dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

Well, you seem to be taking a remark that I made about an action being stupid as a personal insult to you. It was not ment to be that way. I was describing a purchase and how I would view buying a DX lens when I could "invest" in an FX lens for not much more. If you want to be eletist about owning an FX camera, that is your concern. Many people on this site and many more in the world purchase cameras that are within their means and then "invest" in accessories that they can continue to use once they have either moved on from their original camera or added to their collection. For those people, puchasing lenses can can be used after they have continued to grow in their photographic hobby or career is spending money wisely rather than making a "right now" purchase that has to be corrected or repeated later. The DX camera works great with an FX lens and was designed by Nikon to do just that. So, if people want to take advantage of that choice and purchase equipment that they can continue to grow with, they should be encouraged to do so. As for the DX lenses, they were given to me as gifts and, so, I have held on to them. I also use them as one is a 10-24mm wide angle Nikon DX lens and is very good for a DX lens. However, I do not worry about my actions making sense to you and I think that you are giving yourself way too much credit if you think that your attitude reflects most people. Most of the major professional photographers that I know, would tell anyone that asked them to purchase an FX lens for their DX camera if they can afford it and have the option. I know that Joe McNally does as I have worked with him and have first hand knowledge of that. Also Scott Kelby. Moose Peterson, Mike Corrado, Doyle Terry and other sucessful photographers not only have FX cameras but also DX cameras in their arsenal and use FX lenses on them.

oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA

excuse me, bit of dyslexia;
I meant to say:
"He is not saying you can open up and get the same exposure, he is saying you need to open up to preserve your IQ."

jcboy3

If by "most people" you mean professional photographers, then you are correct. I didn't realize there were so many of them out there. But then, I don't think they have the dilemma of what to do after they buy their first DX camera and want to add a couple of lenses for flexibility.

The whole point of the Tony Northrup video was that the FX lens on a DX body adds a lot of expense (and size/weight) for only a marginal (if that) increase in IQ. AND it skews focal range to telephoto because of the crop factor.

Which is why a 70-300mm FX lens on a DX body is NOT the equivalent of a 70-300mm FX lens on an FX body. So if one buys the more expensive FX lens, one has a large, heavy, expensive lens that is telephoto shifted, so one does not use it for the same photos.

The lenses do not have the same function on DX as on FX. Why, for example, would a "professional photographer" recommend buying an 85mm f/1.8 FX lens for a portrait lens on a DX body? So that eventually, one could move up to an FX body and start taking portraits at an 85mm FL instead of the equivalent 130mm FL? The photographer with the DX body has to move 50% further back to get the same FOV. That's a big imposition.

Too much drinking of the FX "kool-aid".

Searcher Loc: Kent, England

I have Crop sensor Nikons - DX
I have a mixture of FX and DX lenses ranging from 10mm to 300mm focal length.

I never have to worry about the full frame equivalents - I just look through the viewfinder and zoom or move accordingly.

The only hassle I have is that my 70-300mm lens being FX is heavy. If I had bought a DX 70-300 it would have been lighter.

I have no intention of moving to Full Frame, I bought the FX lenses at auction and paid good prices for them.

I look at what I am shooting and pick an appropriate lens, I don't have to say to myself "This is a 105mm what is that in FX?" it really does not matter.

If I had a full frame camera, I would take with me only the appropriate lenses, and these can even include DX lenses, the focal length is the same - the viewfinder will show me what I am shooting.

JimH123 Loc: Morgan Hill, CA

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
exactly

dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

The FX lens on a DX body is EXACTLY the same crop factor as a DX lens on a DX body, except you are shooting through the sweet spot (center 2/3rds ) of the lens instead of the entire glass as you would with a DX lens on a DX body or an FX lens on an FX body where, not only do you give up the crop factor (FX on FX body) but you shoot edge to edge on the glass instead of shooting the sweetspot. While Tony Northrup publishes some intersting information, he is hardly the endal beat all dissiminater of CORRECT information that he would like you to think. Much of my information comes direct from engineers at Nikon and professionals that have been there and done that. Now, just because you believe that some guy that puts out some videos is correct, I can produce many more that say he is wrong in this case.. Yes the lenses are heavier.. they are professional weight (what ever that is) as opposed to kit lenses. Nikon makes them fit all of their FX and DX cameras for a reason (not to mention that the first professional cameras had DX size sensors (Nikon D1 at 2.4 mp). While many of Tony Nortrups videos may have good information... he also has some errors.. I often wonder how many of the guys that do evaluations of new equipment have received gifts for their glowing reviews or advertising money for their websites. "Gee Mr XYZ , since you gave us such a nice review on that camera that you tested, why don't you just keep it.." Sure the lenses are heavier and more expensive but they are also better built and have greater aperture etc. Now, I'm not saying that Harriet Housewife or Clyde the Carpenter that wants a DSLR to take Christmas photos and vacation photos needs to buy FX lenses, what I am saying is that If you are a serious photographer wanting to get started or get better images A: if you already have a DX camera (Nikon but I am not sure about Canon's lens compatibilities), and your DX camera is a decent one.. Nikon calls them Enthusiest cameras.. D7000, D7100, D7200 and you want to invest money into your hobby or business, first add lenses if your camera is already perfoming well. Then, add that FX camera body once you have a few lenses. You're all caught up on weight, well a DX body is a lot lighter and smaller than an FX body so a DX body with an FX lens will be signicantly lighter than an FX body and the same lens. Plus you have the crop factor of 1.5 or the additional crop factor of 2.0 and this gives you a great second or backup camera when you can afford to finally get that FX body.
And for your 85mm portrait lens on an FX body, I use a Nikor 1.4 50mm lens which works great at either the aprox 75mm or 100mm depending on whether I am in 1.5 mode or 2.0 mode. but it is still a 1.4 aperture.. plenty fast and good depth of field control. I also have a couple of good FX short range zooms that handle the near wide to short telephoto just fine. and I have that Nikon 10-24 DX wide angle close focusing which can either be similar to a 15-36 or a 20-48 depending on crop mode. The only thing that I can't do with a DX right now that I can do with an FX is shoot full frame at 24 mp or full frame at 36 mp. I can shoot DX at 24 mp and I have quite a bit of room for further cropping. I am not saying don't buy DX bodies nor am I saying don't buy FX bodies. What I am saying is that the DX body with an FX lens is a good stepping stone into the FX world.

