bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

OK, I was using Lightroom to project photos during sales sessions, and had some success with showing people how good the prints looked REALLY large at 40x50 or 40x60, then I would get out an 8x10 sample and show them what their "large" print would look like. Not belittling the 8x10 at all, but once they were used to seeing the 40x60 proofs, the 8x10 that School photographers, Walmart and Sears conditioned people into thinking an 8x10 was a "wall portrait.

Well, I had a "reveal" session on Saturday. I never discouraged the matriarch of the family when she kept referring to wanting an 8x10 for the wall, and maybe some wallets to give to relatives.

I downloaded the VERY expensive Proselect Pro trial version, and the (about half as much) fundy trial version for portrait sales.

After spending a couple of days going through video tutorials, I decided that the proselect was the one that I was going to use for this "reveal" (sales) meeting.

Anyway, this is how the reveal went.

They live about an hour away, close to where I was going anyway, so I offered to meet them at their home, instead of them coming to see me. I brought my projector, and a home made (very "crappily made" by me) 40x60 picture frame, with a high resolution movie screen stapled inside it. ($5 from ebay used)

I leaned it on the back of the sofa onto their wall as straight up as I could get it. And set up the projector and sized it to fit exactly in the frame using the TV tray that I brought as a projector screen. Sound like a lot of work? Not really, took like 3 minutes to set it all up, 2 trips to the car...

So after we all get situated, and make sure the light is as dim as we could get it (curtains pulled, lights off, but still a little bright) I started the slideshow of the images. Because there were 3 families total in this group, there were more photos than I normally like to do during a reveal. There were 60 total images, and I was afraid that it may be waaay to many to get any choices, but I figured I needed to give the Proselect a fair trial before purchasing it.

They enjoyed the "VERY BASIC" slideshow. I told them not to try to pick favorites or anything, just enjoy the slideshow. I got lots of "ooh's and ah's, and the ones that made me really happy were the "awww's"

After the slideshow, I asked if they were ready to work? They agreed. All they had to do as I went through each photo was say "yes, no or maybe" Went super fast. I wanted to hear their first kneejerk thoughts, to cull out some from each grouping. (would have been better to do this with each family, but it was one extended family, so....)

After the initial cull, we had it cut in 1/2, which was manageable. I deleted (from proselect, not from the hard drive) all the "no's", so they wouldn't be a distraction.) All the time, they were seeing the photos at 40x60. If there were any that were hard to see, it was easy to zoom in, or to let them look at the laptop screen, but I avoided that, because I wanted them used to the large size. We narrowed it down for each family.

the next part was absolutely awesome. I said, OK, this is the one you chose for your 8x10, and I projected it (using the software, no need to move the projector) at 8x10 on that huge screen. Immediately, they all said "how much is the big one?" The program is the best salesman ever. The beauty was, that I suggested that we take away the "distracting frame" and use their wall instead, and I was able to project entire wall layouts, including frames and mats, at the correct size, right above their sofa.

They didn't order my $3000 40x60 (Cliff and Ed, don't yell at me for my prices. I know I'm low, since I'm just a weekend warrior, but it's a far cry from what others spend), but what I was able to sell to the family elders was a wall grouping with 20x30's, some 16x20's and a couple of small 11x14's. The "kids" ordered 16x20's. All told, even though they want to get their own "hobby lobby" frames, after supplying the mounted photos, I made enough to pay for my $700 Proselect, and also help with some of my mounting expenses from recovering from the flood.

I honestly think that had I not done projection sales, I probably would have just sold the 8x10, and the kids would have wanted either digital copies, or would have scanned "mom's" 8x10 and made their own. Had I not tried out Proselect, and just used Lightroom, I may have only sold one 16x20 or maybe 20x30.

Projection sales seems at first to be a lot of work and preparation. (this, by far was the easiest set up, and I'm not very tech savvy) But I do feel that you can either approach it with a "I don't want to bother with any service after taking the photo," or you can exceed expectations by showing what they can do, and by showing them that the "big" 8x10 is more suited to sitting on a desk that hung on a wall, unless it's part of a grouping.

