larrywilk wrote:
I love deals. Found this and thought I would pass it on.
Participating Parks: http://www.nps.gov/findapark/feefreeparksbystate.htm
Free dates:
FREE National Park Entrance Days in 2013
You can get free entry into any of the National Parks on the following days listed below. Available at these partcipating locations [nps.gov].
January 21
Martin Luther King, Jr. Day
April 22-26
National Park Week
August 25
National Park Service Birthday
September 28
National Public Lands Day
November 9-11
Veterans Day weekend
Enjoy!
I love deals. Found this and thought I would pass ... (
show quote)
Or, if you are a Senior Citizen and have a Golden Age Pass, every National Park is free to you, every day they are open.
Croce wrote:
jolly1 wrote:
When you really stop and study exactly what both Chascar and Croce are you will see exactly the kind of person who will, one day, pick up a weapon and go to a McDonald's, or Large Mall, or to a Church or School, and start murdering innocent people merely for the joy of doing so.
They have no moral beliefs or values. A child, to them, is nothing more than a mobile target, a woman a potential rape victim, a man a threat to be disposed of.
They believe in nothing, and hate everything around them. They are evil in both the non-religious, and religious, sense of the word
When you really stop and study exactly what both C... (
show quote)
Let me tell you something and you had damned well better get it straight. If I do not get an immediate retraction and appology for what you have just said about me. So help me, I will sue your ass. What you said is slander and Libel, since it was in writing, I will not stand for it. You have no knowledge of me other than the fact that we have differing beliefs. Trust me I am not speaking lightly. I have never had cause to say anything similar to anyone else on this forum but buddy boy you WILL be the first. Your hiding will not help you. A subpoena will produce both your network address and your identity. What you have said is odious, slanderous and libelous.
quote=jolly1 When you really stop and study exact... (
show quote)
I'm sorry. I regret posting and hereby retract the entire post directed at Croce. I had no basis or foundation for making the predictions I made concerning his future expected behavior and therefor also render my appology to him and this forum.
When you really stop and study exactly what both Chascar and Croce are you will see exactly the kind of person who will, one day, pick up a weapon and go to a McDonald's, or Large Mall, or to a Church or School, and start murdering innocent people merely for the joy of doing so.
They have no moral beliefs or values. A child, to them, is nothing more than a mobile target, a woman a potential rape victim, a man a threat to be disposed of.
They believe in nothing, and hate everything around them. They are evil in both the non-religious, and religious, sense of the word
During WWII and Korea, there were "No Athiests in Fox Holes."
Of course during the Vietnamese War there were no Athiests in Vietnam. They were all in Canada. . . . . . . . . .
tschmath wrote:
What a bunch of pseudo-religious crap. So because adults took god out of school he decided to punish them by allowing their children to be slaughtered. Stupid slogans don't do anything to solve the problem.
I wouldn't say that. Slogans posted everywhere certainly helped get Civil Rights become the Law of the Nation.
UP-2-IT wrote:
jolly1 wrote:
UP-2-IT wrote:
Walthesalt_5-93 wrote:
If we can send millions/billions to the UN, Palestinians, many Islamic Countries, pay Supplemental Soc Security to Alcoholics/drug addicts: surely we can afford to provide security at our nations schools.
I'm 71 and have survived several confrontations involving various weapons due to the incompetence of my attackers.
The Sheriff of Nottingham banned Long Bows; Wow, that really bothered Robbing Hood and his henchmen.
We banned alcohol and built up organized crime, we ban drugs and creating cartels doing multiples of billions of $ every year.
We now control alcohol and tax it and educate about it. Smoking is being done by fewer people each year, thanks to educating people about its dangers.
And as for "gun violence", I have watched weapons for over 60 years and have never seen a weapon commit violence. PEOPLE COMMIT VIOLENCE, THINGS/OBJECTS DO NOT.
I am militarily, Front Sight and self-trained in various weapons. And as for automatic weapons, I have seen zero data showing that any of them owned legally have ever been used in criminal activity. However, I have seen many reports of criminals stealing automatic weapons from police and National Guard Armories.
