fjrwillie Loc: MA

Being an avid motorcycle rider, we have taken trips all over the US. We use scavenger hunts, National Parks, Odd ball places to journey on the back roads. I plan on retiring in August and in the planning stages of figuring out what am I gonna do with no place I have to go.

I came up with the idea of Flying into Zurich, renting a car and simply driving around the Alps. Thinking 15 to 21 days, we are use to putting in 300 miles a day on the bike with stops. I have never been to Europe so don't have a clue where to go, what to see. I figure I could get Garmin's Europe GPS maps and plan roads to take just based on what they look like in the Mapping program and referencing back to Google Maps.

So with that said, suggestions on where to stay, places I shouldn't miss, etc etc.

I know this is wide wide open, but I got time. Maybe head to Europe in May, June, July 2018 timeframe . Even suggestions on when to go.

We are use to doing 5,000 miles in 17 days on a motorcycle. Did a quick route in Google that is around 1700 miles to see what we could cover. We can cover a lot.

Any thoughts appreciated.


Willie

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JPL

I am familiar with many places on your route. I would recommend that you pay a visit to Slovakia rather then Vienna and Austria. I have been to both. Like Bratislava and the castle there and the landscape in Slovakia better than Austria.

And when you leave Venice you should head for the Dolomites and look for a mountain called Marmolada. There is a series of cable cars to take you all the way to the top of that mountain. There is a very nice view from the top plus the cable car ride is interesting. Also, on the stop before the last cable car there is a museum, it has the highest elevation of all museums in Europe and there is also a restaurant there with a view. I recommend this and the Dolomites in general.

If you drive towards Stuttgart you should have a look at the technical museum in Sinsheim, it is not very far from Stuttgart. They have one of the last Concorde and lot of other interesting stuff. I have been there twice. Nearby is a nice restaurant in old castle. In Nuremberg I would recommend the Zeppelinfield. That is one of the main venues of Hitlers rallies. Quite an historical site. Nuremberg is full of historical Nazi places.

Prague is a good idea. Lot of old buildings of all sort. But since you want to visit Prague you should also stop in Karlovy Vary and visit Grand Hotel Pupp and other places in the old town. Grand hotel Pupp was one of the locations used in the Bond film, Casino Royale. The Hotel is old and grand and prices are a bargain for the standard there. I was in Karlovy Vary and Prague last christmas.

I think you can not travel in this area without visiting Neuschwanstein castle and Munich. In Munich there is a lot to see and Hofbrauhaus is very popular and very good place to visit if you want to taste german beer and get a glimpse of traditional german music and food. Recommend the whole thing.

You can travel fast in Germany, no speed limit to slow you down on the autobahn. I would recommend a visit to Berlin a little bit north from your route and also to Berechtsgaden in the south east corner of Germany near Salzburg. There is also lake Köningsee in this area and there is a boat tour on the lake that I would recommend.

Bring lenses from very wide to use in the cities and a kit lens or 28-200 for other stuff.

Hope this helps.

fjrwillie Loc: MA

Outstanding, this is exactly what I was hoping you guys would come up with.

Can't thank you enough for the time you provided.

Willie

G Brown Loc: Sunny Bognor Regis West Sussex UK

Distance in Europe is easy - but boring...120mph motorways with tolls .Much of western Europe is blank agricultural land mile after mile.(Northern France, Belgium, Holland etc. It is how Germany reckoned three days to take over Paris in 1914! and then again in 1939.

I would city hop....See what interests you online and then make an itinerary based on that. Beware sat nav...some just say 'turn east' 'turn west' etc which in a flat featureless place makes no sense. Plus what are you going to see having travelled 5 hours to get there ? We drove from Belgium to Luxenbourg cause 'it looked close on the map' said my wife....we got there as it closed at 6.30 ish and then had to drive back for 5 hrs with two very young and pee'd off children! (got a picture of the gorge though).

