krf4 Loc: Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio

My question; Who made the rules and why should I follow them if it prohibits the photos that I want to take?

My point is I know what I like and find interesting but if everyone followed the same set of rules all of the time then we wouldn't have some of the masterpieces in the museums.

mborn Loc: Massachusetts

Rules are not absolutes think of them as suggestions. They are time honored ways the great masters in painting used lines, lighting etc. But there are times rules can and should be broken. Depends on what you like or what the subject is or what do you want to show

windshoppe Loc: Arizona

Perhaps what's missing in this discussion is the question of definition. The current contest here on UHH involves the use of leading lines. As I reviewed the photos that have been entered I found many that, while fine photos, didn't employ the use of what, by my definition, are leading lines. It would seem to me that if entries in your club's contest involved the use of simply lines, rather than leading lines, the judge had a valid point.

wowbmw Loc: Grant, Colorado

Sure agree with the compelling emotion of "mystery" as a way to convey the impact of an image. I would add that "mystery" can be interpreted as a subject. Thanks for the discussion!

cweisel Loc: Arizona

"To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravity before taking a walk. Such rules and laws are deduced from the accomplished fact; they are products of reflection." ~ Edward Weston

gessman Loc: Colorado

Not to be contrary but as I avoid the diverted and distracting conversations about "beauty is...," "rules are made to be...," etc., but doesn't the word "line" have a distinct definition apart from any adjective or delimiting term added to it. It would seem to me that a "line" is just a line and a "leading line" actually leads so perhaps a contest of pretty "lines" would allow anything that meets the definition of a line while a contest of "leading lines" would require that the line actually leads somewhere significant like perhaps to another more important subject rather than just being a line. The implication in the term "leading line" is that it is pointing or leading us to a more important subject, not just pointing. I can't quarrel with the judge.

amyinsparta Loc: White county, TN

:thumbup:

RMM Loc: Suburban New York

The "rules" or "guidelines" evolve over time to assist in creating eye-catching compositions. They can be broken, but that's best done after you understand them.

Why should you follow them? Because you'll usually end up with better results. And, if you want to enter a contest, because the judges will be looking for adherence to them. Don't like the rules? Don't submit your photographs to a judged contest.

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Leading lines is a minor subheading of Lines In Art.

The Post reminds me of an old lawyer or economist joke, only it would go:

"Take four Photographic Judges to lunch and you will leave with 8 new opinions on the topic at hand."

A close friend was an active judge at photographic hangings and competitions. He once told me that Judges break their own rules all the time. One thing he mentioned that formal competition most all have one rule... White Mats Only and weighted toward the bottom. When is the last time you went to a formal showing and saw only white mats/no frames.

He also mentioned to me that the best way to learn all the aspects of composition with regard to the rules, AND breaking the rules was to study Art History. (Interestingly, he was a higher ed Art History Professor all his academic career until he retired. He was also an accomplished photographer and had a very successful framing gallery that he started after retiring from Colorado Higher Ed)

I tended to listen to what he said.

Here is a post that I refer people to on lines in art:

http://www.naturephotographers.net/dp0802-1.html

And here is another on "breaking the rules":

http://photoinf.com/General/Gloria_Hopkins/Photographic_Composition_Articles_-_Breaking_all_the_Rules.htm

That last link is to a web site which has a number or articles or links to sites about composition:

http://photoinf.com

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

I thing GOD would disagree... The Ten Rules are one instance. Oh sure, calling them Commandments sounds a bit more explicit, but face it, they are rules.

When GOD said "Thou shalt not Kill", I don't think it was just a "suggestion??"

And I don't think my neighbor would agree that "Thou shalt not covet....." was just a rule, and easily broken with the help of his eager and complicit wife... At least that's not the way it worked out!!!

Some rules are understood to be more than just suggestions. Spend some time in the Bible Belt (Midwest). You'll find this out.

Oh, yes and just try to take their guns away!!! Parts of the MidWest have a long gun and two handguns at every window and doorway, Same as Northern Idaho.

Fundamentalists and BA Christians.... Can't live with em, and they will sure as H shoot your A, if you mess with their possessions.

rebride

Leading lines. Lines that lead to ... something?? Somewhere.
Or Not.

St3v3M Loc: 35,000 feet

They had hangings? I bet that made you work hard so you did not come in last....

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Actually the last hanging or "lynching" as it were in my area was in the 30's in a town about 15 miles from where I live in Oregon. I think that town also holds the dubious honor of being one of the last "Sundown" towns in Oregon. Photography was not involved. Hanging was.

wildconc2001 Loc: Chicagoland

I'm lining up to hear more of these artistic ideas!!!

G Brown Loc: Sunny Bognor Regis West Sussex UK

In our competitions we are not allowed to show a picture which has been entered in the area previously in the last three years - apparently its unfair to get two or more judges giving their opinion on the same picture as it may cast doubts in our minds as to whose are good / bad judgments. I've a theory that female judges tend to say 'you took the picture from the wrong place' and then tell you how they would have taken it. Male judges tell you how that picture could be improved by using a different lens,time of day,focus point etc Both can be helpful or downright annoying. Equally both are valid judgments. Most rules of photography originate from centuries of Art criticism. Does it always work when photo's do not represent morals, religion,nationalistic pride etc ? It seems to me that the more critics - the more 'rules' or the 'breaking of rules'they see. I wonder sometimes if famous artists had it easier - their work only really got criticized when they were dead and couldn't argue with what non-artists said they were painting.

Leave you with this thought : 'They' (whoever they are) have recently decided that the 'Rule' i before e except after c should no longer be taught in English schools because there are too many exceptions 'to the rule'. GO LOOK AT FLIKER.