And there are zero laws that can protect anyone from someone who plans to die to get their crime done. Ask the Secret Service.
And of what help are police if they have to wait hours to be authorized to enter an active crime scene. Our Politically Correct society is bull manure.
If we can send millions/billions to the UN, Palest... (
show quote)
Walthsalt,
After reading your statement you make it plain that you haven't heard about the mass murder at the school where 20 second graders and 7 staff were gunned down by the kid. This happened about 2 weeks ago. I believe you did write the following did you not?
" I have seen zero data showing that any of them owned legally have ever been used in criminal activity."
What kind of data do you need?
Of course the shooting may not be of a criminal nature to you.
I can assure you of one thing, posting an individual with a weapon at any school is doing nothing but exposing our children to the very thing we fear and need to eliminate. A fool with a gun on a school campus.
quote=Walthesalt_5-93 If we can send millions/bil... (
show quote)
Since the "fools with guns" at many schools across the nation
are qualified, uniformed, trained, commissioned Police Officers, it would seem to me that you would be terrified at the thought of having to dial 911 in an emergency. Several of those "fools with guns" would surely show up on your doorstep, probably causing you to dirty your shorts.
I am really curious as to exactly why you want armed security kept from our schools. Could you have an ulterior reason for wanting a particular school unguarded
I do believe that you protest too much.
quote=UP-2-IT quote=Walthesalt_5-93 If we can se... (
show quote)
I think you read to many cheap novels, your common sense is fast leaving you but then again you did say your 71. That could be it.
quote=jolly1 quote=UP-2-IT quote=Walthesalt_5-9... (
show quote)
Strange that you should mention "common sense" in this context. Please tell me, pray, how do you connect my mention of "Police Officers" with your response concerning "cheap novels." You seem to totally lack any vestage of "common sense." Incidentally, I never said that I was "71." In fact, if you truly want to know, I am, as said in previous posts, 86 years old. Born in 1926. Are you truly so ignorant that you write whatever the little voices in your head are telling you?
However, I would still like to know your motive for so strongly wanting proper security kept from our school children. Avoid all you want, but the question will hang heavy over your head.
John Evans wrote:
jolly1 wrote:
John Evans wrote:
Michael O' wrote:
John Evans wrote:
Michael O' wrote:
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsense spun for you by the leftist media. The criminal use of guns in violent crime skyrocketed in England, Australia, and Canada (particularly Toronto -- where you can no longer walk the streets safely at all) following the outlawing and in England and Australia the confiscation of guns -- with NO CHANGE IN THE WAY CRIME WAS CLASSIFIED OR RECORDED. Move to England if you wish to be forcibly disarmed. I'm sure you'll find few dissenters, and you'll be among some folks over there (but surely not all) who think (and I use the word loosely) as you do. The country with nearly if not entirely at the top of the LOW violent crime list is little Switzerland, where every male adult must serve for a prescribed time in the military, and then takes his rifle home with him. There is virtually NO home in Switzerland that is without one or more arms. Contrast that with the US cities with the highest violent crime rates -- New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, and L.A., each of which have "tougher" anti-gun laws than the entire balance of the U.S. The town with the lowest violent crime rate is just outside of Atlanta, and it literally requires every household to have a gun, the only exception being if the resident has health or mental problems, or if they have religious convictions that prevent them from wanting to defend themselves -- and very few households are without arms, and crime is virtually non-existent.
You are blowing smoke, but not up mine. Two states that passed concealed carry had their crime rates remain the same. Every other state had their violent crime go down dramatically after passing concealed carry. Now only killer and gang territory Chicago (it is a State isn't it ? At least it controls Illinois as if it were) does not allow its residents to carry concealed. Illinois is the ONLY holdout. You should move to Chicago so you could quickly learn what it is like to be terrorized by constant gang shootings killing youngsters and oldsters as they sleep in their bedrooms. Read the studies conducted by a University of Chicago professor who reviewed every US county violent crime -- and discovered that more guns by the lawful resulted in less violent crime. The original study covered 10 years. It has been redone (extended) a couple of times with identical findings over the longer period. And it is not difficult to understand : criminals are warped, but not stupid. They go where they can be expect no confronting guns when they wish to commit murder.
