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Best beginner DSLR camera
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Aug 8, 2016 16:29:29   #
dynaquest1 Loc: Austin, Texas
 
amfoto1 wrote:
Honestly, there are excellent cameras available from Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Pentax, Sony and others... any of which would likely meet your needs well.

But with DSLRs you need to consider the system of camera, lenses and accessories as a whole, then evaluate which would be your best choice. Etc etc etc.......!


Holy Crap, amphoto1, think you can make even a little attempt to be brief in your answers. And I don't even know what you said as of was way to long to bother reading.

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Aug 8, 2016 17:07:57   #
crappiefever Loc: Central Pa
 
Would never advise one over the other as they both have good bodies and lenses , I shoot both . Thing that most people just cant seem to grasp cameras are not toys . They are tools just as tools for working on your car and each one has a different use and some are better at one thing and some are better at others . Multi purpose do it all is like using a leatherman to change a fuel pump . Just my opinion . Trust me been down that road myself except I didn't as much help back when I started shooting . Shoot we didn,t even have the internet back then !

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Aug 8, 2016 17:57:43   #
Turboman
 
I was given a D3300 for Christmas. I had used a Canon T3 and I have a Minolta G and used an SRT201. I highly recommend the Nikon. I love mine. I am not a beginner but this has been the easiest camera to learn and use that I have tried to date.

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Aug 8, 2016 20:01:54   #
BHC Loc: Strawberry Valley, JF, USA
 
Carl D wrote:
Geez, the OP asked a question, didn't want 4 more to go with it. Just answer the question, it's not rocket science, you don't need to know all that stuff.
My answer to the question is a Sony a6300.

Better an educated recommendation based on minimal data than a WAG based on zip! BTW, your recommendation would be great for a lot of people, but would cause me great physical discomfort.

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Aug 8, 2016 21:36:11   #
Turboman
 
Why would it cause you discomfort? I tried to show my knowledge of cameras and basic use of the camera in question.

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Aug 8, 2016 22:12:28   #
JR45 Loc: Montgomery County, TX
 
I am not a professional, but I have been using various cameras since my first Brownies in the late '50's.
Something I haven't seen talked about is the software used to upload to a pc. I am only familiar with
the Nikon software. Some one that has used both may have input to the most user friendly.

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Aug 8, 2016 22:33:30   #
crappiefever Loc: Central Pa
 
JR45 wrote:
I am not a professional, but I have been using various cameras since my first Brownies in the late '50's.
Something I haven't seen talked about is the software used to upload to a pc. I am only familiar with
the Nikon software. Some one that has used both may have input to the most user friendly.


Dont really need any software . Just create folder , copy and paste or create folder , right click , send to .

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Aug 9, 2016 00:25:03   #
BHC Loc: Strawberry Valley, JF, USA
 
Turboman wrote:
Why would it cause you discomfort? I tried to show my knowledge of cameras and basic use of the camera in question.

Good question. I owned an A6000. It is a great camera! However, the grip is small. I have arthritis, and the last time I used the camera, I took about 200 pictures in an hour or so. By the time I finished, my right hand was so cramped that my daughter in-law had to help pry the camera from my fingers. My hand looked like a claw, and the cramping and pain did not ease for several hours. It was interesting that, while I was using the camera, I felt no discomfort; it was not until I tried to release my grip that I noticed the problem.

If you do not have a problem with your hands, I highly recommend the Sony A6000/6300. But that is why I highly recommend that anyone buying a camera try to get their hands on one before buying. That is why, when I bought my D7100, I borrowed one and carried it around for an hour. Why didn't I do that with the A6000? Sometimes experience teaches us lessons, even later in life.