Europeans love camping!....Which on a bike is do able. We have used them in France Belgium and Holland. Alternatively check Centreparks for chalet type accommodation (Been to ones in France, Belgium,and Holland so could be a base as there are more of them). The Swiss have fantastic trains and linked bus routes..They also hate cars in their towns and villages...some have absolutely No Parking.. even for locals (Zermatt)...! You can book complete journeys from any bus or rail station..(Beware they run exactly on time!) Often hotels have a free or subsidised 'tram card' for the larger towns (Montreux and Zurich , Brussels I have used .. most German towns and cities still use trams for as little as 5 euro's per zone per day)
If travelling into Switzerland STAY in France or Germany. Swiss Hotels are mainly 7* and very expensive....everything is imported and therefore is vastly inflated.(Salad is a bowl of lettuce leaves only) Zurich is the most expensive city in Europe (Nice though!) A lot of people commute from France into Switzerland daily.

Check out trains .....It is the fastest and easiest way to travel in Europe. Switzerland looks small but getting anywhere is horrendous as you go up and down valleys and through some quite long tunnels. Most Swiss trains are Funicular (Geared on track) and they have made an art out of climbing up and clinging onto mountains. Everyone uses them so they are not that expensive. Most have big windows too.

Living in the UK, driving is one car park after another. Our motorways and main roads are packed.....Driving in Europe is great - few other people drive on their motorways between cities (except lorries). Europeans are wise...they build triple height and very long trains that travel exceedingly fast!

Hope this gives you some thoughts.
George

RichardTaylor Loc: Sydney, Australia

The places we have enjoyed the most are where we have stayed a few days.
Can't offer much advice on driving in Europe as we have only done it for 10 days and I found it stressful (even though it was mostly country roads) as we normally drive on the other side of the road. Public transport is reallly good.

Some highlights from the alps:
#1 Bernese Oberland in Switzerland - world class mountain scenery, car free villages, and some wonderfull walking trails. We stayed 3 nights in a car free village (Murren)

#2 Southern Bavairia - Yes Neuschwanstein, however a lot more intimate (a palace just for one person) is Linderhof Palace a short drive away
We stayed (3 nights) at Gutshof zum Schluxen, in Austria) a beautiful hours walk away from the base of Neuschwanstein.

#3 Wolfgangsee in the Salzkammergut, in Austria. Beautiful mountains, lakes and villages (think Sound of Music country). Some super walking tracks, and walking in Austria is very civilised.
Hallstatt (unblievable scenery, and good walking) is close by. We stayed 4 nights, near a small village on Wolfgangsee, and went walking every day.

Hope this helps.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Europe roads boring????

Wow! I guess you have never used the US freeways! Talk about boring!

JPL answer is likely the most informed and informative.

rastokirn Loc: Maribor, Slovenia

OMG, you Americans! Can’t you make it in a more relaxed way? 300 miles a day? Traveling through Europe should not be a quick run. You can make 70 miles per hour on highways between cities, to get into a town you need half an hour, in bigger cities more. When do you find time for sleep, food, connecting to locals? And since we are on photographers forum one could assume you want to take some pictures, too?

Seeing you want to cross Slovenia - I would propose at least three days for this country alone (when you want to do it short). But your timeframe is great, since you don’t travel thru public summer holidays, italian and german roads are packed then!

I am a tourism destinations planner, my wife is tourism organizer. You can get more info from our part (about our part ;-) if interested. Not to forget - navigation apps (Maps, Google Maps, maps.me…) on phones are good enough lately, you can just download all the country maps at home before…

I plan to retire in five years so I am not asking you to take us with, nevertheless I wish you all the best! Rasto

Forgot to mention - check what frjack has to say about this part of the world!

Keldon Loc: Yukon, B.C.

Fly into Frankfurt instead of Switzerland. Vehicle rental is cheaper and they don't charge for mileage. Consider renting a motor home. They are smaller than N. American ones but certainly more than adequate. They're also diesel so they get great fuel mileage. My wife and I have put 10's of thousands of miles driving in Europe from Gibraltar to Gdansk, Poland and never a problem. You can either stay at campgrounds where they deliver fresh hot bread in the morning or simply stay at any nice spot with a view that you come across; it's legal.

From Frankfurt you can stop in Heidelberg on your way South. Stuttgart isn't all that interesting however. Salzburg is beautiful. From there Berchtesgaden is a 1/2 hour drive away.There's a saltmine there that has fantastic tours and you can also take the bus up to Hitler's Eagles Nest.

