Shooting with APS-C vs Full frame: It is swan season. Here are my questions. Is it better to shoot swans with my 6D and my 100mm F2.8L and then have to crop the shots that are far...

Nightski

It is swan season. Here are my questions.

Is it better to shoot swans with my 6D and my 100mm F2.8L and then have to crop the shots that are far away?

Or

Is it better to shoot the swans with my Rebel XTI and my 100mm F2.8L to get more reach out of my 100mm lens?

Haydon

If you can get really close I think the 6D might be a better choice because it will resolve detail better.

Maybe work on saving for a longer lens would be an idea. You can buy focal lengths up to 400mm from Canon without mortgaging your house as long as they aren't F2.8.

R.G. Loc: Scotland

Can your 6D shoot in crop mode?

Nightski

Haydon wrote:

If you can get really close I think the 6D might be a better choice because it will resolve detail better.

Maybe work on saving for a longer lens would be an idea. You can buy focal lengths up to 400mm from Canon without mortgaging your house as long as they aren't F2.8.

So a full frame camera records more detail if the subject is the same distance away from the camera? But then does the crop sensor make up for that at all by giving me more focal length?

SharpShooter Loc: NorCal

Nightski, I would not use the Rebel.
I would sell the Rebel while you can still get about $250 for it and buy a 70-200 f4 without IS, as they are fairly inexpensive.
That will get you closer than the 1.6x factor, and on a 6d, produce a VERY clean file, as the 70-200 is a very sharp lens, and in daylight you just don't need IS or a fast lens.
Just my 2cents. ;-)
SS

R.G. Loc: Scotland

R.G. wrote:

Can your 6D shoot in crop mode?

If it can, the DX-sized area of your 6D's sensor will do a better job than the Rebel's sensor. But shooting in crop mode doesn't give you any advantages, so the best solution is to shoot with the 6D then crop as required.

PS, putting the lens on a crop sensor camera doesn't change the focal length - it just restricts what is captured by the lens. The 6D will give you better resolution at that level of zoom, and probably better colour rendering and noise performance as well.

Haydon

Nightski wrote:

So a full frame camera records more detail if the subject is the same distance away from the camera? But then does the crop sensor make up for that at all by giving me more focal length?

In reality it doesn't give you extra focal length. It reduces your field of view. As great as the XTI might have been in 2006 cameras have come a long way. I don't know the exact math and the others chime in but your 6D is 20.2 megapixel and your XTI is 10.1. In comparison your crop would give you 160mm FOV to your 6D at 100mm. That's not much of a difference. The crop begins to be noticeable at much larger focal lengths like 300mm.

You're undoubtedly crop on both if you're filling the frame and the 6D will retain better detail because of the pixel size.

I've only once filled the frame with a mute swan and that was on my T2i with a 500mm F4 from 20 feet away.

Nightski

SharpShooter wrote:

Nightski, I would not use the Rebel.
I would sell the Rebel while you can still get about $250 for it and buy a 70-200 f4 without IS, as they are fairly inexpensive.
That will get you closer than the 1.6x factor, and on a 6d, produce a VERY clean file, as the 70-200 is a very sharp lens, and in daylight you just don't need IS or a fast lens.
Just my 2cents. ;-)
SS

I have a 75-300 F4-5.6. The images aren't as nice as they are with my 100mm, but it does have it's moments if I've got bright sunshine.

Nightski

Haydon wrote:

In reality it doesn't give you extra focal length.... (show quote)

Yes, I've noticed that my field of view seems very small on the XTI after shooting with my 6D. I thought that I was getting more detail by using the XTI and filling my frame. But I suppose it is a trade off with the difference in megapixels. So I am not really gaining anything. Got it.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

You could rent a lens as well and mount to the 6D to maximize both ...

amehta Loc: Boston

Nightski wrote:

It is swan season. Here are my questions.

Is it better to shoot swans with my 6D and my 100mm F2.8L and then have to crop the shots that are far away?

Or

Is it better to shoot the swans with my Rebel XTI and my 100mm F2.8L to get more reach out of my 100mm lens?

If the question was between the 6D and the 70D, we would talk about the advantages of the higher pixel density of the 70D when cropping the image. But the XTi is from 2006, while the 6D is from 2012, so it is no contest simply because of sensor quality improvements over six years.

Trabor

Nightski wrote:

Yes, I've noticed that my field of view seems very small on the XTI after shooting with my 6D. I thought that I was getting more detail by using the XTI and filling my frame. But I suppose it is a trade off with the difference in megapixels. So I am not really gaining anything. Got it.

You got it

amehta Loc: Boston

Nightski wrote:

Yes, I've noticed that my field of view seems very small on the XTI after shooting with my 6D. I thought that I was getting more detail by using the XTI and filling my frame. But I suppose it is a trade off with the difference in megapixels. So I am not really gaining anything. Got it.

The 6D is 20mp. If you crop a 6D image to match the XTi, the image area is smaller by about 2.5x, so you would be left with about 8mp. The XTi is 10mp, so the cropped 6D image is about 20% less in mp, or about 10% smaller in linear size. If you want to make a 20x30" print with the 10mp image, you'd be "limited" to an 18x27" print with the 8mp. If either print was hanging on the wall, would you notice the difference?

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

Nightski wrote:

It is swan season. Here are my questions.

Is it better to shoot swans with my 6D and my 100mm F2.8L and then have to crop the shots that are far away?

Or

Is it better to shoot the swans with my Rebel XTI and my 100mm F2.8L to get more reach out of my 100mm lens?

I would suggest you go out and try it both ways. The crop will give you a narrower field of view, but you will have to magnify the image more for a given print size. The 6D records 20mp, while the XTI does 10mp. The 6D is new technology, so it will return greater dynamic range, less noise, better image quality. The XTI is 8 yr old tech - noisier, lower dynamic range, lower image quality due to the smaller sensor.

If you are printing your images at 8x10 you will not see a great difference, but if you need to crop the image and/or make larger prints, I think you will be happier with the cropped images from the 6D.

As far a shooting in cropped mode, there is little to be gained other than being able to store more images on the card, and possibly a faster frame rate. It is essentially the same as cropping in post processing. You end up with fewer pixels either way.

Dynamic range considerations are important with bright subjects against darker backgrounds - these are always a challenge, and the 6D, if metered carefully, will prevent highlights from getting overexposed.

rjallen Loc: Wales

Hi, I agree, the 70-200mm L is a superb lens and I rarely take it off my 5D MK2. I have the IS f/4 but believe the image quality is equally good on the non IS. additionally using FF allows better crops.