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Aug 9, 2016 04:11:45   #
RKH Loc: Bay Area CA
 
tclk35 wrote:
I have a Canon S100 and a Nikon D5300. Recently, I bought a Panasonic ZS100. Image quality wise, the Panasonic is much better than my Canon and close to my Nikon. The Panasonic is unmatched in high speed burst shooting. Great for catching grandkids high energy activities for me. Also it has a very well designed, intuitive touch screen interface for focusing, etc, not available with my old Canon and Nikon. Size wise, it is larger than my Canon but much much smaller and less weighty than my Nikon. The Panasonic also has available polarizing and other filters from Lensmate. This camera lacks built-in GPS as in the Canon and the Nikon. But I use an App, gps4Cam, along with my iPhone 6 to remedy this. I do miss the articulate screen and the great viewfinder of the Nikon. So I suggest checking out the new 1" sensor cameras. There are many fine ones made by other manufacturers such as Sony, Canon, Nikon, etc. What is best for me may not be best for you.
I have a Canon S100 and a Nikon D5300. Recently, ... (show quote)

Canon S100 is a P&S camera. How can you compare it with a DSLR!

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Aug 9, 2016 04:34:29   #
RKH Loc: Bay Area CA
 
amfoto1 wrote:
Honestly, there are excellent cameras available from Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Pentax, Sony and others... any of which would likely meet your needs well.

But with DSLRs you need to consider the system of camera, lenses and accessories as a whole, then evaluate which would be your best choice.

Start out by going to a store and handling the different cameras to see if one or another "feels right" to you. Power them up and check out the menus, to see which seems most intuitive to use. Likely something will stand out and help you decide a brand, then you can get down to business.

And, your statement above (in bold) suggests a lot of unfamiliarity with cameras, in general. What you wrote actually makes no sense.. if you knew how cameras work. Whatever you end up choosing, I'd also budget to take a class and or buy some books (such as Brian Peterson's "Understanding Exposure") to get up to speed using your new camera. Otherwise you might find buying a more advanced and capable camera very frustrating and not enjoy it very much!

Next, look deeper into the system of lenses and accessories available for the camera. While the others have some excellent offerings, Canon and Nikon have by far the largest selection of lenses and dedicated accessories such as flash. Most any Canon item made the past 25 years will fit and work on any Canon camera. Nikon is a little more limited, in that their more entry-level cameras (D3000-series and D5000-series) are limited to their "AF-S" lenses if you want to be able to auto focus (which you probably will, since most modern DSLRs are not particularly "manual focus friendly".... especially the more entry level). Even so, there's a lot of choice among the Nikon gear, too. Plus, there are third party lenses, the most being made to fit Canon and Nikon. OTOH, one of the top reasons to buy a Canon or Nikon camera would be to be able to use excellent Canon or Nikkor lenses on them, respectively.

Personally I chose Canon 15 years ago and would do the same again today. Here's why:

- I would want a wide angle lens. Canon has the very best value, by far, among those right now. About a year ago they introduced the very compact and inexpensive EF-S 10-18mm IS STM lens. It is a little plasticky, but has image quality that matches or beats anything else available and it sells for under $300. It also is the smallest ultrawide on the market and the only one with image stabilization (note: Oly, Pentax and Sony use in-camera stabilization, which essentially means that any lens on them is stabilized). Mainly though, compare the price. The cheapest comparable third party lens is around $500. There are also some excellent ultrawides from Nikon, Pentax, Oly and Sony... but many of them cost 3X as much! A Nikkor 10-24mm costs $900 and their 12-24mm is even more expensive!

- Personally I also use a lot of telephotos and Canon has pioneered extensive use of fluorite elements, which help make for very high telephoto image quality. You can buy a Canon telephoto zoom with an FL element for as little as $650. The cheapest Nikkor with a FL element costs $10,000! Most other manufacturers don't offer it at all. Canon also pioneered in-lens image stabilization and has some of the most advanced. To be fair, though, the other manufacturers have followed suit and come darn close.

- In general, Canon and Nikon price their lenses and dedicated accessories pretty similarly. Pentax and especially Sony tend to charge more for comparable items. There are also more third party lenses and accessories made for Canon and Nikon, than for the other manufacturers.

