Richard2673 Loc: Eastern Oregon

Canon has announced 2 new cameras, one with AA filter and the other without. Why is this important and what does it do??

Thank all of you. you have been most informative in the past.

Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI

Sharper details without the AA filter. They must be paying attention to Nikon Sony and Olympus.

Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.

Announced? Are you sure? In the works, under embargo yes, but announced?

Got a press release?

A little hasty I think...

Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI

Rumored...

Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.

Agreed! http://www.canonrumors.com/

Richard2673 Loc: Eastern Oregon

Got the announcement today in "Canon Rumors".

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

Sharper detail at spatial frequencies very close to the Nyquist frequency of the sensor... and lower sharpness (due to aliasing distortion) in lower frequencies.

With the AA filter the aliasing distortion in lower frequencies is nearly all removed, but at the expense of very slightly lowering the Signal to Noise Ratio just below the Nyquist frequency.

If proper sharpening is done there is virtually no visible difference. Without proper sharpening there can be visible differences near the Nyquist frequency. With an AA filter no Moire, without the AA filter slightly more detail but possibly Moire.

It's an interesting marketing issue. When Nikon came out with the D800 and the D800E they did not realize how customers would react. As a great engineering company they knew that for most photography the AA filter is better, and that for some photography no AA filter is useful. So they geared up for mostly D800 models with the AA filter and a low percentage of D800E models without it. Customers inundated Nikon with orders for the D800E. From an engineer's point of view it does not make sense, but that is also why Canon always sells more cameras than Nikon. Oddly in this case Nikon, and others, caught on right away and decided to ditch proper engineering and make what the customers wanted, and it is Canon that is behind... Strange...

Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI

Interesting read, thanks...all I know I don't miss my AA filter, and would likely never purchase a serious camera with one.

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

I bought a D800 in an instant. And do not want a D800E.

On the other hand, at some point in the future when pixel density is high enough there really won't be any benefit to an AA filter. We aren't there yet, and the next generation won't be either, but it is on the horizon. What the next generation of high density sensors (50 MP or above on a full frame sensor) will do is make it even less significant than now, and while the difference will be measurable it probably won't be visible at all.

SharpShooter Loc: NorCal

You would have never missed having it, either!
I dare someone to show me the difference?! :lol:
SS

Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI

It's tough to say...as I progressed through my DSLRs to where I am now as the sensors got better, the AA filters got weaker.

Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

The higher the pixel count, the less significant the AA filter is.

As the pixel count goes up the Nyquist frequency begins to approach the limits of the lens' ability to resolve, and the limiting factor of diffraction.

I don't know for sure, but I'd also expect that the quality of the AA filter in terms of shape factor has improved, and that it is better at higher spatial frequencies.

The bottom line is that at somewhere between 150MP and 200MP on a full frame sensor there simply will not be any need for an AA filter. A 36MP sensor today is a lot closer to that than a 6 MP sensor from years ago.

Just don't pay extra money to get rid of the AA! Buying a D800E instead of a D800 was perhaps an expensive bit of mistaken thought.

Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.

That is, err, a rumor, and it's not exactly new.

If you are troubled with definitions please Google "announcement" and "rumor" since they are not actually synonymous.

Rumors are interesting, but accurate information is useful.

I'm sure you meant well, but a little diligence would be appreciated so that we don't waste a lot of people's time.

Thank you.

Kmgw9v Loc: Miami, Florida

Have not experienced a moire problem with my D800E

camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.

I have never owned a full frame camera. Since I started to shoot digital in 2001 I have been using DX bodies, my latest one is the D7000.
I noticed last year that files from a D800 were not that much different in sharpness, assuming the same lens was used, from my edited files from the D7000. Assuming proper sharpening methods are used with a non AA body it is indeed very difficult to say which file came from which camera.