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Would You Buy a Chinese Hasselblad?
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Jan 7, 2017 14:01:49   #
Kissel vonKeister Loc: Georgia
 
GoofyNewfie wrote:


I have used 'blads back in film days, they were jewels, but I liked using my Mamiya RB 67 better.
Doubt I'll ever use a medium format digital.


Quite agree about the RB67. Image results were astounding with 127mm Sekor C lens. Had one for years and used it in my studio.

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Jan 7, 2017 14:29:08   #
ricardo7 Loc: Washington, DC - Santiago, Chile
 
I have two that sit on a shelf.

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Jan 7, 2017 15:02:26   #
BobHartung Loc: Bettendorf, IA
 
Basil wrote:
I think my iMac is Chinese



Precisely my point.

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Jan 7, 2017 15:08:15   #
BobHartung Loc: Bettendorf, IA
 
Peterff wrote:
. . . . . . If companies build new fully automated plants in the USA that bring manufacturing back to the USA but do not create jobs, how . . . . . ..


How true and it will also require a workforce that can read, learn, and remember. Too many of our current graduates cannot read or write effectively. Far too many cannot spell; just notice how many incorrectly spelled words appear on UHH and that is with spell checking flagging the errors.

It would however, move production into North America. However, one of the biggest markets in the world is/is going to be China. If we are too antagonistic then they can ban or tax imports to such a degree that we cannot sell enough of anything to build it at a reasonable price.

We are seeing the 'Great Leveling' of socities. It will go on.

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Jan 7, 2017 15:35:01   #
SteveTog Loc: Philly
 
I don't think the fact that Hassie is owned by a Chinese company would enter into that decision unless you could elaborate on why you think that is relevant.

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Jan 7, 2017 16:24:09   #
Impressionist
 
Why is China being vilified for taking advantage of western corporate greed? Had we lived within our means and corporations like Apple and Rubbermaid been a little more patriotic in where to build factories perhaps we wouldn't sound so hypocritical. Ours is a self inflicted wound. We can fix it without looking for foreign scapegoats. Kodak is making an effort and should be supported. Don't worry about China. They make a quality product such as the iPad I am using. Hassleblad is in good hands.

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Jan 7, 2017 16:44:02   #
pendennis
 
Don't think for one minute that China's ascendance is based solely on "western corporate greed". China is no paragon of economic virtue. China has only allowed capitalism because their Communist economic system was falling under its own weight. While the Beijing government is hard line, the smaller, local party bosses had to allow capitalism to invade, else the local citizens would have starved to death. China also doesn't give a rat's behind about emissions, and is the largest consumer of bituminous coal. The recent development of the Yangtze River and its tributaries wasn't an ecological blue print, either.

China uses capitalistic economics to prop up its Communist philosophy. China has also manipulated the value of the Yuan, in order to maintain competitiveness in the global market. China only begrudgingly recognizes some intellectual property, something not inherent in its philosophy. (China is not the only Asian country which does this.)

Labor is not a flexible cost. It's inelastic, and will move to its lowest cost, wherever that may be. Until and unless true free trade becomes a reality, the discussion is merely academic. Countries will always act in their own interests.

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Jan 7, 2017 17:32:29   #
mas24 Loc: Southern CA
 
pendennis wrote:
Don't think for one minute that China's ascendance is based solely on "western corporate greed". China is no paragon of economic virtue. China has only allowed capitalism because their Communist economic system was falling under its own weight. While the Beijing government is hard line, the smaller, local party bosses had to allow capitalism to invade, else the local citizens would have starved to death. China also doesn't give a rat's behind about emissions, and is the largest consumer of bituminous coal. The recent development of the Yangtze River and its tributaries wasn't an ecological blue print, either.

China uses capitalistic economics to prop up its Communist philosophy. China has also manipulated the value of the Yuan, in order to maintain competitiveness in the global market. China only begrudgingly recognizes some intellectual property, something not inherent in its philosophy. (China is not the only Asian country which does this.)

Labor is not a flexible cost. It's inelastic, and will move to its lowest cost, wherever that may be. Until and unless true free trade becomes a reality, the discussion is merely academic. Countries will always act in their own interests.
Don't think for one minute that China's ascendance... (show quote)


Chinese emissions are horrible. I remember during the 2008 Summer Olympics, they issued a temporary law not to have residents drive cars for two weeks. You couldn't even see the sky it was so bad. Much like Los Angeles, CA use to be.

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Jan 7, 2017 17:44:25   #
puku8849
 
Just take a careful look at the next lens you buy from Nikon where it is made.

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Jan 7, 2017 20:18:19   #
kenArchi Loc: Seal Beach, CA
 
Made in China...Made in China...Made in China. That was my Christmas list. Are my Levi's made there also?