Most commonly, crazed killers thus go to "gun free" grade,high schools, colleges or universities to commit their mayhem. Have you ever heard of a killer going to commit mass murder at a police station, hunting club, shooting range, gun store, or military barracks ? Obviously not.
So the answer to school shootings is to take the "no guns allowed" TARGET off of them. Even more positive would be to ALSO station armed policemen at all schools, and advertise it ! Why should we protect the damned professional politicians with special gun permits (for the elite) and government and private armed guards (as billionaire
NY Mayor diet control freak Bloomburg) but not protect our innocent CHILDREN ?
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsens... (
show quote)
Hi Michael O'
What's getting you man ?
I happen to live in the UK and have done for the last 74 years. That qualifies me to comment with certainty about conditions here. On the other hand, I don't know what bullshitting organisation or publication gives you the information you seem to count as "knowledge". Suffice to say, it - and by extension you - are simply WRONG.
I also count shooting as my No. 1 hobby - and have done so for the last 55 years or so. Mainly I shoot game (I ran a 2000 acre pheasant shoot for almost 20 years until about 2 years ago when my health (in the form of arthritis in both knees ) made me give it up.) I still occasionally shoot clays but only occasionally as I find clay-shooting quite a bit easier than pheasant shooting - and, therefore, less of a sporting challenge. Also, clay pigeons don't taste too good !!
I also served in the British Army (with a famous Scottish Rifle Regiment - if you want to check it out there was only 1 Scottish Regiment designated as a Rifle Regiment. It was raised in1689 - the same year as we had our Bill of Rights enacted into law - about 100 years before the USA arrived on the scene ). I was in the Middle East - Oman, Bahrain, Jordan - and in East Africa - Kenya. I was a member of the Regiment's rifle team i.e. I shot for my Regiment in competition with other teams from across the Middle East. That was in the 1950's and 1960's - probably before the USA discovered that there was a region called the Middle East. I say that because you good folk are not noted for being knowledgeable about geography - what was it G.W. Bush called the people of Greece - oh yes - Grecians !!!! And the Palin woman was/is even more dumb than that.
I think that this qualifies me as a person who knows something about shooting. The most "interesting" part of shooting is when some guys wearing towels around their heads are shooting at you and your fellow soldiers. We shot back : we won !!!
I might, for the sake of discussion - but only for that purpose - be tempted to accept what you say when you claim that gun crime in the UK
increased after the banning of handguns in 1997. But an increase from "almost no incidents" to a "very small number" of incidents does not qualify as "skyrocketing" in real terms. Once again you may (?) be quoting some obscure statistic but, as I have said before, there are lies, damned lies and then statistics. None of these should be believed by any intelligent person - but that leaves you out of the equation, doesn't it ?
quote=Michael O' You are pushing hogwash -- una... (
show quote)
Oh great experienced one, I began hunting with my mother's 410 at age six. I am now 82. So ?
quote=John Evans quote=Michael O' You are pushin... (
show quote)
Ahhh - that is perhaps the explanation -- you are in your dotage when senility, dementia, etc., take over.
By your great age you should have learned to treat stats and your news US agencies with a healthy scepticism and suspicion. I am now going out to the city - where neither I nor anyone else will be carrying a gun.. Because we don't need to.
quote=Michael O' quote=John Evans quote=Michael... (
show quote)
You forgot to add that you have x-ray vision and can see every weapon being carried by people surrounding you, no matter where they carry them concealed. So we are to call you "X-Ray Man" from now on. TSA should hire you. Bet you'd be cheaper than all that fancy electronic equipment they buy.
Tell me, with your x-ray vision, do women become uncomfortable in your presence?
quote=John Evans quote=Michael O' quote=John Ev... (
show quote)
You silly old bugger. What do you know about life here in the UK ? Have you ever visited this country ? There are numerous other British correspondents who use these threads. I can guarantee that they will all, to a man and a woman, confirm that points I have made regarding the fact ( and it is a FACT )that people here simply do not routinely carry guns.