I can tell you that I'm not in the league with Ed. or Cliff (Captn. C), but I'm "OK" as a photographer. My service is what allows me to get a decent fee. Handing someone a disk with hundreds of photos to choose from, is not doing anyone a service. Can you imagine how many shoot and burn jobs I would have to do to make over $2000? I'd rather do one, and do it very well, and exceed their expectations, than do 50, always be rushed to get all the editing done, and make $50-$75.

Fundy and proselect will both allow you to take a photo of someone's wall with something with a known measurement, then you can show the photos on the wall of their home so you can see what a certain size would look like, but actually seeing something at that size projected, instead of seeing a tiny representation takes it to the next level. That's what Fundy doesn't do, that I could tell. I also didn't find it as user friendly, but I also read reviews that said Fundy is easier, so I would suggest that you try both out, and see if one or the other would work for you.

No matter what you try, I suggest you sell PRINTS. Data gets corrupted, computers crash, cloud companies have gone bankrupt and gone out of business. Wall portraits are the real benefit we can give our clients.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

When in DC and dealing with clients that could afford it my partner and I printed a 30x40 of portraits on canvas, individual or group. 'Loaned' the print for thirty days. Nine times out of ten this was a sale.

The projection as you mention does not have the same impact, even it does influence the buyer. We did the projection in studio and indeed this increases the sales, just not of the big ticket items.

CaptainC Loc: Colorado, south of Denver

Good for you! I have been using ProSelect for 6 or 7 years now and it does the work. Slideshow, the ability to project at actual size, showing two-up, three-up, four-up, showing collections, etc. make it worth every penny.

I go to their home, take the laptop, projector, and a 50" screen along with samples of all the display options. People love that I come to them and they do not have to travel. You are on the right path!

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

So Cliff, my homemade screen is horrible. My next investment will be a better screen. Can you give me some guidance? Is yours the kind that pulls out like the old window blinds, or is it in a frame with easel? (I was going to bring the easel, but forgot it in my garage)

After this last sale, I want to up my game as far as the presentation part.

Thanks!
Bob

CaptainC Loc: Colorado, south of Denver

Pretty sure this is the screen I use:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/15214-REG/Da_Lite_40114_40114_Picture_King_Tripod.html

The way I made my choice was to measure how much room I had in my vehicle and then order the largest screen whose folded length would fit. Turns out it was the 50 inch size. It goes up and down in seconds.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

OK, Thanks Cliff.
That looks a lot like the one I cut up to make my crappy frame one. Only did it because it was a garage sale item, that when I pulled it down, I couldn't get it to go back up. It was riveted and crimped together, so I decided to do "surgery"

I was wondering if anyone used a self supported stand. It makes sense, because when leaning it on the back of a sofa, even with keystone correction, it's hard to get a good crisp focus. Even with the rubber feet I put on the back, I'm also nervous about scratching someone's wall. I figure I can try to fix up my horrible frame for home, and get a "travel" screen for in home reveals.

I'll check that one out. (special order on B&H, so no price, but one more sale like the last one, and it will be paid off, no matter how much it costs.)

I appreciate the help.
Bob

CaptainC Loc: Colorado, south of Denver

If you click on the "Add to Cart" you can see the price. I think it is $137.00.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

That's not bad at all. Thanks.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

I have been using proof projection as a sales tool since 1970. I started off with a simple opaque projector to show my 5x5 and 4x5 ordinary proofs. I tried, for a time, making “Trans-Proofs”, those were print film slides made from my color negatives. Yet another method was to make 8x10 print proofs and use my 8x10 opaque projector- the image quality was incredible and after selling large wall portraits, the 8x10s sold very well in albums and as gift prints. Nowadays, of course, we use digital projection.

The equipment and the method, however, is not the crux of the matter- it's the sales strategy that makes the difference in selling large wall portraits, “galleries” of mixed sizes and what we call “family walls”.