- Right now Sony image sensors, including the sensors that Pentax and Nikon buy from Sony (since they don't make their own), offer slightly greater dynamic range than Canon's imaging sensors (which they make themselves). However, the difference is minimal and hugely exaggerated in discussions like this. It's about one stop now on the latest sensors... and only shows up under extreme lighting conditions, usually just when you badly underexpose your images and need to try to recover them in post processing. Also, the difference is at the camera's base ISO 100.... by the time you increase ISO to around 800, there is no difference between them. And, where are you most likely to under-expose and need to make recovery adjustments? In low light conditions where you are more likely to be using higher ISOs! Today all the DSLR manufacturers are using CMOS sensors, which Canon pioneered using 15 years ago and are superior to CCD in a number of ways. Within the last 7 or 8 years all DSLR manufacturers have switched to CMOS, following Canon's lead. Truly, used properly any of these cameras are capable of making excellent images.

- I also use both crop sensor and full frame cameras, for different purposes. For a long time Canon was the only manufacturer to offer both. Now Nikon, Sony and... most recently.... Pentax do too. Olympus continues to offer only smaller "four/thirds" format sensors, in order to produce the smallest and lightest DSLRs and lenses. So, to be fair, you can now set up a combination of crop/FF with most of the manufacturers. I just wouldn't want to buy into two different systems because I appreciate that a lot of the same lenses and dedicated accessories are fully usable on both my crop cameras and full frame.

It's important to make a good decision. Once you've "bought into" a system in any significant way with additional lenses and dedicated accessories... any switch to another brand would be quite expensive. You'd have to replace everything... not just the camera itself. And the best you could do is sell your old gear at used equipment prices, at a loss, only recouping some portion of what you originally invested.

The Rebel T6i (750D) is a current and relatively advanced Canon model, with a lot of automation and support for new users, as well as the ability to meet the needs of more advanced users. For $100 more (body only) he Rebel T6s (760D) is a more advanced variation, with some tweaks for videography and more direct access to some controls. The control design and layout of the T6s is similar to Canon's more pro-oriented, upscale models. Both these Rebel models are 24MP and both have a 19-point AF system inherited from the earlier 70D (which in turn inherited much of it from the more advanced 7D).

If you opt for one of the other brands, other folks might suggest lenses and accessories. If you decide to go with Canon, it's a system I know pretty well and cansuggest some specific lenses (which ultimately will make more difference in your images, than the camera you choose)....

- I already mentioned the great value of the EF-S 10-18mm ultrawide... there's also the better built Canon EF-S 10-22mm USM, which is excellent too, but costs about 2X as much.

- For a general purpose, walk-around lens, my first choice now would be the Canon EF-S 18-135mm IS USM. This is a relatively new lens and might not be offered at a discount "in kit" from retailers. Optically, the more widely available and less expensive EF-S 18-135mm IS STM is identical. They will give the same image quality. However, the USM lens will focus at least 2X faster, so would be better for sports/action shooting. If interested in video, the new USM lens also can optionally be fitted with a power zoom module (exclusive to that lens, as of now).

Now, normally STM lenses are a better choice than USM lenses for videography. STM are smoother and quieter than most USM. However, USM lenses are typically faster, which makes them better for action/sports still photography. The new 18-135 USM is an exception... it's the first USM lens Canon has optimized for video, so it does both very well. STM stands for "stepper motor" and USM means "ultrasonic motor" focus drive. Canon also uses a third, cheaper "micro motor" (no STM or USM markings on lens) that's slower, noisier and less smooth than either STM or USM. Most other manufacturers use either a micro motor or a copy of the Canon ultrasonic. I'm not aware of any others offering a stepper motor type focus drive.

A lower cost alternative I've used a lot is the older Canon EF 28-135mm IS USM. This lens dates back to the days of film, but is still quite good. Mainly, it's very common and can be bought used for relatively little money. It's performance is equal in most respects to that of the far more expensive EF 24-105L. The "problem" with either of these is that on an APS-C camera like the T6i/T6s is that they aren't particularly wide. But, if you are using a 10-18mm or 10-22mm ultrawide anyway, that might be fine.

