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Off Camera, "camera rotating" Flash brackets?
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Mar 15, 2016 10:44:42   #
cjc2 Loc: Hellertown PA
 
I also own a couple of stroboframes and don't use them much anymore but they do get the job done! What I didn't like was the clamp system for the cameras. When I switched to the Acra Swiss I also switched to Really Right Stuff. Expensive? Yes! None better! Check them out first if you're willing to spend this amount of $$$. Give them a call if you're confused, as they are nice people. Best of luck.

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Mar 15, 2016 10:48:01   #
WayneT Loc: Paris, TN
 
I have this one from Custom Brackets and like it very much.

http://www.custombrackets.com/products/camera-flash-brackets/digital-pro-e.html

B&H also has them.

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Mar 15, 2016 10:51:52   #
Rick from NY Loc: Sarasota FL
 
burkphoto wrote:
Try this instead:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/743002-REG/Vello_CB_100_Quickdraw_Rotating_Flash_Bracket.html#customerReview

I have the original version of this exact same bracket that carried a name brand and cost six times more. It's been around for many years...

It is much less expensive, and much better for one simple reason: When you rotate the camera, you also rotate the flash, keeping the rectangular flashtube parallel to the rectangular sensor of the camera. It also keeps the flash directly above the lens at all times, whether the composition is horizontal or vertical. That drops the shadow behind the subject.

To do otherwise, as many brackets do, will use a horizontal beam of light to illuminate a vertical subject. That, of course, creates a correctly-exposed SQUARE PORTION of the subject, leaving top and bottom of frame underexposed pretty severely, in some instances.

I used to see this all the time in the lab where I worked. Someone would use a bracket that did not rotate the flash WITH the camera body, and their work (usually full-length portraits) would look awful — dark heads, dark feet, and bright mid-sections...

A combination that works particularly poorly is the Canon 580EX II flash with a Custom Brackets Digital PRO-M Camera Rotating Bracket Kit. The school portrait lab I worked for was also an equipment dealer. We put hundreds of these in the hands of our retail photographers, only to discover the issue mentioned above... LESSON LEARNED.
Try this instead: br br http://www.bhphotovideo.c... (show quote)


Good morning Bill - I found your comments to be quite interesting. That concept of maintaining the aspect of the flash head to the sensor never occurred to me when using this CB Pro bracket.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/478303-REG/Custom_Brackets_DIGITALPROMK_Digital_PRO_M_Camera_Rotating.html

But then I never had the problem you describe, so I was a bit puzzled as to why I was spared the problem. Only thing I can think about is that I never actually point the flash at a subject. I always shoot with the flash pointing directly up or at some angle upward to get the benefit of bounce. I also almost always use a large reflector card to bounce some of the upward pointed light toward the subject.

In cases where I am outdoors, I still do not point the flash at the subject, but point it up and always use the bounce card. (by the way, the included bounce card on a shoe mounted flash is way too small to do a great job, so I use an add on bounce surface).

Bottom line is that the way I utilize the flash on a bracket does not seem to create the problem that you describe. I need to give it a try in a test one day with the flash pointed directly at the subject and see if I see what you see. I am not doubting your comments at all - just mentioning that the way I shoot does not seem to be a problem.

would love to hear your thoughts.

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Mar 15, 2016 12:08:59   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Rick from NY wrote:
Good morning Bill - I found your comments to be quite interesting. That concept of maintaining the aspect of the flash head to the sensor never occurred to me when using this CB Pro bracket.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/478303-REG/Custom_Brackets_DIGITALPROMK_Digital_PRO_M_Camera_Rotating.html

But then I never had the problem you describe, so I was a bit puzzled as to why I was spared the problem. Only thing I can think about is that I never actually point the flash at a subject. I always shoot with the flash pointing directly up or at some angle upward to get the benefit of bounce. I also almost always use a large reflector card to bounce some of the upward pointed light toward the subject.

In cases where I am outdoors, I still do not point the flash at the subject, but point it up and always use the bounce card. (by the way, the included bounce card on a shoe mounted flash is way too small to do a great job, so I use an add on bounce surface).

