Rongnongno Loc: FL

She is a MD, general practitioner in London, UK.

[6:58:24 PM] CS Filipact: Morning
[6:58:38 PM] english_wolf: Evening.
[6:58:55 PM] english_wolf: Do you have somewhere to go and to meed for this long period?
[6:59:08 PM] CS Filipact: Meed?
[6:59:27 PM] english_wolf: Meet, sorry.
[6:59:50 PM] CS Filipact: No, I'm working this weekend.
[7:00:24 PM] CS Filipact: In fact I'd be sleeping by now, if my neighbours hadn't the music so loud.
[7:00:33 PM] CS Filipact: What are you up to?
[7:01:19 PM] english_wolf: Writing god ans testimony
[7:01:24 PM] english_wolf: oops
[7:01:36 PM] english_wolf: Writing about god and testimony.
[7:01:45 PM] CS Filipact: testimony?
[7:02:00 PM] english_wolf: Yes, testimony. Witnessing.
[7:02:09 PM] CS Filipact: Witnessing what?
[7:02:22 PM] english_wolf: God's existence.
[7:02:32 PM] CS Filipact: Oh boy...
[7:02:42 PM] CS Filipact: Never took you for a believer.
[7:02:49 PM] english_wolf: laughing at your reaction.
[7:02:58 PM] CS Filipact: Why is that?
[7:03:00 PM] english_wolf: Well, no one does.
[7:03:58 PM] english_wolf: Your reaction created a chuckle, a happy chuckle.
[7:04:58 PM] CS Filipact: I can't see the connection, but hey, if it makes you happy...
[7:05:22 PM] english_wolf: It does.
[7:05:31 PM] CS Filipact: Good for you.
[7:05:43 PM] english_wolf: You read..... upset.
[7:06:01 PM] CS Filipact: More like puzzled.
[7:06:20 PM] CS Filipact: I don't see why my reaction makes you chuckle.
[7:07:02 PM] english_wolf: It felt... like "Oh boy, another lunatic". That makes me chuckle.
[7:07:19 PM] CS Filipact: Oops, could you tell? :p
[7:07:26 PM] english_wolf: Yup.
[7:07:36 PM] english_wolf: Hence my laughter.
[7:08:26 PM] CS Filipact: Well, yeah... when I see the words "god" and "testimony" in one sentence...
[7:08:39 PM] CS Filipact: The paradox is just so obvious.
[7:08:51 PM] english_wolf: Is it?
[7:09:04 PM] CS Filipact: Of course.
[7:09:23 PM] CS Filipact: How can there be a testimony on something which... there is no evidence of?
[7:09:56 PM] english_wolf: What evidence do you need to believe in anything?
[7:10:12 PM] CS Filipact: Evidence that it exists.
[7:10:51 PM] english_wolf: Oh. So for you something does not exist because you do not have a proof. right?
[7:10:58 PM] CS Filipact: Otherwise it's just wishful thinking.
[7:11:12 PM] CS Filipact: No, I didn't say that.
[7:11:20 PM] english_wolf: Do you believe me when I say I am a Christian?
[7:11:26 PM] CS Filipact: Yes
[7:11:31 PM] english_wolf: Why?
[7:11:45 PM] CS Filipact: Because that is your choice.
[7:11:55 PM] CS Filipact: Albeit a surprising one, to say the least.
[7:12:37 PM] english_wolf: I could be lying. You have no proof that I tell the truth yet you believe me.
[7:12:57 PM] CS Filipact: Oh god...
[7:13:10 PM] CS Filipact: Are you seriously establishing a parallel here?
[7:13:16 PM] english_wolf: Really? 'Oh god?' laughing
[7:13:40 PM] english_wolf: Yes, I am. You believe what I typed with no proof.
[7:13:54 PM] english_wolf: Damned fingers (misspellings I corrected a few when posting here)
[7:14:17 PM] CS Filipact: If you tell me you're a Christian, I can believe it.
[7:14:26 PM] CS Filipact: It's just a mindset.
[7:14:42 PM] CS Filipact: If you tell me god exists, that that's a whole other story.
[7:14:52 PM] CS Filipact: Btw, ARE you Christian?!
[7:14:59 PM] english_wolf: What is your proof that it is my mindset?
[7:15:20 PM] english_wolf: And Yes, I am, of the worst kind according to other Christians.