I seldom conduct my proof presentations in my clients' homes in that I have a viewing and projection room in my studio. The process of encouraging larger portrait sales, however, starts much earlier in the client relationship. My first rule of thumb is “ you can't sell what you don't show”! I display large portraits in a variety of sizes, styles and picture-framing presentations all through the studio. My showroom/office area is set up like a living room- the atmosphere and setting is an important factor. The portraits are purposely displayed over sofas, a piano, my desk and even the computer area. It's important to show that larger portraits are not disproportionate to average home layouts and décor. Smaller prints, up to and including 8x10s are placed atop the piano, end tables and the desk- we call them “miniature” portraits. The concept of photo-decor is not new, Kodak (RIP) and the P.P.of A. introduced that advertising program for professional photographers many decades ago but it is still a valid sales approach.

Not every client is interested in very large portraits so I offer a number of other display options such as “galleries” of smaller sizes,
composite picture framing, arrays of frame-less laminated presentations, odd size formats and a large portrait combined with a selection of smaller ones displayed in easel-back frames on nearby articles of furniture. I begin to introduce theses ideas at the pre-sitting consultation so that I can make various suggestions and get a feel for the client's tastes and needs. My experience has shown that waiting for the proof presentation or “debut or reveal” session to begin introducing larger format options is, in many cases, too late to secure a major sale. Yes, it can happen that a client goes for a large portrait on an impulse or perhaps was planing on this in the first place but it is not likely that the average customer will spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on a spur of the moment decision, no matter how impressive the images may be.

The the process then advances into the camera room or the location shoot. Simply stated, a client is not likely to purchase a 30x40 portrait of a “head shot”. A comprehensive session should include 3/4 length, full length, and even scenic environmental portraits if there is going to be potential for large prints. Family group portraits in ¾ and full length poses have great potential for big prints. We often point out that in a 30x40 family portrait of 5 subjects, each “head size” is about 5x7-certainly not a disproportionate presentation.

I do not use projection screens, per se. I mount white stretched canvas in large picture frames and project the images into them. This allows the clients to pre-visualize a finished presentation. I show the each image in its maximum proportional size that I am suggesting. It's easy to sell down to a slightly smaller size, perhaps one size down, but it is more difficult to “sell up” from a smaller size to a larger one.

In the viewing room, I have a wide variety of picture frame moldings, styles and formats. I offer modern, contemporary and traditional stylings such as wooden and carved frames, “Victorian” ovals, spandrels, cathedral shaped frames, modern metals with mattes and conservation glass, lamination and plaque mountings, compound matting and framing, and many acid-fee and archival framing options. With our “family wall” concept, we generate a good deal of copy and restoration work as well.

I also offer a variety of print finishes. Surface finishing can be critical to preservation and the prints' tonal quality as well. I avoid dead mat finishes on low-key portraits because that can tend to diminish shadow detail. Low-key portraits take well to canvas and luster finishes. Lacquer finishes can be very problematic in terms of spray application, flammability, and hazardous s fumes. In the last few years we have gone to various lamination processes.

I mention all of this because most of theses concepts come into play during the proof presentation sessions. The basic philosophy is that it does NOT become a question of the client buying or not buying a large print or gallery. It becomes a question of which large size or sizes to decide upon what styles, which finishes or framing concepts to apply.

As I alluded to previously, not every client will purchase large portraits. It is not unusual for a customer to come in and buy hundreds of dollars worth of smaller prints- nothing wrong with that!
We also stock a wide selection of smaller picture frames, picture frame lights, and large and small display easels- add on sales certainly help with the bottom line. Leather bound and good quality slip-in albums are also decent sellers.

Projection is certainly the way to go. We also use our projection system to help maximize our commercial sales in large display prints, trans-illuminated menu boards and prints outdoor and transit advertising.

Which system of projection you use is a matter of personal preference. The most important plan is to make projection an integral part of your overall sales strategy.