We (unlike, it appears, the USA ) are very much a generally law-abiding nation. The ownership and possession of hand guns was banned in 1997.
Yes that was disappointing to those folk who owned hand guns - perhaps as members of shooting clubs - but they turned in their guns nevertheless: they received compensation for that and a system was set up to settle any disagreement about the amount of compensation paid.
Even our Olympic hand-gun team members had to abide by the rule and some, if not all, of them actually deposited their guns with shooting clubs in other countries such as France and Belgium and to this day hand-gunners travel across the North Sea and/or the English Channel to carry on their sport.
As for your last remarks, it is clear that age has not invested you with any form of common sense or even courtesy. You really seem to be an offensive old man - probably a dirty old man at that.
quote=jolly1 quote=John Evans quote=Michael O' ... (
show quote)
Hey, Sport, I'm not the "dirty old man." You're the one that is supposed to have the x-ray vision. Ladies have never been uncomfortable around me. In fact, without exception, they have been very satisfied in my presence.
My "common sense" has kept me alive in many combat situations, and my "courtesy" has won me the respect of many beautiful ladies. Perhaps you should try exercising both. You might actually turn out to be a rather nice bloke, after all.
John Evans wrote:
Michael O' wrote:
John Evans wrote:
Michael O' wrote:
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsense spun for you by the leftist media. The criminal use of guns in violent crime skyrocketed in England, Australia, and Canada (particularly Toronto -- where you can no longer walk the streets safely at all) following the outlawing and in England and Australia the confiscation of guns -- with NO CHANGE IN THE WAY CRIME WAS CLASSIFIED OR RECORDED. Move to England if you wish to be forcibly disarmed. I'm sure you'll find few dissenters, and you'll be among some folks over there (but surely not all) who think (and I use the word loosely) as you do. The country with nearly if not entirely at the top of the LOW violent crime list is little Switzerland, where every male adult must serve for a prescribed time in the military, and then takes his rifle home with him. There is virtually NO home in Switzerland that is without one or more arms. Contrast that with the US cities with the highest violent crime rates -- New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, and L.A., each of which have "tougher" anti-gun laws than the entire balance of the U.S. The town with the lowest violent crime rate is just outside of Atlanta, and it literally requires every household to have a gun, the only exception being if the resident has health or mental problems, or if they have religious convictions that prevent them from wanting to defend themselves -- and very few households are without arms, and crime is virtually non-existent.
You are blowing smoke, but not up mine. Two states that passed concealed carry had their crime rates remain the same. Every other state had their violent crime go down dramatically after passing concealed carry. Now only killer and gang territory Chicago (it is a State isn't it ? At least it controls Illinois as if it were) does not allow its residents to carry concealed. Illinois is the ONLY holdout. You should move to Chicago so you could quickly learn what it is like to be terrorized by constant gang shootings killing youngsters and oldsters as they sleep in their bedrooms. Read the studies conducted by a University of Chicago professor who reviewed every US county violent crime -- and discovered that more guns by the lawful resulted in less violent crime. The original study covered 10 years. It has been redone (extended) a couple of times with identical findings over the longer period. And it is not difficult to understand : criminals are warped, but not stupid. They go where they can be expect no confronting guns when they wish to commit murder.
Most commonly, crazed killers thus go to "gun free" grade,high schools, colleges or universities to commit their mayhem. Have you ever heard of a killer going to commit mass murder at a police station, hunting club, shooting range, gun store, or military barracks ? Obviously not.
So the answer to school shootings is to take the "no guns allowed" TARGET off of them. Even more positive would be to ALSO station armed policemen at all schools, and advertise it ! Why should we protect the damned professional politicians with special gun permits (for the elite) and government and private armed guards (as billionaire
NY Mayor diet control freak Bloomburg) but not protect our innocent CHILDREN ?
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsens... (
show quote)
Hi Michael O'
What's getting you man ?
I happen to live in the UK and have done for the last 74 years. That qualifies me to comment with certainty about conditions here. On the other hand, I don't know what bullshitting organisation or publication gives you the information you seem to count as "knowledge". Suffice to say, it - and by extension you - are simply WRONG.