jcboy3

I guess we touched on a sensitive issue here. Do you have an FX body, or are you buying FX lenses for DX cameras and wanting to get an FX body at some point in the future? If so, then just go buy an FX body and be done with it.

The point of this discussion is whether it makes sense to buy FX lenses for DX cameras. The argument is that it does not improve IQ significantly, that it is expensive, that the lenses are bigger and heavier, and on DX bodies the focal lengths do not match the intent for FX bodies.

One can buy a very effective DX kit for the price of one premium FX lens. So unless one needs the speed provided by these lenses, then one will be better off with DX lenses. With the exception of the 50mm f/1.8 lens, which is inexpensive and fills a useful niche for DX.

By the way, the concept of increasing effective focal length by "cropping in camera" is fallacious. The advantage of using a cropped format is to reduce file size and increase burst speed/capacity. Note that one could also perform this cropping in an FX camera (multiple crop formats are provided).

And if comparing a D810 36mp camera with a D7100 24mp camera, the effective crop factor (after cropping the D810 to 24mp) is only 1.24.

dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

I have 2 FX bodies D800 D750, 3 DX bodies (D7100, 2 D70s , 2 SB910's, 1 SB800, 1 R1-C1 wireless flash control system, and what ever Nikon decides to loan me. I worked for Nikon USA for 10 years before I retired and still have connections there plus I am a member of Nikon Professional Services. I worked for Nikon Professional Services, consulting with professional photographers all over the US and sometimes the world on special issues and projects. I also consulted for NASA, in Florida, Houston and California on lens and photography issues. And you are wrong about the effective lens lenght and the reason for DX. As I said, the first DSLR's were all DX sensors FX didn't come along until mid 2007 with the D3 until then all Nikon cameras were DX sensors and were all Professional and they would use Film or DX lenses depending on what you had or wanted and Film lenses are essentially FX.

mborn Loc: Massachusetts

I do it all the time without any problems
:) :thumbup:

DJO

The short answer is yes, you can. People will go on and on as to whether should or shouldn't. An FX lens is "full frame" but not the only Nikon full frame lens. All Nikon manual focus lenses are, of course, full frame but can only be used on Nikon DSLR bodies, with support, that have a three digit designation (D200, D300, D600...). Not four digits. As has been already noted on this thread, they (3000-7000 series) are considered to be "enthusiast" cameras. Yes, even the much worshiped D7200.

This is just one of the reasons the D200 was considered to be such a revolutionary camera. Manual focus lenses now have an increasing demand in part due to the introduction of FX cameras. There are other reasons. The "experts" who tell you what to buy, just for the heck of it, began tossing Ai lenses into the mix when doing new lens comparisons. To their surprise, Ai lenses either matched or surpassed, quite often far surpassed the image quality of comparable digital lenses. The same lenses everyone thought were paperweights. Then there's that other thing they talk about, build quality.

All of that wonderful glass gone to waste. I was smart enough to keep mine.

dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

Actually all of the Nikon lenses can be used on the D7100 and D7200 as they support both manual focus and have a builtin focus motor in the body.. They also support lenses with aperture rings that were not AE. but you are correct about the D3xxx and D5xxx

The D3xxx and D5xxx are considered "entry level" cameras not "enthusiast". The Enthusiast level cameras are the D7xxx, D6xx, and D7xx cameras. One DX level and 2 FX level cameras. Oops, I left out the Df camera which Nikon also considers an "enthusiast" camera. It is also Full Frame and is "old school" or "classical" build. It is 16mp and looks alot like the old Nikon Photomic cameras. I have seen mixed reviews on it at $2750 considering you can get a D610 24mp for $1500 or a D750 24mp for $2000.

Nukepr Loc: Citrus County, FL

Good Grief, this is a topic that has been talked to death many times. The original question was whether FX lenses can be used on DX cameras. The answer, given many times, is yes. Then we devolve into effective focal length, diffraction, insulting each other, and how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.
If a person likes the results they get from their DX lenses, then by all means they should use them. If they want more primes, for example, and faster lenses, then they will have to buy FX. But as one poster noted, the issue is not really effective focal length or any other mathematic calculation. The issue is whether when one looks through the viewfinder and takes a picture that lens delivers what the individual wants. The rest is noise.

paulrph1 Loc: Washington, Utah

Absolutely but remember the multiplication factor. There is a viewing adjustment that needs to be made.

DJO

Well, I didn't know that about the 7100 and the 7200. Thank you for the information. What type of Ai lens support do get with D7200- besides the green light that indicates proper focus, and aperture priority? And what would be a ballpark price for D7200 these days?

camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.

Yes and you can also use a DX lens on a FX camera.