Flash or increase ISO
Nov 8, 2015 12:53:40 #
Hi all,
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
Nov 8, 2015 12:58:03 #
WAY to many variables for a hard line decision. Both work well under the appropriate circumstances.
Nov 8, 2015 13:03:53 #
As MT points out, it depends.
Example: you're on the beach on a bright day; your subject is cast in her own shadow and so will either be a silhouette or, if properly exposed, will result in a photo where the sky and background are washed out. In other words, too much difference in lighting between subject and background...raising ISO will not help (it'll just shorten shut speed) because that difference is still there. Flash to fill in light on the subject will help, as it essentially brings the light level on the subject closer to that of the background.
On the other hand: taking photos of a sporting event - kids are running around, etc. Say there's not enough ambient light at first - but if they are 50 feet away then the flash (unless it's really powerful) may have little to no effect. Raising ISO would be more appropriate.
Thus - it depends. And your job as the shooter is to know when to do what.
Example: you're on the beach on a bright day; your subject is cast in her own shadow and so will either be a silhouette or, if properly exposed, will result in a photo where the sky and background are washed out. In other words, too much difference in lighting between subject and background...raising ISO will not help (it'll just shorten shut speed) because that difference is still there. Flash to fill in light on the subject will help, as it essentially brings the light level on the subject closer to that of the background.
On the other hand: taking photos of a sporting event - kids are running around, etc. Say there's not enough ambient light at first - but if they are 50 feet away then the flash (unless it's really powerful) may have little to no effect. Raising ISO would be more appropriate.
Thus - it depends. And your job as the shooter is to know when to do what.
Nov 8, 2015 13:22:37 #
username wrote:
Hi all,
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
It depends on the image. Sometimes you simply can't use flash, such as some images I took last month of a lake in cave. It was the reflection that mattered. The flash blew away the reflection.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
Flash
No flash
Nov 8, 2015 13:31:47 #
MT Shooter wrote:
WAY to many variables for a hard line decision. Both work well under the appropriate circumstances.
Absolutely correct.
I would only add that given the choice of using on camera flash or increasing ISO, most times I would choose increasing ISO. If time allowed both methods could be used and the better result utilized.
Nov 8, 2015 13:39:16 #
MtnMan wrote:
It depends on the image. Sometimes you simply can't use flash, such as some images I took last month of a lake in cave. It was the reflection that mattered. The flash blew away the reflection.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
I am surprised you didn't wake the bats up.
Nov 8, 2015 13:45:14 #
f8lee and others have given some super advice. Subject matter can impact the decision too. For example, the light from a flash on delicate flower petals can wash out details and result in a harsh look that is not complimentary to the subject.
Nov 8, 2015 14:36:21 #
username wrote:
Hi all,
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
A few years ago I took a three or four week course offered by a local community rec group. The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. I recently took another local class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose...what does everyone here do?
Is there really a question? Increasing ISO and using flash serve different purposes and work in very different ways.
Increasing ISO just allows using available light, beyond the limits of your lens at any given setting, but also introduces noise and so on.
Using flash modifies the light in the scene and produces very different results. It can be very complex and can need very sophisticated control, especially when using multiple flash guns and compensating for the naturally available light as well.
They can both serve to deliver a decent exposure, but using flash modifies the lighting, increasing ISO does not.
It really depends what you are trying to achieve...
Nov 8, 2015 14:40:07 #
MtnMan wrote:
It depends on the image. Sometimes you simply can't use flash, such as some images I took last month of a lake in cave. It was the reflection that mattered. The flash blew away the reflection.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
True, but the non-flash image is much closer to what the cave visitor would observe, and therefore more "natural" given that the cave had artificial lighting anyway.
It's way more fun taking pictures in a cave where there is no artificial lighting and you you have to take it all with you and create something out of nothing! Caves are naturally quite dark, for some reason, and waiting for morning doesn't help much! :D
Nov 8, 2015 15:12:14 #
jethro779 wrote:
I am surprised you didn't wake the bats up.
Bats are blind but good of hearing. So the flash wouldn't wake them up but making noises will.
Nov 8, 2015 15:17:01 #
It really depends like others have said. To me most of the time in low light situations it's raising the ISO because to my eyes I have missed so many beautifully lighted scenes only because the lighting is too low. Before I own a camera with good performance in the high ISO I used to have to give up. Using the flash simply destroy the beautiful lighting. Recreating the lighting at higher level would require a lot of lights and very difficult.
Nov 8, 2015 15:27:36 #
username wrote:
.../...The teacher discussed how to use the flash that came with our cameras. .../... class taught by someone else and she said not to use flash and to increase ISO. personal preference, I suppose... .../...
Flash is not a personal choice but a demand when you create a capture. Some subjects demand it, other do not.
High ISO introduces increased noise and limits the sensor dynamic range both of which will deteriorate the output image regardless of format.
Using flash is about knowing your subject and how to use a flash. Both instructors are right and both are wrong if they preach one way or another as 'the way'.
MtnMan wrote:
It depends on the image. Sometimes you simply can't use flash, such as some images I took last month of a lake in cave. It was the reflection that mattered. The flash blew away the reflection.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
But the images at high ISO are not nearly as sharp as the flash images. And in some cases flash is necessary to complete an image, such as backlighting situations.
err... If you want to compare flash/no flash use the same capture, not one close up and one wide.
A flash off camera (way aside) will not kill reflections but create more, artificial that is as well as change the light quality. A flash too strong will flatten everything regardless of where it is placed so...
As to not 'as sharp' Use a tripod, same sharpness result (noise aside).
Nov 8, 2015 15:41:23 #
jethro779 wrote:
I am surprised you didn't wake the bats up.
Interestingly this cave (Luray) doesn't have bats. I asked why because they did not give the standard bat disease talk. He said it was because the only natural entrances were too small. While skeptical I let it rest.
Nov 8, 2015 15:45:22 #
Rongnongno wrote:
err... If you want to compare flash/no flash use the same capture, not one close up and one wide.
A flash off camera (way aside) will not kill reflections but create more, artificial that is as well as change the light quality. A flash too strong will flatten everything regardless of where it is placed so...
As to not 'as sharp' Use a tripod, same sharpness result (noise aside).
A flash off camera (way aside) will not kill reflections but create more, artificial that is as well as change the light quality. A flash too strong will flatten everything regardless of where it is placed so...
As to not 'as sharp' Use a tripod, same sharpness result (noise aside).
You missed the point. The flash reflects off the water. I actually tried it and saw my mistake. You aren't allowed to leave the path.
Tripod isn't an option on any cave tours I have been on. Some caves have special photographers tours for a lot of money but I've never tried.
Nov 8, 2015 16:00:54 #
BebuLamar wrote:
Bats are blind but good of hearing. So the flash wouldn't wake them up but making noises will.
"Blind as a Bat" is nothing more than a saying based on an incorrect assumption made because of the erratic flight pattern of some insectivorous Chiropterans.
Bats are most definitely NOT blind... unless made blind by some accident or congenital disorder.
And while most species DO use echolocation to navigate and feed, the majority have perfectly good night adapted vision. They are not "Blind".
In fact, some bats see as well as Primates... living in trees and feeding on fruit. Others "see" parts of the spectrum that we as humans can not, using infrared "light" to find their prey for the purpose of drinking it's blood.
So the phrase "blind as a bat" should NOT be taken as literal truth... but rather as an aphorism based on ignorance and superstition.
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