I also count shooting as my No. 1 hobby - and have done so for the last 55 years or so. Mainly I shoot game (I ran a 2000 acre pheasant shoot for almost 20 years until about 2 years ago when my health (in the form of arthritis in both knees ) made me give it up.) I still occasionally shoot clays but only occasionally as I find clay-shooting quite a bit easier than pheasant shooting - and, therefore, less of a sporting challenge. Also, clay pigeons don't taste too good !!
I also served in the British Army (with a famous Scottish Rifle Regiment - if you want to check it out there was only 1 Scottish Regiment designated as a Rifle Regiment. It was raised in1689 - the same year as we had our Bill of Rights enacted into law - about 100 years before the USA arrived on the scene ). I was in the Middle East - Oman, Bahrain, Jordan - and in East Africa - Kenya. I was a member of the Regiment's rifle team i.e. I shot for my Regiment in competition with other teams from across the Middle East. That was in the 1950's and 1960's - probably before the USA discovered that there was a region called the Middle East. I say that because you good folk are not noted for being knowledgeable about geography - what was it G.W. Bush called the people of Greece - oh yes - Grecians !!!! And the Palin woman was/is even more dumb than that.
I think that this qualifies me as a person who knows something about shooting. The most "interesting" part of shooting is when some guys wearing towels around their heads are shooting at you and your fellow soldiers. We shot back : we won !!!
I might, for the sake of discussion - but only for that purpose - be tempted to accept what you say when you claim that gun crime in the UK
increased after the banning of handguns in 1997. But an increase from "almost no incidents" to a "very small number" of incidents does not qualify as "skyrocketing" in real terms. Once again you may (?) be quoting some obscure statistic but, as I have said before, there are lies, damned lies and then statistics. None of these should be believed by any intelligent person - but that leaves you out of the equation, doesn't it ?
quote=Michael O' You are pushing hogwash -- una... (
show quote)
Oh great experienced one, I began hunting with my mother's 410 at age six. I am now 82. So ?
quote=John Evans quote=Michael O' You are pushin... (
show quote)
Ahhh - that is perhaps the explanation -- you are in your dotage when senility, dementia, etc., take over.
By your great age you should have learned to treat stats and your news US agencies with a healthy scepticism and suspicion. I am now going out to the city - where neither I nor anyone else will be carrying a gun.. Because we don't need to.
quote=Michael O' quote=John Evans quote=Michael... (
show quote)
You forgot to add that you have x-ray vision and can see every weapon being carried by people surrounding you, no matter where they carry them concealed. So we are to call you "X-Ray Man" from now on. TSA should hire you. Bet you'd be cheaper than all that fancy electronic equipment they buy.
Tell me, with your x-ray vision, do women become uncomfortable in your presence?
Michael O' wrote:
John Evans wrote:
Michael O' wrote:
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsense spun for you by the leftist media. The criminal use of guns in violent crime skyrocketed in England, Australia, and Canada (particularly Toronto -- where you can no longer walk the streets safely at all) following the outlawing and in England and Australia the confiscation of guns -- with NO CHANGE IN THE WAY CRIME WAS CLASSIFIED OR RECORDED. Move to England if you wish to be forcibly disarmed. I'm sure you'll find few dissenters, and you'll be among some folks over there (but surely not all) who think (and I use the word loosely) as you do. The country with nearly if not entirely at the top of the LOW violent crime list is little Switzerland, where every male adult must serve for a prescribed time in the military, and then takes his rifle home with him. There is virtually NO home in Switzerland that is without one or more arms. Contrast that with the US cities with the highest violent crime rates -- New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, and L.A., each of which have "tougher" anti-gun laws than the entire balance of the U.S. The town with the lowest violent crime rate is just outside of Atlanta, and it literally requires every household to have a gun, the only exception being if the resident has health or mental problems, or if they have religious convictions that prevent them from wanting to defend themselves -- and very few households are without arms, and crime is virtually non-existent.