I lived in Prague and can't say enough good about it. It is an absolutely delightful city and has more to see and do than almost any other city in Europe, primarily because it's about the only city that wasn't bombed during the war. (Well, it was but that was sort of an accident and they didn't hit anything important)

If you go to Czech, and I strongly advise you do, Czech be sure to spend a couple of days in Ceske Krumlov. Ceske Budehovice is close by and is where the original Budweiser beer is from (far superior). Czech has more castles and palaces per square mile than anywhere else on earth.

charles brown Loc: Tennesse

To really enjoy your trip you need someone to carry all of your camera gear so that you can enjoy without being burdened by the weight of it all. Needless to say, I would be most happy to provide that service for nothing more than air fare and room and board. Just a thought.

BHC Loc: Strawberry Valley, JF, USA

mcveed Loc: Kelowna, British Columbia (between trips)

I suggest you get Google Earth on your computer and take a close look at your route. When you said "drive around the alps", that is exactly what this route will do- take you in a circle around the alps and seeing very few of them. If you want to see the alps rather than drive around them I suggest you consider a smaller circle hitting these towns Munich, Salzburg, Innsbruck, Garmisch, Meran, Milan (if you must), Turin, Grenoble, Geneva, Zurich, Konstanz, Ulm, and back to Munich. This route will take you through the alps rather than around them. There are many interesting places not far off this route such as the Bavarian town of Berchtesgaden, near the Obersalzberg (high salt mountain) where Hitler had his "Eagles Nest" retreat.

repleo Loc: Boston

Willie,
You start off saying you want to drive 'around the Alps'. The route you show is certainly 'around the Alps' - by a wide berth. Most of what you show on the route is through dull flat landscapes.

You really should do some research and planning. Just because it is Europe doesn't mean it is interesting. Europe has many, many, gems, but it also has more than its fair share of dull urban and industrial sprawl - especially along the corridors with good highways. Europe is much more densely populated than the US. If you don't plan, you may as well just spend your 17 days driving around New Jersey.

If you want to see a good cross section of Europe I suggest you pick three or maybe four centers and plan on spending four or five days in each. Use trains or cheap discount airlines to get between centers. Use a day or two at each center to see the city sites and then hire a car locally to venture out into surrounding areas. Check out Easyjet or Ryanair to see just how cheap air fares can be between cities. I once flew from Dublin, Ireland to Marseilles, France for $8 one way (plus tax). Trains are the most convenient way of getting around between major centers. Railway stations are really 'intermodal' . Buses and metros converge at train stations and you will usually find a car rentals and a good selection of moderate priced hotels right beside the station. Long multi-country drives can be expensive. Expect to pay $6 - $8 a gallon for gas. Tolls can be 5 - 10 cents a mile. Tolls on some bridges and tunnels can be $20 - $30. Some countries require you to buy 'vignettes' to use the highways - $40 in Switzerland.

I'm not wealthy, but I go to Europe once or twice a year. I find Rick Steves books a great resource for planning - never gone wrong. I use AutoEurope for car rentals. Venere.com is a good site for hotel reservations. Google or Apple maps apps are better than a GPS for navigation but they chew up data which is expensive. GPS don't always work because many European addresses are written different to the way we enter US addresses. Phone apps seem to figure it out better. Research international data/phone plans and understand what they include. I once ran up a $650 bill for data in a week even though I had signed up for an International data plan.

Enjoy your trip and post pics when you get back.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

And this is exactly what the map shows except for the Milan~Bern leg.

Around means around, not through, across or sideways.

As to flat.... Use google earth and check it out. Flat, indeed.

LoneRangeFinder Loc: Left field

I would never drive "around the Alps". The best places are not accessible by car-- but by cog train, gondola or walking

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Actually it makes sense. I am not sure if you have driven in mountain roads but many are narrow and not safe - if you are not used to the local drivers - especially in the Italian side.... Bunch of maniacs in there.

You stop at key points then drive/hike in. You basically use a 'base' and foray onto the surrounding areas.

That is what I am about to do albeit not in the Alps in just about three weeks (or less).