What's wrong with this picture? Americans waste 40% of food, buy a new home every 5 - 10 years, two to three new cars in their driveway, garages are packed to the roof with usable goods, install $50-100,000 kitchens, on-and-on-and-on. And my neighbor has 270 golf clubs.
What kind of jobs do we have that only we can do this in the world?

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Jan 7, 2017 20:44:32   #
anotherview Loc: California
 
Interesting comment.
Peterff wrote:
Somebody has already commented that China wasn't in the dark ages, and has a much longer history of innovation and cultural development than the USA or its predecessor as a British colony. The communist revolution era was a slow point for China, and yes the dragon has awakened. While I sympathize with your views on China's military and their tactics, essentially they are trying to reclaim their former glory.

However, they also have huge problems ahead. Currently they do have a source of very cheap labor as they have moved people out of a peasant agrarian culture into factories with advanced manufacturing, but even that is beginning to change and we should be paying attention because the same trends are coming in our direction.

The Taiwanese manufacturing behemoth Foxconn employs a huge number of people in factory cities in China, but they are automating at a very aggressive rate: " Foxconn replaces '60,000 factory workers with robots" http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-36376966 . Manufacturing is moving to a whole new level of precision automation and artificial intelligence is raising the level higher still. China's low pay based manufacturing economics are changing, which will create a huge problem for China. What is the country going to do with all those disenfranchised workers?

One consequence of this is that an American robot or AI system costs the same as a Chinese one does, works just as hard, and doesn't need healthcare. It is entirely logical to bring a lot of manufacturing back to the USA, why ship things half way around the world when you can manufacture at the same cost in the USA?

This however will create a huge problem for the USA, and is part of the fallacy of Trump's claims. I'm not trying to make this political, any administration would face the same issues, but while bringing manufacturing back to the USA is entirely feasible it may not create jobs and is quite likely to do just the opposite if companies are going to remain competitive. To paraphrase Jack Swigert and Apollo 13, "Mr. President and Congress, we have a problem here!"

This can't be solved by bullying GM, Ford, or Toyota into not moving manufacturing to Mexico or elsewhere. If companies build new fully automated plants in the USA that bring manufacturing back to the USA but do not create jobs, how does the President or Congress legislate around that? Like it or not, we live in a very rapidly changing global economy and have to remain competitive on a global scale to survive and have to do things intelligently.

Perhaps the only grain of comfort is that China, India and others are likely to impacted at least as badly as we are, if not much more so as offshoring or outsourcing loses its economic benefits.

Please do not take this as a political rant. It is intended as an objective observation on real issues that will affect all of us.
Somebody has already commented that China wasn't i... (show quote)

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Jan 7, 2017 21:15:08   #
pendennis
 
kenArchi wrote:
Made in China...Made in China...Made in China. That was my Christmas list. Are my Levi's made there also?

What's wrong with this picture? Americans waste 40% of food, buy a new home every 5 - 10 years, two to three new cars in their driveway, garages are packed to the roof with usable goods, install $50-100,000 kitchens, on-and-on-and-on. And my neighbor has 270 golf clubs.
What kind of jobs do we have that only we can do this in the world?


That, sir, is the result of a capitalistic economy. If people can afford the homes, new cars, garages, updated kitchens, golf clubs, etc., why do you even care? It's their money, earned honestly and disposed of on what the individual wants or needs. It's none of my, nor anyone else's business. Every new golf club keeps another golf club maker's employee in a job. Every home, remodel, etc., keeps a carpenter, electrician, tiler, tool maker, etc., employed. That's the very basis of capitalism. Money doesn't sit under mattresses, floorboards, or cans in one's backyard. It's put to work, generating jobs, new capital, etc.

If another photographer owns ten Nikon D750's, why do we even mention it? Good for him/her, that they can afford them, or the lenses and accessories that go along with the cameras.

Capitalism depends on the diverse investment of capital and resources to grow economies. How those economies grow should be the business of the consumer, and not any government, since governments do not contribute to economies; they only take away.

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Jan 7, 2017 22:31:52   #
kenArchi Loc: Seal Beach, CA
 
Exactly, pendennis.

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Jan 7, 2017 22:55:19   #
LoneRangeFinder Loc: Left field
 
jerryc41 wrote:
The Chinese company DJI now has a controlling interest in Hasselblad.

To answer the question, yes I would, but then I'd need to buy another one in an hour or so.

😄😄😉

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Jan 7, 2017 23:30:58   #
FRENCHY Loc: Stone Mountain , Ga
 
jerryc41 wrote:
The Chinese company DJI now has a controlling interest in Hasselblad.




Yes if I had the money to do it I will !

The only thing Chinese about it is the influx of funds to keep the company alive

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