[7:15:26 PM] CS Filipact: Well, I have as much proof of it as of anything else you say.
[7:16:07 PM] CS Filipact: Come on man, you're a grown man. How can you believe in that Christian mambo jumbo?
[7:16:31 PM] CS Filipact: I mean, it's one thing to believe in god.
[7:16:42 PM] CS Filipact: Another to believe in religion.
[7:17:30 PM] english_wolf: Oh, you got that right. I am totally against religion AND the 'mambo jumbo' that comes with it.
[7:17:47 PM] CS Filipact: So how can you define yourself as Christian?
[7:18:12 PM] english_wolf: Good question. Faith in the impossible at first...
[7:18:37 PM] CS Filipact: You do realize that doesn't make any sense, right?
[7:18:45 PM] english_wolf: Yup.
[7:18:51 PM] CS Filipact: OK...
[7:19:40 PM] english_wolf: No more questions?
[7:19:56 PM] CS Filipact: I'm just baffled.
[7:20:21 PM] CS Filipact: I mean, you realize it doesn't make sense and still persist with it.
[7:20:38 PM] CS Filipact: It's beyond my comprehension.
[7:21:35 PM] english_wolf: Well, that is the whole point of beliefs based on faith. Your comprehension is not faulty, far from it. It is.... Reasonable.
[7:22:10 PM] CS Filipact: Yes, but that still doesn't explain you being Christian.
[7:23:15 PM] english_wolf: Oh? If I believed in let's see... Oh, that the planet is flat, it would be more acceptable despite the proof that it is not?
[7:24:23 PM] CS Filipact: It's not the belief in god per se, it's the belief in the Christian "theories" (if they might be called that)
[7:25:40 PM] english_wolf: Every belief accepted on faith does not have theories but certitudes based on... personal experience hence on testimony.
[7:26:49 PM] CS Filipact: Yes, but why Christian in particular?
[7:27:13 PM] CS Filipact: Gee, could it be because that was your cultural background?
[7:27:29 PM] CS Filipact: (think)
[7:27:36 PM] english_wolf: Nope. I could not care less about god at the time.
[7:27:56 PM] CS Filipact: I'm not talking about god, but about Christianity.
[7:27:59 PM] english_wolf: Sorry for the misspellings.
[7:28:37 PM] english_wolf: So, for you Christ does not exist but other do and those gods are based on sociology?
[7:29:30 PM] CS Filipact: No, I'm saying you believe in Christ because you come from a Christian background.
[7:30:06 PM] english_wolf: Actually no. I hate religion and everything that was taught under 'christ' pretense.
[7:30:24 PM] CS Filipact: But you still believe in it.
[7:30:46 PM] english_wolf: Going back to your 'sociological logic'... Are you aware of the 'cargo cult' that started in the pacific during WWII?
[7:31:34 PM] english_wolf: No. I did not believe in Christ then. I did not believe in anything other than 'What the hell I am doing on this freaking planet?'
[7:32:03 PM] CS Filipact: Yes, but that doesn't stop you from being influenced by it.
[7:32:47 PM] english_wolf: That is your 'reason' that says that. You try to find a justification for my belief. A justification that the would help you deny it.
[7:33:16 PM] CS Filipact: Deny what?
[7:33:22 PM] CS Filipact: I'm not trying to deny anything.
[7:33:40 PM] english_wolf: That I can believe in Christ all by myself w/o the help of sociology.
[7:34:29 PM] CS Filipact: Well, if of all religions you pick that one in particular.
[7:34:48 PM] CS Filipact: It's clearly because it's the closest to your cultural background.
[7:34:53 PM] CS Filipact: It's normal.
[7:35:10 PM] CS Filipact: Though nonsensical.
[7:35:14 PM] english_wolf: lol, right. Sorry, santa is normal. Christ is not.
[7:35:29 PM] CS Filipact: Who's talking about santa?
[7:35:57 PM] english_wolf: Because it is also part of the 'ritual' surrounding western civilization.
[7:36:37 PM] CS Filipact: Yes, it is. But you didn't mention anything about him. Only about this so-called Christ.
[7:36:55 PM] english_wolf: Why so-called?
[7:38:27 PM] CS Filipact: Because removed from its Christian context - in which you said you don't believe - he becomes just a random hypothetical dude called Christ .
