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Aug 28, 2016 08:46:27   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
I had the opportunity to shoot this young lady last week. Her family cannot afford to hire one of the local portrait photographers to do a series of senior portraits so in exchange for my having a willing model with whom to practice, she gets some pictures to share with her friends and family. I am posting this here first to get your opinions on how it turned out before I go to the more seasoned and critical people photography forum. I did the entire session outside in all natural light between 4:30 and 6:30 in the evening. This one was near the end of the session so the light was really getting nice.

FYC


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Aug 28, 2016 09:06:53   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
If you like the light the way it is then fair enough, but my inclination would be to brighten it just a touch, keeping an eye on the highlights on her face and shirt.

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Aug 28, 2016 12:04:01   #
Whuff Loc: Marshalltown, Iowa
 
Overall I'd say you did a nice job for her. One of Captain C's strong recommendations though was neutral colored clothing. I think the eye is drawn to her brightly colored shirt instead of her very pretty face. I'm not great at PP work so I don't know if that's something that can be worked on in post?

Walt

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Aug 28, 2016 12:25:13   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
R.G. wrote:
If you like the light the way it is then fair enough, but my inclination would be to brighten it just a touch, keeping an eye on the highlights on her face and shirt.


Thank you R.G. for your comments. I puzzled over this one and the exposure levels quite a bit. I brought it up some but was not sure if I should do even more. I have gone back into LR and raised the exposure level, dropped the highlights all the way and raised the shadows all the way and it looks better I think.

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Aug 28, 2016 12:27:52   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
Whuff wrote:
Overall I'd say you did a nice job for her. One of Captain C's strong recommendations though was neutral colored clothing. I think the eye is drawn to her brightly colored shirt instead of her very pretty face. I'm not great at PP work so I don't know if that's something that can be worked on in post?

Walt


Thank you Walt for your comments. You are so right about CaptainC's recommendations. Luckily I have many other shots of her in plain neutral colored clothing that I can work up to place in the people section to get his comments on. I am still working on this one and adjusting the levels and may end up with an even better version of it when I am finished.

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Aug 28, 2016 18:15:14   #
pfrancke Loc: cold Maine
 
good model and good fun for you too. Everyone wins. From someone who does not have a clue (me), I would say to not have her head pointed dead at you - it is rotated a little, perhaps a little more. Perhaps have her not face the light dead on, it might cause her to squint a little. Take lots of shots - work the scene (you probably did). Perhaps also try less DOF. All the above are just thoughts that hit me, perhaps one of them must be correct!

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Aug 28, 2016 19:16:54   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
pfrancke wrote:
good model and good fun for you too. Everyone wins. From someone who does not have a clue (me), I would say to not have her head pointed dead at you - it is rotated a little, perhaps a little more. Perhaps have her not face the light dead on, it might cause her to squint a little. Take lots of shots - work the scene (you probably did). Perhaps also try less DOF. All the above are just thoughts that hit me, perhaps one of them must be correct!


Thank you Piet for your comments. You are so right about this being a win-win situation. I have known this young lady since she was about 5 years old so I know her pretty well and enjoy being able to help her out. In exchange she gives me the credit for her photos when she posts them on Facebook. I tend to overwork the scene with these so I can be sure I get some good ones. Over a two hour period I think I took over 170 shots. I had her look at the camera and look away, smile, look serious and we did a lot of different poses. I may post a few more in the people section so I can get CaptainC to give me his advice.

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Aug 29, 2016 14:46:22   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
Andrea.Jarrell wrote:
......I have gone back into LR, dropped the highlights all the way and raised the shadows all the way and it looks better I think.


You need to watch out for the loss of contrast that that causes. Try going back to it once more and seeing if it benefits from nudging the contrast up a bit. It might seem like you're undoing what you did, but there'll be a happy medium in there where the contrast is optimised and neither the highlights nor the shadows are manifesting distractingly. Your subject suits a soft look, but if it's impact you're after you're going to need the contrast optimised.

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Aug 29, 2016 15:17:35   #
RichieC Loc: Adirondacks
 
Its not about the camera- its about the quality of light.
Buy a large 5-in-one reflector, and try bouncing or filtering the light... and/or perhaps use or add an off camera flash ( or 2) set low for subtle fill. May take an assistant.