Often you will find the Canon EF-S 18-55mm IS STM (or non-STM micro motor version) the cheapest in kit with Canon APS-C cameras. It's okay, too, although rather limited in zoom range.

- If interested in macro photography, the Canon EF-S 60/2.8 USM is one of the most affordable from anyone. Personally I use the Tamron SP 60/2.0 instead, for it's larger aperture (which makes it more "dual purpose" as a portrait lens). But it usually costs a little more. There are also Canon EF 100mm lenses: two versions, both excellent optically. The older one lacks image stabilization (IS), the newer one has it. I use one of these and they are the only 100mm lenses from any manufacturer that can optionally be fitted with a tripod mounting ring, a very helpful accessory.

- For telephoto work, the Canon EF-S 55-250mm IS STM is a very good choice. The EF 70-300mm IS USM is also excellent, though more expensive. There are more expensive ultra-compact 70-300mm DO and premium quality 70-300mm L-series too. And the Canon 70-200mm are some of the best from anyone... currently four models to choose among: f2.8 and smaller/lighter f4, both with and without IS. There are a number of other excellent Canon telephotos, depending upon your needs. One telephoto zoom you'll find bundled with Canon cameras that I'd recommend avoiding is the EF 75-300mm (non-IS, non-USM). This is one of Canon's cheapest lenses... and simply not a particularly good one.

I would note that Canon, unlike most other manufacturers, does not include a hood with a lot of their lenses. (Only the L-series include one, typically.) If not included, I would ALWAYS recommend buying the matching hood. It's an important accessory (and shame on Canon for not always including them!)

Beyond the lenses, the Canon flash system is also fairly extensive and relatively easy to use. There are now several "RT" models using radio communication for off-camera flash, which has greater range and better reliability than the optical communication that was widely used in the past. Many Canon cameras (T6i/T6s included) also have means of communicating and controlling off-camera flash utilizing their on-board flash... optical only, with quite limited range and off-camera flash location. There are also quite a few third party flashes available for Canon (and Nikon), from manufacturers such as Yongnuo. The build quality may not be as good, but they are pretty full-featured and affordably priced.

Note that there also is a Canon T6, which shouldn't be confused with the T6i and T6s models. The T6 is more of an entry-level model, using an older type of sensor and processor, as well as a simpler AF system (same with the T5i, T5, and SL1, that are also still widely available).

For a bit more money, you might also look at the 70D and 80D. The latter has an even more advanced AF system. These more semi-pro models are better built/sealed, with some more advanced features... yet still have a lot of support and automation for the beginning DSLR user.

The problem with asking a question like this here on a forum is that the Nikon fans will recommend Nikon, the Canon shooters will tell you to buy a Canon, Pentax users want you to buy their favorite brand, and the same with Oly, Sony, Leica or whatever! Actually, depending upon what you want to do with your photography, you can very likely put together an excellent kit of camera and lenses from ANY of the major manufacturers. While Canon work well for me, one of the other brands might do the same for you. While I use Canon examples above (because that's what I'm most familiar with), my main point here is to think beyond just the camera body alone. That might be the least important consideration, they're all so darned good these days.

And, whatever you buy, take a class, buy some books. In addition to Peterson's book I recommended above, when I buy a new camera I also always make a point to buy at least one of the guide books written for a specific model. Complementing the manual supplied with the camera, a guide book helps shorten the learning curve with a new camera a lot.

Have fun shopping!
Honestly, there are excellent cameras available fr... (show quote)


Your reply is long but is very detailed with excellent analysis.


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Aug 9, 2016 23:04:31   #
JR45 Loc: Montgomery County, TX
 
crappiefever wrote:
Dont really need any software . Just create folder , copy and paste or create folder , right click , send to .


Most of my photography consists of pics taken of a couple of MC groups I ride with and a military reunion group.
I find that the software allows me to name a folder (date), file and upload easily. It makes things easy to find
if anyone wants copies. It should be a consideration.

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