OVER saturated colors: Hi I welcome an education about getting my (outsourced) prints back without color saturation.. (Especially in the reds). I use a calibrated monitor. Use LR.

canon Lee

Hi I welcome an education about getting my (outsourced) prints back without color saturation.. (Especially in the reds). I use a calibrated monitor. Use LR. shoot in RAW. Use alienBees mono lights. Set camera to flash and RGB color space.
Is it the monitor? The camera? The RAW converters?
I feel my 7D camera, even though shooting in RAW, somehow saturates color?
I suspect that LR may create a JPEG image from the raw that is biased toward the reds? There is a marked difference between Photoshops JPEG and LR JPEG!
I don't understand why the representative JPEG in LR always is over saturated.
My solution to this problem is to adjust the LR, WB temperature slider, to the blue side before out sourcing to my color lab.
I shoot using the 7D histogram, & adjust exposure to under full right, by a little bit.
From what I have researched all manufactures cameras are susceptible to saturation.

jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ

Look very carefully at the labs choices. I know that Costco has a choice that says "color correction". What that means is that you are letting their lab add whatever they want which usually means more saturation. Some labs might give you a downloadable icc profile for the printer/paper they use. You can then use that in Photoshop to proof the image and then send it to the lab for printing. Be sure you send them the proofed image saved as a sRGB jpg image unless you are sending to a pro lab for publication in a magazine or some other printed publication. Usually for home use to frame and hang on your wall or the wall of an exhibit you would use sRGB and jpg. When I print from home I print directly from the raw, or psd, or tif.

romanticf16 Loc: Commerce Twp, MI

If outsourced prints are photographic you should be in the sRGB colorspace for export of your jpeg image. Adobe RGB is a larger colorspace, but when you export to labs the jpegs need to be in the same colorspace they use, which is sRGB. See if this helps with your prints.

canon Lee

romanticf16 wrote:

If outsourced prints are photographic you should be in the sRGB colorspace for export of your jpeg image. Adobe RGB is a larger colorspace, but when you export to labs the jpegs need to be in the same colorspace they use, which is sRGB. See if this helps with your prints.

I out source as a sJPEG. but shoot in RGB .

canon Lee

Im looking into a camera "MENU" selection on my 7D, that controls the WB. ( WB SHIFT/BKT), just below the "CUSTOM WB" . I shot one with the WB at normal and upped the other TO MAX +9 towards the blue side. I put both shots into LR. and found that the reds have been lowered and the WB looked normal. BUT, I'm not sure how much WB is correct. Any photographers that have a 7D, id appreciate your thoughts .

rjaywallace Loc: Wisconsin

Lee, it might be helpful to post some examples WITH your notes regarding how each was processed. I DO believe that different camera makers' gear have their own "native" look to SOOC Jpegs, so to a degree, I am on your side. However, Mr. President, I'm not convinced, at this moment, that there has been a conspiracy. Within a certain range, saturation and color rendering are highly personal 'eye of the beholder' issues. When it's way over the top, it becomes obvious. If you aren't happy with your (insert name here), buy a (insert other name here).

TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC

Your 7D has a number of modes available in the menu such as "neutral, "portrait", "monochrome", "landscape", "faithful" etc., and each of these modes has sub menus allowing you to set sharpness, saturation, etc.. the monochrome modes will even allow you to set classic B&W filters such as yellow, orange, etc. Those settings affect the JPEGs, but typically not the raw (unless you import/convert the raw images with Canon's DPP). Each of those modes controls the hue and saturation, so the JPEG colors will appear different for each. Try experimenting with shooting the same scene (a color chart might be useful) and selecting different modes and sub menu parameters and see if that addresses your issue.

jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ

canon Lee wrote:

Im looking into a camera "MENU" selection on my 7D, that controls the WB. ( WB SHIFT/BKT), just below the "CUSTOM WB" . I shot one with the WB at normal and upped the other TO MAX +9 towards the blue side. I put both shots into LR. and found that the reds have been lowered and the WB looked normal. BUT, I'm not sure how much WB is correct. Any photographers that have a 7D, id appreciate your thoughts .