Second- tell perspective models to bring more than one FRESHLY PRESSED or a selection of knit shirts ( and be prepared to change them.-- A good secondary use of a large 5-in-1 reflector LOL) and a hair brush...



These little things all add up to professional results.

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Aug 29, 2016 16:44:53   #
IowaGuy Loc: Iowa
 
Andrea.Jarrell wrote:
Thank you R.G. for your comments. I puzzled over this one and the exposure levels quite a bit. I brought it up some but was not sure if I should do even more. I have gone back into LR and raised the exposure level, dropped the highlights all the way and raised the shadows all the way and it looks better I think.


You might also try more subdued lighting with a reflector to soften the shadows. Also use a wider aperture and bring her away from the background so the background is somewhat out of focus and not competing with the subject. I would also try to burn in the background. HTH

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Aug 29, 2016 18:08:49   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
R.G. wrote:
You need to watch out for the loss of contrast that that causes. Try going back to it once more and seeing if it benefits from nudging the contrast up a bit. It might seem like you're undoing what you did, but there'll be a happy medium in there where the contrast is optimised and neither the highlights nor the shadows are manifesting distractingly. Your subject suits a soft look, but if it's impact you're after you're going to need the contrast optimised.


Thank you R.G. for bringing up this point. I actually did adjust the contrast at the same time. It is one of the sliders I am constantly adjusting to go along with the others in order to get what I am looking for. I didn't indicate I had done it because it is so automatic I forget that I am balancing it along with everything else. You are right about the loss of contrast by pushing the exposure up and by adjusting the highlights and shadows.

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Aug 29, 2016 18:29:30   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
RichieC wrote:
Its not about the camera- its about the quality of light.
Buy a large 5-in-one reflector, and try bouncing or filtering the light... and/or perhaps use or add an off camera flash ( or 2) set low for subtle fill. May take an assistant.

Second- tell perspective models to bring more than one FRESHLY PRESSED or a selection of knit shirts ( and be prepared to change them.-- A good secondary use of a large 5-in-1 reflector LOL) and a hair brush...



These little things all add up to professional results.
Its not about the camera- its about the quality of... (show quote)


Thank you Richie for your comments. I actually do have a large 5-in-1 reflector. I am still learning how to use it and my flashes and after talking to a portrait photographer I know after I had done this shoot I realized that even when I am shooting in such nice natural evening light I still need to use them. I am still learning and that is why I do not charge this young lady for the pictures. She is very happy with what I do for her but I do want to get better and that is why I put these out there for comments.

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Aug 29, 2016 18:33:01   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
IowaGuy wrote:
You might also try more subdued lighting with a reflector to soften the shadows. Also use a wider aperture and bring her away from the background so the background is somewhat out of focus and not competing with the subject. I would also try to burn in the background. HTH


Thank you for your thoughts IowaGuy. I shot these at f/6.3 and was a bit worried that even that would be too wide open. Some of the images were shot with a pond in the background and that did blur out very nicely. I will be using at least my reflector in future and likely even a diffused flash.

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Sep 6, 2016 15:32:12   #
Chuck_893 Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
 
Andrea.Jarrell wrote:
I had the opportunity to shoot this young lady last week. Her family cannot afford to hire one of the local portrait photographers to do a series of senior portraits so in exchange for my having a willing model with whom to practice, she gets some pictures to share with her friends and family. I am posting this here first to get your opinions on how it turned out before I go to the more seasoned and critical people photography forum. I did the entire session outside in all natural light between 4:30 and 6:30 in the evening. This one was near the end of the session so the light was really getting nice. FYC
I had the opportunity to shoot this young lady las... (show quote)

Andrea, I am pathetically late to this party, but I think you did an overall great job. When I was working I did a lot of weddings and portraits (and wedding portraits), many if not most outdoors, so I have a little expertise.

I don't disagree with most of the commentary. I think your picture could stand to be lightened up a bit but everyone's monitor is a little different. I'm personally not bothered by the shirt. Kids all have favorite clothes, many wrinkled. I'm not bothered by her hair; the current style is very much relaxed. There's even a line of styling products called Bed Head!