Bottom line is that the way I utilize the flash on a bracket does not seem to create the problem that you describe. I need to give it a try in a test one day with the flash pointed directly at the subject and see if I see what you see. I am not doubting your comments at all - just mentioning that the way I shoot does not seem to be a problem.

would love to hear your thoughts.
Good morning Bill - I found your comments to be qu... (show quote)


It IS, most definitely, all in the way you use your flash. Using a letter-size white paper scoop card, Sto-Fen Diffuser, Gary Fong Lightsphere, Lumiquest, etc. indoors isn't a problem, as they all diffuse the light.

Direct, on-camera flash is the problem. The problem is, sometimes it is very necessary.

Where we ran into problems was outdoors, backlighting or side lighting with the sun, while using direct fill flash to illuminate the subject (flash and sun are both at the same intensity).

That fill flash in bright sun has to be direct, using a 580EX II, due to the need for high power at around seven to ten feet. With the Custom Brackets models, we got about a two stop underexposure on subjects' heads and feet... and the transition was rather abrupt... usually at the subject's neck and below the knees.

It is probably important to note that we were using a Canon sync cord to extend ETTL II usage of the flash, and the flash zoom was automatically following the lens zoom.

The products we were making are called Memory Mates or Sports Mates or Team and Individual Portraits by various vendors. They include a vertical portrait of an individual player in uniform, and a horizontal of his/her team and coaches... all digitally composited with titling onto a 10x8 sheet of paper.

The team photos were only a problem if we had to work beyond 15', where the 580EX II can't match the exposure of bright sun.

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Mar 15, 2016 12:33:00   #
Rick from NY Loc: Sarasota FL
 
Ok - Gotcha. I suppose the reason I never ran into the problem is that I seldom attempt to shoot portraits in bright sun. I understand that in your case, where you were trying to balance the lighting when subject is lit by strong directional sunlight, you would naturally want to direct the fill to the darker area. Overpowering the sun indeed takes some some serious power. And so called sportraits often do not allow for alternate posing sites

Thinking back, while I try to avoid such situations, if I found myself needing that level of fill, I probably either used studio lights or I took the flash off the bracket and either hand held it to the dark side or had someone else hold it there with the head facing straight in. In all honesty, I really don't recall doing it very often since when I pose event shots, I will do everything in my power (no pun intended) to avoid shooting in bright sun.

Enjoyed hearing about your experiences. Hope I am never in that situation.

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Mar 15, 2016 12:46:03   #
Geegee Loc: Peterborough, Ont.
 
I have a vintage Vivitar flash bracket which I have had for about 20 years. It has a very comfortable grip which places the flash high and to the left. When I want to take a vertical shot the bracket has a quick release feature which allows me to quickly hand-hold the flash with my left hand on the grip at whatever angle I wish. I know that this is not the type of bracket that you are talking about but for the number of times that I want to shoot a vertical picture with flash this system works for me.

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Mar 15, 2016 15:28:00   #
Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada
 
OnDSnap wrote:
So I'm looking at a couple flash brackets to be able to rotate my camera while using flash at crowed events other than the Stoboframe , the type where when shooting vertical format and you need to flip the actual bracket to keep flash on top. Which I have a few I can't stand using... I was looking at a couple (links below)...but before pulling the trigger, any thoughts or other models/tpes to look at? Perhaps the wedding photographers have some suggestions... Thanks much for any suggestions.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1135401-REG/promediagear_bbgv2_pbx3_boomerang_verticalgrip_qr_for_cameras.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1135400-REG/promediagear_bbx_pbx3bd_boomerang_x_for_all.html
So I'm looking at a couple flash brackets to be ab... (show quote)


I gave up using the flash bracket several years ago when I found a flash modifier that kept the light higher than the lens in both portrait and landscape modes. Love the results and they weigh less than an ounce, don't require a flash cord and eliminate the unbalance of the heavy flash being far above the camera. Check them out for yourself. Much cheaper than investing in a bracket and flash cord combo.

http://youtu.be/wPG6UCZ7oy4

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Mar 15, 2016 16:18:49   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Rick from NY wrote:
Ok - Gotcha. I suppose the reason I never ran into the problem is that I seldom attempt to shoot portraits in bright sun. I understand that in your case, where you were trying to balance the lighting when subject is lit by strong directional sunlight, you would naturally want to direct the fill to the darker area. Overpowering the sun indeed takes some some serious power. And so called sportraits often do not allow for alternate posing sites

Thinking back, while I try to avoid such situations, if I found myself needing that level of fill, I probably either used studio lights or I took the flash off the bracket and either hand held it to the dark side or had someone else hold it there with the head facing straight in. In all honesty, I really don't recall doing it very often since when I pose event shots, I will do everything in my power (no pun intended) to avoid shooting in bright sun.