[7:38:48 PM] english_wolf: Exactly, he was a random dude.
[7:39:03 PM] CS Filipact: You don't even know if he existed.
[7:39:11 PM] english_wolf: As to hypothetical, this is where faith enters.
[7:39:23 PM] CS Filipact: Lol
[7:39:23 PM] english_wolf: this is
[7:39:35 PM] CS Filipact: sure, faith is the answer to everything...
[7:39:43 PM] english_wolf: Nope, it is not.
[7:39:51 PM] english_wolf: Faith is not the answer.
[7:41:08 PM] CS Filipact: Well, if it brings you comfort now that you're approaching your final decades...
[7:41:46 PM] english_wolf: Oh, it is not about my final decade. I converted in March 1981.... Decades ago.
[7:42:09 PM] CS Filipact: Converted? Did you belong to another religion?
[7:42:22 PM] english_wolf: Nope, as I said, I did not.
[7:42:38 PM] CS Filipact: Than you didn't really "convert".
[7:43:26 PM] english_wolf: I meant converted. There is no error here. If you do not believe in anything and suddenly you do, you convert. You become a convert. You converted.
[7:44:09 PM] english_wolf: Funny thought.
[7:44:18 PM] CS Filipact: Can you not believe in god without converting to anything?
[7:44:28 PM] english_wolf: Uh?
[7:45:00 PM] CS Filipact: You don't need to be Christian in order to believe in a social construct as is the idea of god.
[7:45:32 PM] english_wolf: God is a social construct???????????
[7:45:46 PM] CS Filipact: I think that's pretty obvious.
[7:46:06 PM] CS Filipact: You just have to look at the way it is generally depicted.
[7:46:19 PM] CS Filipact: As a white bearded white man...
[7:46:25 PM] CS Filipact: (oh... the cliché)
[7:46:28 PM] CS Filipact: :D
[7:46:38 PM] english_wolf: Well, think about what you are typing. If it is a social construct as you said, how did you escape it? By not believing in fairy tells, right?
[7:47:01 PM] english_wolf: Actually I do not represent god at all. I have no clue.
[7:47:22 PM] CS Filipact: Nobody does.
[7:47:37 PM] english_wolf: Nobody does not do what?
[7:47:43 PM] CS Filipact: have a clue
[7:48:01 PM] english_wolf: Exactly. That is why faith cannot be shared.
[7:48:36 PM] CS Filipact: Yes, you're free to have faith in whatever.
[7:49:02 PM] english_wolf: (thank you for that, freedom - some Christians do not even allow that)
[7:49:34 PM] CS Filipact: One more reason for you not to declare yourself one of them.
[7:50:43 PM] english_wolf: Oh? How so? Because some lunatics try to force other to fold into a mold called 'religion'? Sorry, my belief, my faith, is personal. No one can influence it.
[7:51:11 PM] CS Filipact: If you believe in Christ...
[7:51:22 PM] CS Filipact: It is fair to say you're a Christian.
[7:51:32 PM] CS Filipact: even if you don't follow all their precepts
[7:52:05 PM] english_wolf: err... This is not what I said.... Being a Christian involves believing in Christ, nothing else.
[7:52:31 PM] CS Filipact: That's what I just said.
[7:53:11 PM] english_wolf: No, you try to detach me from the core belief involved in believing Christ is the son of god.
[7:53:29 PM] CS Filipact: No, I actually didn't.
[7:53:54 PM] CS Filipact: But since you bring it into the discussion, you have to admit that doesn't sound very plausible.
[7:54:03 PM] english_wolf: Right.
[7:54:08 PM] CS Filipact: But hey, as you said, it's a matter of faith!
[7:54:20 PM] english_wolf: Right again.
[7:55:32 PM] english_wolf: I cannot use my faith to convert anyone.
[7:55:55 PM] CS Filipact: No, you can't.
[7:56:02 PM] english_wolf: Right.
[7:56:11 PM] CS Filipact: Anyway, good luck with all that.
[7:56:16 PM] CS Filipact: I'm off to sleep now.
[7:56:20 PM] CS Filipact: Night night.
[7:56:36 PM] english_wolf: Yup. Think about this crazy conversation.
[7:56:46 PM] english_wolf: Good night and all that.
[7:56:58 PM] CS Filipact: I prefer not to. :D
[7:57:10 PM] english_wolf: Why? Chicken!