You are blowing smoke, but not up mine. Two states that passed concealed carry had their crime rates remain the same. Every other state had their violent crime go down dramatically after passing concealed carry. Now only killer and gang territory Chicago (it is a State isn't it ? At least it controls Illinois as if it were) does not allow its residents to carry concealed. Illinois is the ONLY holdout. You should move to Chicago so you could quickly learn what it is like to be terrorized by constant gang shootings killing youngsters and oldsters as they sleep in their bedrooms. Read the studies conducted by a University of Chicago professor who reviewed every US county violent crime -- and discovered that more guns by the lawful resulted in less violent crime. The original study covered 10 years. It has been redone (extended) a couple of times with identical findings over the longer period. And it is not difficult to understand : criminals are warped, but not stupid. They go where they can be expect no confronting guns when they wish to commit murder.
Most commonly, crazed killers thus go to "gun free" grade,high schools, colleges or universities to commit their mayhem. Have you ever heard of a killer going to commit mass murder at a police station, hunting club, shooting range, gun store, or military barracks ? Obviously not.
So the answer to school shootings is to take the "no guns allowed" TARGET off of them. Even more positive would be to ALSO station armed policemen at all schools, and advertise it ! Why should we protect the damned professional politicians with special gun permits (for the elite) and government and private armed guards (as billionaire
NY Mayor diet control freak Bloomburg) but not protect our innocent CHILDREN ?
You are pushing hogwash -- unadulterated nonsens... (
show quote)
Hi Michael O'
What's getting you man ?
I happen to live in the UK and have done for the last 74 years. That qualifies me to comment with certainty about conditions here. On the other hand, I don't know what bullshitting organisation or publication gives you the information you seem to count as "knowledge". Suffice to say, it - and by extension you - are simply WRONG.
I also count shooting as my No. 1 hobby - and have done so for the last 55 years or so. Mainly I shoot game (I ran a 2000 acre pheasant shoot for almost 20 years until about 2 years ago when my health (in the form of arthritis in both knees ) made me give it up.) I still occasionally shoot clays but only occasionally as I find clay-shooting quite a bit easier than pheasant shooting - and, therefore, less of a sporting challenge. Also, clay pigeons don't taste too good !!
I also served in the British Army (with a famous Scottish Rifle Regiment - if you want to check it out there was only 1 Scottish Regiment designated as a Rifle Regiment. It was raised in1689 - the same year as we had our Bill of Rights enacted into law - about 100 years before the USA arrived on the scene ). I was in the Middle East - Oman, Bahrain, Jordan - and in East Africa - Kenya. I was a member of the Regiment's rifle team i.e. I shot for my Regiment in competition with other teams from across the Middle East. That was in the 1950's and 1960's - probably before the USA discovered that there was a region called the Middle East. I say that because you good folk are not noted for being knowledgeable about geography - what was it G.W. Bush called the people of Greece - oh yes - Grecians !!!! And the Palin woman was/is even more dumb than that.
I think that this qualifies me as a person who knows something about shooting. The most "interesting" part of shooting is when some guys wearing towels around their heads are shooting at you and your fellow soldiers. We shot back : we won !!!
I might, for the sake of discussion - but only for that purpose - be tempted to accept what you say when you claim that gun crime in the UK
increased after the banning of handguns in 1997. But an increase from "almost no incidents" to a "very small number" of incidents does not qualify as "skyrocketing" in real terms. Once again you may (?) be quoting some obscure statistic but, as I have said before, there are lies, damned lies and then statistics. None of these should be believed by any intelligent person - but that leaves you out of the equation, doesn't it ?
quote=Michael O' You are pushing hogwash -- una... (
show quote)
Oh great experienced one, I began hunting with my mother's 410 at age six. I am now 82. So ?
quote=John Evans quote=Michael O' You are pushin... (
show quote)
I received my first weapon, a 20 gauge shotgun, as a present, on my 10th birthday, and my first rifle, a 22 Special, as a Christmas present at the age of twelve. Have never killed anyone since, who didn't deserve it, or who hadn't shot at me first.
crissx09 wrote:
Let's keep our religion preference ( if any ) to ourselves and feel happy that someone wish us well...