None of those settings affect the picture if you are shooting raw. You need to process your raw image in software like Photoshop or Photoshop Elements etc. You can adjust the saturation there but you shouldn't ever have to reduce saturation if you are shooting raw images. If anything, you might need to increase saturation. I had a 7D but now I have the improved 7D Mark II. So I know what I'm talking about. I've been shooting raw since 2011.

canon Lee

TriX wrote:

Your 7D has a number of modes available in the men... (show quote)

Hi Thank you so much for your response. I adjusted the color SHIFT adjustment in my 7D menu, and found that it does shift WB when I'm shooting RAW. Its not so much the color correction, but that the reds tend to saturate and blow out. I do a studio setup with lighting, and do a custom WB. I take a photo in the flash mode and then custom correct the WB before the shoot. I just find that the reds get blown out.

canon Lee

jeep_daddy wrote:

None of those settings affect the picture if you are shooting raw. You need to process your raw image in software like Photoshop or Photoshop Elements etc. You can adjust the saturation there but you shouldn't ever have to reduce saturation if you are shooting raw images. If anything, you might need to increase saturation. I had a 7D but now I have the improved 7D Mark II. So I know what I'm talking about. I've been shooting raw since 2011.

I agree that the lighting modes ( daylight, shadow, tungsten, etc). are not affected in the RAW mode. but, the setting I am referring to is a camera color SHIFT adjustment. ( located just below custom WB) , and once in light room it definitely shows up in the adjustment.
I am just curious why the reds blow out. I can desaturate the reds in LR, or adjust WB towards the blue. Doing that sharpens the image as well.

romanticf16 Loc: Commerce Twp, MI

canon Lee wrote:

I agree that the lighting modes ( daylight, shadow, tungsten, etc). are not affected in the RAW mode. but, the setting I am referring to is a camera color SHIFT adjustment. ( located just below custom WB) , and once in light room it definitely shows up in the adjustment.
I am just curious why the reds blow out. I can desaturate the reds in LR, or adjust WB towards the blue. Doing that sharpens the image as well.

Could the SHIFT adjustment be the same as "calibrate camera? This would be a way to make a Canon match the output of a Nikon or Sony when there are multiple shooters at a wedding or function. Have you tried doing a reset to the camera? Maybe you set something without noticing it and now it is causing problems?

canon Lee

romanticf16 wrote:

Could the SHIFT adjustment be the same as "calibrate camera? This would be a way to make a Canon match the output of a Nikon or Sony when there are multiple shooters at a wedding or function. Have you tried doing a reset to the camera? Maybe you set something without noticing it and now it is causing problems?

My understanding is that when shooting in RAW its not controlled by any of the cameras settings.. I understand that RAW is digital information not a JPEG image. I just don't understand why my 7D saturates colors. its more the level of intensity of the reds that I am concerned with..
When the RAW converter creates a jpeg image to adjust from, is that image designed to any standard? Is that standard made to make reds more intense than any other in the RGB color space? I do notice that when I put my RAW images into LR, they get darker and more intense in color then what was put in.

TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC

canon Lee wrote:

Hi Thank you so much for your response. I adjusted the color SHIFT adjustment in my 7D menu, and found that it does shift WB when I'm shooting RAW. Its not so much the color correction, but that the reds tend to saturate and blow out. I do a studio setup with lighting, and do a custom WB. I take a photo in the flash mode and then custom correct the WB before the shoot. I just find that the reds get blown out.

Not referring to color shift or WB. Look at the picture style modes in your menu and note that you can set both color saturation and color tone for each mode. Each mode has default presets, but you can go the submenu for each and set the color. This will affect the color balance on your JPEGs. Again, not the same as WB or shift. Looks like this on your 7D:

Picture Style
-Standard
-Portrait
-Landscape
-Neutral
-Faithful
-Monochrome
-User Def. 1
-User Def. 2
-User Def. 3
-Sharpness (arbitrary units from 0 to 7)
-Contrast (9 units from - to +)
-Saturation (9 units from - to +)
-Color Tone (9 units from - to +)
Monochrome has Filter and Toning effect instead of Saturation and Color Tone.

canon Lee

TriX wrote:

Not referring to color shift or WB. Look at the pi... (show quote)

so, these settings are for the JPEG. Is this the same JPEG that is created in the RAW converter?

TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC

canon Lee wrote:

so, these settings are for the JPEG. Is this the same JPEG that is created in the RAW converter?

Depends on the raw converter. They directly affect the JPEG straight from the camera. If you use DPP (Canon Digital Photo Professional), then they will also affect the raw image. If you use a different converter like ACR in LR or PS, I would not expect them to have an effect, but not sure as my workflow is to import into DPP and then move to PS for pixel editing. Perhaps someone else can comment. Try making a change to color and/or saturation in the camera picture style menu, and see if it affects your problem.