Cup conclusion
Sep 29, 2013 19:23:38 #
erniehatt
Loc: Queensland Australia
RE ORACLE'S REMARKABLE PERFORMANCE TURNAROUND EXPLAINED .............
It is well recognised that Oracle was having serious foiling stability difficulties at the outset of the regatta and that their performance could not match that of ETNZ. (Emirates Team New Zealand)
Half way through the series it was acknowledged that Oracle had fitted an automatic control to their hydrofoil trim, and that this modification was approved by the measurement authorities.
Since this modification Oracle's performance has almost unbelievably improved. This has been explained by skipper Jimmy Spithill as being due to the superhuman efforts of the crew to improve their handling skills. However, in view of the intensive training Oracle were able to do, prior to the regatta, with their highly skilled team partner, it seems unlikely that only now have they discovered the magic bullet they they clearly have.
It is much more likely to be the result of the modifications, possibly enabled by their surprising decision to use their lay day card and the subsequent lucky postponements.
It must be remembered that this is the first time that this contest has been sailed by yachts flying on
Hydrofoils and it is probable that new and different criteria should have been applied.
In the aeronautical world it has long been known that the stability of swept wing aircraft can rapidly be lost by uncontrolled yaw leading to a dangerous situation known as Dutch Roll.
A device known as Little Herbie was developed during the commissioning of the Boeing 747 Jumbo Jets over 40 years ago, to over come this tendency. Little Herbies, or Stability Augmentation Systems (SAS) as these are now designated, are equipped with sensors such as Accelerometers and Gyros which can detect and instigate corrections to stability with a speed and accuracy which exceeds the ability of even experienced airline pilots. They are therefore now installed in virtually all swept-wing aircraft.
The legality of this device has been justified and accepted on the basis that it does not actually drive the trim of the foils.....this is still performed by the muscle power of the crew, via hydraulic linkages. That may be so, but the device, using it's sensing and directives, has been described as automatic. This implies that the trim of the foils is determined by what can only be described as superhuman technology.
If this technology has ben used to overcome the foiling stability difficulties of Oracle it will have enabled the use of higher speed/lower drag foils which the crew would otherwise be unable to manage. This would give a significant speed advantage during foiling. This has been clearly in evidence since the modification. Improvement in stability and speed has been staggering.
The high speed/low drag foils do have a downside in light conditions where, due to their lesser lifting characteristic, foiling is difficult or impossible. This was also clearly seen in the abandoned Race #13 when ETNZ were only 4 minutes from the finish, with a lead of over 1000metres..
ETNZ appears to have worked within the constraints of accepted yacht racing rules and the special
America's Cup 2013 racing Rules to achieve foiling with these craft. This has been at the cost of using foil characteristics and controls which can be successfully managed by a skilled crew while having to make some concession to pure speed.
Although there is risk of being derided for being a poor loser, or a bad sport it can not go un-noticed that Team Oracle have already been penalised for cheating, that previous Defenders have been noted for sailing very close to the wind of rule compliance. The recent outpouring of bluff and arrogance from Jimmy
Spithill may well be part of a plan to trail red herrings and to draw the attention off the real technological reason for their quite literally astounding comeback.
The question is whether the use of a device which can enhance performance in excess of that achievable by human endeavour should be allowed in a sporting contest?
Is this grounds for protest? At least we should all be aware that this is how desperate sporting entertainment has become.
The win at all cost syndrome.
Should changes be allowed half way through a race, where USA is concerned, who cares as long as we win. :?:
It is well recognised that Oracle was having serious foiling stability difficulties at the outset of the regatta and that their performance could not match that of ETNZ. (Emirates Team New Zealand)
Half way through the series it was acknowledged that Oracle had fitted an automatic control to their hydrofoil trim, and that this modification was approved by the measurement authorities.
Since this modification Oracle's performance has almost unbelievably improved. This has been explained by skipper Jimmy Spithill as being due to the superhuman efforts of the crew to improve their handling skills. However, in view of the intensive training Oracle were able to do, prior to the regatta, with their highly skilled team partner, it seems unlikely that only now have they discovered the magic bullet they they clearly have.
It is much more likely to be the result of the modifications, possibly enabled by their surprising decision to use their lay day card and the subsequent lucky postponements.
It must be remembered that this is the first time that this contest has been sailed by yachts flying on
Hydrofoils and it is probable that new and different criteria should have been applied.
In the aeronautical world it has long been known that the stability of swept wing aircraft can rapidly be lost by uncontrolled yaw leading to a dangerous situation known as Dutch Roll.
A device known as Little Herbie was developed during the commissioning of the Boeing 747 Jumbo Jets over 40 years ago, to over come this tendency. Little Herbies, or Stability Augmentation Systems (SAS) as these are now designated, are equipped with sensors such as Accelerometers and Gyros which can detect and instigate corrections to stability with a speed and accuracy which exceeds the ability of even experienced airline pilots. They are therefore now installed in virtually all swept-wing aircraft.
The legality of this device has been justified and accepted on the basis that it does not actually drive the trim of the foils.....this is still performed by the muscle power of the crew, via hydraulic linkages. That may be so, but the device, using it's sensing and directives, has been described as automatic. This implies that the trim of the foils is determined by what can only be described as superhuman technology.
If this technology has ben used to overcome the foiling stability difficulties of Oracle it will have enabled the use of higher speed/lower drag foils which the crew would otherwise be unable to manage. This would give a significant speed advantage during foiling. This has been clearly in evidence since the modification. Improvement in stability and speed has been staggering.