Enjoyed hearing about your experiences. Hope I am never in that situation.
Ok - Gotcha. I suppose the reason I never ran int... (show quote)


Unfortunately, school portrait photography is a land of challenges and compromises. We had to be ready for anything. And once the market began shrinking, just about the time we invested millions in digital equipment, money became tight.

My favorite rig for synchro-sunlight work back then was a Norman 400B, on a high stand, with a polished bowl reflector... directly behind the camera setup. Sun to the rear, or one side, depending upon available background scene...

400 w/s will go 20 feet at f/13 at ISO 100 at 1/250 flash sync. Note the 20-foot string attached to the light. The second row of a four-row group goes at the end of the string...

It was all a carefully crafted formula.

Norman 400B for sports portraiture in direct sun
Norman 400B for sports portraiture in direct sun...

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Mar 15, 2016 18:54:53   #
amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA
 
OnDSnap wrote:
So I'm looking at a couple flash brackets to be able to rotate my camera while using flash at crowed events other than the Stoboframe , the type where when shooting vertical format and you need to flip the actual bracket to keep flash on top. Which I have a few I can't stand using... I was looking at a couple (links below)...but before pulling the trigger, any thoughts or other models/tpes to look at? Perhaps the wedding photographers have some suggestions... Thanks much for any suggestions.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1135401-REG/promediagear_bbgv2_pbx3_boomerang_verticalgrip_qr_for_cameras.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1135400-REG/promediagear_bbx_pbx3bd_boomerang_x_for_all.html
So I'm looking at a couple flash brackets to be ab... (show quote)


Frankly, I've never seen the need for a rotating bracket. When I rotate my camera and flash combo to vertical, the flash rotates along with it and is reoriented vertically to match the camera format. So I just use a couple simple and relatively inexpensive flash brackets and they work fine for me (one of them originally had a "flip" action, but I have bolted it down so that no longer works).

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Mar 16, 2016 05:51:40   #
OnDSnap Loc: NE New Jersey
 
burkphoto wrote:
Try this instead:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/743002-REG/Vello_CB_100_Quickdraw_Rotating_Flash_Bracket.html#customerReview

I have the original version of this exact same bracket that carried a name brand and cost six times more. It's been around for many years...

It is much less expensive, and much better for one simple reason: When you rotate the camera, you also rotate the flash, keeping the rectangular flashtube parallel to the rectangular sensor of the camera. It also keeps the flash directly above the lens at all times, whether the composition is horizontal or vertical. That drops the shadow behind the subject.

To do otherwise, as many brackets do, will use a horizontal beam of light to illuminate a vertical subject. That, of course, creates a correctly-exposed SQUARE PORTION of the subject, leaving top and bottom of frame underexposed pretty severely, in some instances.

I used to see this all the time in the lab where I worked. Someone would use a bracket that did not rotate the flash WITH the camera body, and their work (usually full-length portraits) would look awful — dark heads, dark feet, and bright mid-sections...

A combination that works particularly poorly is the Canon 580EX II flash with a Custom Brackets Digital PRO-M Camera Rotating Bracket Kit. The school portrait lab I worked for was also an equipment dealer. We put hundreds of these in the hands of our retail photographers, only to discover the issue mentioned above... LESSON LEARNED.
Try this instead: br br http://www.bhphotovideo.c... (show quote)


Thanks Burk, I also a have that bracket and a couple versions there of, and the fact that I have to turn the camera to vertical, then flip the bracket is a pain, not saying it's a bad bracket, just that I'm constantly having to hold the rig with both hands while moving around and the balance isn't the best it could be where I find myself cradling the bracket in my left arm making it difficult to manually focus and zoom., if I bump into someone it collapses or closes to a degree, and I've been pinched several times. Thanks for the suggestion.
Doug

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