shadows, and add structure to the sky - all local adjustments, would not have been possible, even in the days of film, at last not on a color image, much less a digital SOOC image. Cameras cannot be made to respond to the wide variety of tone and color selectively - with simple, coarse camera settings, or even with some very coarse editing.

BTW, this was my final image, which came after a first scouting trip a couple of days earlier. It took me a couple of shots to get to the composition I was looking for, but the sky was wrong and too distracting. I came back two days later and everything, including the sky was as I wanted it to be. Luckily this is about 40 mins from my home. See attached below.

.
I cannot imagine any scenario that can create an i... (show quote)


Beautiful work Gene. Should be postcards.

Reply
Apr 15, 2018 22:49:00   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
rehess wrote:
In another thread here, the OP asks about 'trimming' a photo while it is still in his Nikon D500. This leads me to three questions:

(1) how much can the user of a modern Nikon camera modify an image while it is still in his/her camera?

(2) does this affect the NEF version of an image or just the JPEG version?

(3) why would someone spend valuable time in the field doing such a thing when s/he could do it later on a much larger screen??


In to another spin, I can PP even someone else's pseudo-SOOC JPEG into a better image with Ps. And I'm not in to heavy effects at all. I say someone else and Jpg because those are the only files like that I get, I shoot Raw myself.

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Apr 16, 2018 05:06:56   #
FiddleMaker Loc: Merrimac, MA
 
Gene51 wrote:
Thanks!

There won't be a conflict, but once you commit to the LR7, the catalog will be copied and the new version will be converted to LR7's version of the catalog. You will still be able to open your old catalog with LR 5. That would be pointless. I just move to the new version, replacing the old one. You don't need to call Adobe - this is how it has worked through all the previous upgrades - which I have done since LR 3.

Thanks, Gene. My plan is to subscribe to plan rather than purchase a stand-alone product . I am considering Lightroom Classic CC for $10 a month.

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