The high speed/low drag foils do have a downside in light conditions where, due to their lesser lifting characteristic, foiling is difficult or impossible. This was also clearly seen in the abandoned Race #13 when ETNZ were only 4 minutes from the finish, with a lead of over 1000metres..
ETNZ appears to have worked within the constraints of accepted yacht racing rules and the special
America's Cup 2013 racing Rules to achieve foiling with these craft. This has been at the cost of using foil characteristics and controls which can be successfully managed by a skilled crew while having to make some concession to pure speed.
Although there is risk of being derided for being a poor loser, or a bad sport it can not go un-noticed that Team Oracle have already been penalised for cheating, that previous Defenders have been noted for sailing very close to the wind of rule compliance. The recent outpouring of bluff and arrogance from Jimmy
Spithill may well be part of a plan to trail red herrings and to draw the attention off the real technological reason for their quite literally astounding comeback.
The question is whether the use of a device which can enhance performance in excess of that achievable by human endeavour should be allowed in a sporting contest?
Is this grounds for protest? At least we should all be aware that this is how desperate sporting entertainment has become.
The win at all cost syndrome.
Should changes be allowed half way through a race, where USA is concerned, who cares as long as we win. :?:
Sep 29, 2013 20:28:26 #
Hopefully, the moral and technical aspects of this rule change will be looked into for the betterment of future contests.
In the meantime, it may be well to remember that "cheaters never win". They may have the outward appearance of winning, but, in reality, cheaters never win.
In the meantime, it may be well to remember that "cheaters never win". They may have the outward appearance of winning, but, in reality, cheaters never win.
Sep 29, 2013 21:01:47 #
erniehatt
Loc: Queensland Australia
Danilo wrote:
Hopefully, the moral and technical aspects of this rule change will be looked into for the betterment of future contests.
In the meantime, it may be well to remember that "cheaters never win". They may have the outward appearance of winning, but, in reality, cheaters never win.
In the meantime, it may be well to remember that "cheaters never win". They may have the outward appearance of winning, but, in reality, cheaters never win.
I thoroughly agree, this type of things happens in sport all over the world, it's not a matter who is the best, but who can find a better means of winning, problem arises is from the money the sports persons get, was going to say earn, but do they really. Do they cheat or just bend the rules MMMMM.
Sep 30, 2013 09:57:27 #
This sure sounds like a technically long winded excuse for why the ETNZ team lost.
I'm going to suggest another possible scenario. At the beginning of the race, the boats (not the crew) were not equal. I suggest that the NZ boat had technical advantages over the US boat from the start.
When the US team finally figured out their boat's shortcomings, they added the "thing-a-ma-giggy" that made their boat more superior, thus giving them the win.
If I really cared, I would ask what special "thing-a-ma-giggies" were on the NZ boat that the US boat didn't have.
My suggestion for the next time these boys want to come together for a "race" would be this:
By following this (way too) simple plan, the race would ultimately show who the superior crew was.
I'm going to suggest another possible scenario. At the beginning of the race, the boats (not the crew) were not equal. I suggest that the NZ boat had technical advantages over the US boat from the start.
When the US team finally figured out their boat's shortcomings, they added the "thing-a-ma-giggy" that made their boat more superior, thus giving them the win.
If I really cared, I would ask what special "thing-a-ma-giggies" were on the NZ boat that the US boat didn't have.
My suggestion for the next time these boys want to come together for a "race" would be this:
The boats used in the race are to be provided by a neutral boat builder. The boats are 100% equal in build.
Just before the race, the race teams are given a few days of practice to get used to the boat.
No modifications are allowed to any boat.
Just before the race, the race teams are given a few days of practice to get used to the boat.
No modifications are allowed to any boat.
By following this (way too) simple plan, the race would ultimately show who the superior crew was.
erniehatt wrote:
RE ORACLE'S REMARKABLE PERFORMANCE TURNAROUND EXPL... (show quote)
Sep 30, 2013 12:01:05 #
RichieC
Loc: Adirondacks
I hate the Cats... their use in Americas cup and the reasons for the change from 12 meter class boats or even the International America's Cup Class (IACC).. is the blood on NZ's hands when they used a loophole in the rules and showed up with a J-class sized boat- Conner had to respond quick and was unprepared- who would be? Some sense of fairness there- WE got ambushed and he responded with a cat to swat you away.
The use of non-country of origin designed boats, the " Australia" withthe winged keep designed by a Dutch designer way back... and lied about it- you never deserved the cup! Read here.
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2009/oct/14/lexcen-americas-cup-keel-australia
Not that I care as these are "formula one" boats- so expensive only 4 teams could afford the 100 million to enter... But here we go, someone is out maneuvered within the rules, and the people who started it all (and ruined what was once a truly great race) cry foul.
WackaWa.
I am not the only one of this opinion.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-05/how-larry-ellison-is-destroying-the-america-s-cup.html
The use of non-country of origin designed boats, the " Australia" withthe winged keep designed by a Dutch designer way back... and lied about it- you never deserved the cup! Read here.
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2009/oct/14/lexcen-americas-cup-keel-australia
Not that I care as these are "formula one" boats- so expensive only 4 teams could afford the 100 million to enter... But here we go, someone is out maneuvered within the rules, and the people who started it all (and ruined what was once a truly great race) cry foul.
WackaWa.
I am not the only one of this opinion.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06-05/how-larry-ellison-is-destroying-the-america-s-cup.html
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