DavidPhares Loc: Chandler, Arizona

I have read where the Olympus Pen cameras shoot exceptionally sharp images due to not having the low-pass (AA) filters installed in their cameras. I have several questions:

(1) if that is the case then why do other (Canon, Nikon, etc) camera makers install these filters in their cameras?

And

(2) What would be the result if I had the filter removed from my recently purchased Canon M5 camera?

Any help would be appreciated.

David

rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona

I specifically purchased a D800e because of the lack of a low pass filter. There was some concern expressed in web articles that this could lead to moiré patterns in images. I've not seen that in anything I've photographed with the 800e.

As for advising you on removing the one on your camera, I'd have to leave that decision up to you.
--Bob

MT Shooter Loc: Montana

Nikon makes several models without OLPF, it improves sharpness at the potential expense of increased moire patterning. Pentax, Sony and Olympus all have models without it as well.
Some sensors just do not do well without them. To date Canon still needs this filter on their sensors.

Architect1776 Loc: In my mind

Canon does not need them. See the 5DSR they choose to put them on. Why? I have no idea.

MT Shooter Loc: Montana

Actually the 5DSR is the one Canon WITHOUT it.

Architect1776 Loc: In my mind

Exactly what I said. Try reading before being stupid.
Canon can do without, actually it has some cancelling thing. The comment I was referring to was Canon does not do it but the 5DSR is the exception.
Before you go off read the response.

MT Shooter Loc: Montana

Yes, I did. You post says the 5DSR has them ON! Time to get off your high horse and read what you wrote yourself. The discussion is on the LACK of OLPF.

Architect1776 Loc: In my mind

It does not. I know what I wrote so crawl back into your miserable cave.

DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA

As I recall, the low pass (Anti-Aliasing) filter was not completely removed from cameras like the D800. It was changed to have a much smaller effect but not completely removed. And it's not something you want to remove at home.

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

The subject of optical anti aliasing filters is something photographers simply do not grasp! It is very counter intuitive. The example of Nikon introducing the D800 and the D800e, not expecting to sell many D800e models and then facing a huge rush to buy them tells that story.

If you buy a D800e, or any other camera with no AA filter, and then never see any moire what that tells you is that a camera with a AA filter would have been a better fit for the photography you do. Lack of an AA filter doesn't benefit images with little or no high frequency spatial detail. If there is some detail finer than the Nyquist cutoff it is folded back into the image as noise, and is not necessarily visible as a moire pattern. It is more likely to simply degrade the sharpness of the image in a way too subtle to pick out and point a finger at. The loss of contrast is like a fogged lens, but not so obvious. An AA filter reduces that effect and provides higher contrast sharper images for most photography.

Of course there are exceptions, and those were the reason for the D800e that few people actually need. If you shoot a lot of scenes with high frequency detail very close to the Nyquist cutoff, and need to see that detail (macro images showing texture on insects for identification are an example, as are bird feathers and some fashion work), then a camera with no AA filter is a good thing, and the way that is verified as having a real benefit is often seeing moire pattern which demonstrate there actually is detail that would be lost with an AA filter.

As far as actually noticing the difference and claiming the lack of an AA filter makes any given camera's images appear sharper... that is seeing what isn't actually there.

flip1948 Loc: Hamden, CT

When you are in a hole you should stop digging.

You need to go back and read what you actually wrote before calling someone stupid....not what you "meant" to write.

You can preview your post prior to hitting "send".

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

The physical layers are still there to provide the exact same length for the optical path. But the low pass filter effect is 100% removed in the D800e compared to the D800.

Actually with that physical design there is no way to adjust the strength of the filter. It is all in, or all out.

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

Don't want to get into the middle of a fight but you said, "See the 5DSR they choose to put them on." While I understand what you intended, the way it's phrased could be construed by some to mean just the opposite.

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

What gives you the impression the filter is removable? And what repair facility in their right mind would remove a part of the sensor design of a new camera with any expectation the camera would still work properly, much less better. And of course your warranty would be voided.

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

There is more than one company that specializes in exactly that. One reason is to repair a "scratched sensor". Another is to produce a camera for infra red imaging. But most such companies will also replace the existing AA filter with a "clear" filter that is not an optical low pass filter.