Nope, I'm a Christian and I don't care if the whole world knows it. I'm proud of my religion. You should be, whatever it is. . . . .
Skellum0 wrote:
jolly1 wrote:
Skellum0 wrote:
yhtomit wrote:
Skellum0 wrote:
Another statistic gun fanatics love to quote is this one about cars killing more people than guns which leads them to the remarkable conclusion that cars are more dangerous than guns.
They forget to factor in time spent using cars compared to time spent using guns. So while I agree cars are dangerous they are a factor of several hundred less dangerous than cars and have a genuine everyday use.
Wearing your gun is a genuine everyday use,isn't it?I wear mine when I go outside.Heck I leave it on when I'm inside too for that matter.Have you ever shot a gun?
quote=Skellum0 Another statistic gun fanatics lov... (
show quote)
Shooting it is using it, Wearing it is fashion. As stated earlier I spent 10 years in the military and grew up on a ranch. I never carry a weapon and no longer own one. My experience is that firearms make situations more random and usually worse so I prefer to take my chances.
I have a real issue with any civilian ( untrained in combat) using firearms as they are as dangerous to themselves and friends as to any potential attacker.
quote=yhtomit quote=Skellum0 Another statistic g... (
show quote)
And, I suppose, you can field strip a 45 cal. pistol, a Browning Automatic Rifle, a 30 cal. air cooled machine gun, a 50 cal. air cooled machine gun, and a 20mm gun. Oh, and rebuild any one of them, in the dark, in a minute or less.
There are civilians out there who, with thirty minutes or less, of instruction, could do it. There are civilians out there, with no "combat training or experience," who are instructing our Army Reserve and National Guard units, all across the country, on how to care for their weapons, how to shoot their weapons, and how to handle their weapons in all possible situations so that the good guys don't get hurt.
Can you, with your short ten years of military experience, do any of the above. And by the way, have you ever bore sighted a weapon of any caliber?
quote=Skellum0 quote=yhtomit quote=Skellum0 Ano... (
show quote)
Why is what I personally can, or cannot do relevant?. My point is that people who are not trained or experienced in combat generally fall apart in a real life situation. If you don't believe me ask any veteran. Of course there are exceptions, why state the obvious? They are in the vast minority. My other point was that a perpetrator is more likely to be accustomed to violence which means he ( or she) has a huge advantage over the average civilian.
People who boast about their prowess are normally covering some inadequacy.
quote=jolly1 quote=Skellum0 quote=yhtomit quot... (
show quote)
It's becoming quite clear that your military service consisted of the duties of a Paymaster or Supply Sgt. You have certainly never experienced actual combat. Soldiers well trained in the art of combat have beend known to fall apart in actual combat.
Yes, I'm a veteran of combat in WWII, Korea, and Vietnam, and I have seen otherwise good soldiers lose it under shelling or machine gun fire.
As a Law Enforcement Officer I have also met with civilians, young boys, men, young ladies, older women, who have looked terror in the face and done exactly what they should have done in the particular situation they found themselves in.
Perhaps you, yourself, has "fallen apart" in "a real life situation"
and feel as though that is the norm for those with "no combat training or experience" but I assure you that the vast majority of American citizens can handle themselves quite well in any situation.
By the way, besides being a veteran myself, I have called a few of my VFW buddies and communicated your beliefs to them for comments. The total response was that your statements were absolutely ludicrous. (Oh, I'm sorry, that big word means absurd, laughable or ridiculous)
Incidentally, Merry Christmas.
Skellum0 wrote:
yhtomit wrote:
Skellum0 wrote:
Another statistic gun fanatics love to quote is this one about cars killing more people than guns which leads them to the remarkable conclusion that cars are more dangerous than guns.
They forget to factor in time spent using cars compared to time spent using guns. So while I agree cars are dangerous they are a factor of several hundred less dangerous than cars and have a genuine everyday use.