Her head pointed at you is fine so far as I am concerned; what's important is that her shoulders are turned. I was taught that generally the shoulders should never be square to the camera; makes people look like linebackers.

I do find the direct sunlight harsh, late hour notwithstanding. Reflectors and fill flash are terrific tools, but the way I was trained the key things were to (1) never shoot in direct sun no matter how low the sun except with the sun at the subject's back, and (2) try never to have the background much lighter than the subject. What that meant was to always try to find open shade (sky light), and shoot against the light to keep the background in relative shadow. The time of day you chose was perfect, and in 170 pictures it's possible you did some in open shade. It happens that just yesterday I made a few literal snapshots of a couple of old friends. We were in the UW Arboretum, a lovely park with many trees. The sun was still pretty high but there are so many trees that the light is heavily filtered. I turned them so their backs were to the light so that if any sunlight was coming through the leaves I wouldn't get horrible highlights and shadows on the faces. I put her up on the mulch by the tree so that he could come alongside and not be quite so tall (he normally looks twice her height), had them lean in to each other, tip their heads toward each other, and fired off 6 frames. No reflector, no flash fill, totally available but soft light.

You've nailed the background as far as I am concerned. The softness seems about right, and the tree is going to be in focus because it's in the plane of focus. It's just the harsh direct frontal sun that I see as a problem. It forces people to squint. It emphasizes skin imperfections and raises the wrinkles in the shirt. Shooting back light with reflectors and/or flashes ameliorates most of that, and often in open shade (assuming you can find it) you can shoot successfully with no extra light modifiers at all.

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Sep 6, 2016 16:19:35   #
Andrea.Jarrell Loc: Mount Airy, NC
 
Chuck_893 wrote:
Andrea, I am pathetically late to this party, but I think you did an overall great job. When I was working I did a lot of weddings and portraits (and wedding portraits), many if not most outdoors, so I have a little expertise.

I don't disagree with most of the commentary. I think your picture could stand to be lightened up a bit but everyone's monitor is a little different. I'm personally not bothered by the shirt. Kids all have favorite clothes, many wrinkled. I'm not bothered by her hair; the current style is very much relaxed. There's even a line of styling products called Bed Head!

Her head pointed at you is fine so far as I am concerned; what's important is that her shoulders are turned. I was taught that generally the shoulders should never be square to the camera; makes people look like linebackers.

I do find the direct sunlight harsh, late hour notwithstanding. Reflectors and fill flash are terrific tools, but the way I was trained the key things were to (1) never shoot in direct sun no matter how low the sun except with the sun at the subject's back, and (2) try never to have the background much lighter than the subject. What that meant was to always try to find open shade (sky light), and shoot against the light to keep the background in relative shadow. The time of day you chose was perfect, and in 170 pictures it's possible you did some in open shade. It happens that just yesterday I made a few literal snapshots of a couple of old friends. We were in the UW Arboretum, a lovely park with many trees. The sun was still pretty high but there are so many trees that the light is heavily filtered. I turned them so their backs were to the light so that if any sunlight was coming through the leaves I wouldn't get horrible highlights and shadows on the faces. I put her up on the mulch by the tree so that he could come alongside and not be quite so tall (he normally looks twice her height), had them lean in to each other, tip their heads toward each other, and fired off 6 frames. No reflector, no flash fill, totally available but soft light.

You've nailed the background as far as I am concerned. The softness seems about right, and the tree is going to be in focus because it's in the plane of focus. It's just the harsh direct frontal sun that I see as a problem. It forces people to squint. It emphasizes skin imperfections and raises the wrinkles in the shirt. Shooting back light with reflectors and/or flashes ameliorates most of that, and often in open shade (assuming you can find it) you can shoot successfully with no extra light modifiers at all.
Andrea, I am pathetically late to this party, but ... (show quote)


Thank you Chuck for your very insightful comments and suggestions. This is just the sort of commentary that I am looking for and find to be very helpful. You are quite right that in the 170 plus images I took there are actually quite a few that are in open shade. I processed a lot of those and thought they looked very good when I was finished but was afraid if I posted them I would get the inevitable "should have used fill light" comments. I always appreciate your comments and it is good to know that you are speaking from a point of experience.

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