Wearing your gun is a genuine everyday use,isn't it?I wear mine when I go outside.Heck I leave it on when I'm inside too for that matter.Have you ever shot a gun?
quote=Skellum0 Another statistic gun fanatics lov... (
show quote)
Shooting it is using it, Wearing it is fashion. As stated earlier I spent 10 years in the military and grew up on a ranch. I never carry a weapon and no longer own one. My experience is that firearms make situations more random and usually worse so I prefer to take my chances.
I have a real issue with any civilian ( untrained in combat) using firearms as they are as dangerous to themselves and friends as to any potential attacker.
quote=yhtomit quote=Skellum0 Another statistic g... (
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And, I suppose, you can field strip a 45 cal. pistol, a Browning Automatic Rifle, a 30 cal. air cooled machine gun, a 50 cal. air cooled machine gun, and a 20mm gun. Oh, and rebuild any one of them, in the dark, in a minute or less.
There are civilians out there who, with thirty minutes or less, of instruction, could do it. There are civilians out there, with no "combat training or experience," who are instructing our Army Reserve and National Guard units, all across the country, on how to care for their weapons, how to shoot their weapons, and how to handle their weapons in all possible situations so that the good guys don't get hurt.
Can you, with your short ten years of military experience, do any of the above. And by the way, have you ever bore sighted a weapon of any caliber?
Fla Walt wrote:
sarge69 wrote:
Being an ex service member for many years, I see no reason for any civilian to utilize a high rate of fire weapon with clips of ammo. There is no reason except that persons fantasy with automatic weapons.
Then again, the ones with Aluminum Hats say they need the automatic weapons to use when they, in the future, will have to overthrow a bad government.
Take your choice.
Sarge69
Sarge, I couldn't have said it any berrer than you. So I will piggyback on your comment.
quote=sarge69 Being an ex service member for many... (
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I too agree with Sarge69, on both counts.
UP-2-IT wrote:
Walthesalt_5-93 wrote:
If we can send millions/billions to the UN, Palestinians, many Islamic Countries, pay Supplemental Soc Security to Alcoholics/drug addicts: surely we can afford to provide security at our nations schools.
I'm 71 and have survived several confrontations involving various weapons due to the incompetence of my attackers.
The Sheriff of Nottingham banned Long Bows; Wow, that really bothered Robbing Hood and his henchmen.
We banned alcohol and built up organized crime, we ban drugs and creating cartels doing multiples of billions of $ every year.
We now control alcohol and tax it and educate about it. Smoking is being done by fewer people each year, thanks to educating people about its dangers.
And as for "gun violence", I have watched weapons for over 60 years and have never seen a weapon commit violence. PEOPLE COMMIT VIOLENCE, THINGS/OBJECTS DO NOT.
I am militarily, Front Sight and self-trained in various weapons. And as for automatic weapons, I have seen zero data showing that any of them owned legally have ever been used in criminal activity. However, I have seen many reports of criminals stealing automatic weapons from police and National Guard Armories.
And there are zero laws that can protect anyone from someone who plans to die to get their crime done. Ask the Secret Service.
And of what help are police if they have to wait hours to be authorized to enter an active crime scene. Our Politically Correct society is bull manure.
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Walthsalt,
After reading your statement you make it plain that you haven't heard about the mass murder at the school where 20 second graders and 7 staff were gunned down by the kid. This happened about 2 weeks ago. I believe you did write the following did you not?
" I have seen zero data showing that any of them owned legally have ever been used in criminal activity."
What kind of data do you need?
Of course the shooting may not be of a criminal nature to you.
I can assure you of one thing, posting an individual with a weapon at any school is doing nothing but exposing our children to the very thing we fear and need to eliminate. A fool with a gun on a school campus.
quote=Walthesalt_5-93 If we can send millions/bil... (
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Since the "fools with guns" at many schools across the nation
are qualified, uniformed, trained, commissioned Police Officers, it would seem to me that you would be terrified at the thought of having to dial 911 in an emergency. Several of those "fools with guns" would surely show up on your doorstep, probably causing you to dirty your shorts.
I am really curious as to exactly why you want armed security kept from our schools. Could you have an ulterior reason for wanting a particular school unguarded
I do believe that you protest too much.