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Global warming - climate change
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Feb 4, 2024 01:53:42   #
Haenzel Loc: South Holland, The Netherlands
 
Sirsnapalot wrote:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/north-carolina-city-spent-millions-on-electric-buses-dont-run

This is a perfect example of an industry not ready for prime time. The government is dangling carrots by using tax payers money to entice sales of buses for mass transit that have not been perfected for such use.
Instead of rushing into an alternative energy, that is clearly not going to be sufficient, why not take time to prefect a sensible alternative to fossil fuel and not rape our citizens with outrageous fuel prices while doing so.


North Carolina city spent millions on electric buses that don't run
https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/north-carolin... (show quote)


North Carolina and other states will probably have wasted money before. What this story tells me is that company that made the busses is not very good at it (yet). The technology is there. An electric bus does work properly as proven in many other countries. Charging time is limited when using a pantograph at various bus stops for top-up (300kW) and do a full charge overnight (60kW).

"Why not take the time to prefect a sensible alternative to fossil fuel.." Ask the oil companies how they succeeded in slowing down developments in alternative energy....

Power, lobby, corruption, Fox News?

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Feb 4, 2024 02:17:10   #
btbg
 
Haenzel wrote:
North Carolina and other states will probably have wasted money before. What this story tells me is that company that made the busses is not very good at it (yet). The technology is there. An electric bus does work properly as proven in many other countries. Charging time is limited when using a pantograph at various bus stops for top-up (300kW) and do a full charge overnight (60kW).

"Why not take the time to prefect a sensible alternative to fossil fuel.." Ask the oil companies how they succeeded in slowing down developments in alternative energy....

Power, lobby, corruption, Fox News?
North Carolina and other states will probably have... (show quote)


Look at a map of the United States and one of the Neatherlands. Your country is flat and small. Just because something works in one part of the world does not mean it will work everywhere else.

For example cold kills lithium batteries. Mountains make lithium batteries less effective and running longer routes adds to the problems.

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Feb 4, 2024 03:13:50   #
Haenzel Loc: South Holland, The Netherlands
 
btbg wrote:
Look at a map of the United States and one of the Neatherlands. Your country is flat and small. Just because something works in one part of the world does not mean it will work everywhere else.

For example cold kills lithium batteries. Mountains make lithium batteries less effective and running longer routes adds to the problems.


Don't tell me you don't have cities where electric busses can be used in the same way over here.
Long range obviously is not ideal for EV busses. Inner city however is perfect.
You're just looking for excuses to prove your point. There are solutions for EV to deal with cold environments as well.
Think in solutions. It's the only way forward.

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Feb 4, 2024 07:32:48   #
jcboy3
 
btbg wrote:
Did you actually read the fact check. What it says is that the study misleads, regarding the data, but it is clear that many of the data stations are not located correctly. So, in case you don't understand the study that says 96 percent wrong and thus contaminate the data is not accurate, but neither are the weather stations that the study reviewed.

In case you don't get it, that means that the data is highly suspect, just not 96 percent off.


You clearly didn't read the full rebuttal. The data is not highly suspect (at least to those that are familiar with these data sets).

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Feb 4, 2024 09:39:01   #
btbg
 
jcboy3 wrote:
You clearly didn't read the full rebuttal. The data is not highly suspect (at least to those that are familiar with these data sets).


You clearly didnt read all of it either because NOAA admitted that some of their stations are not placed properly. They just claim that that does not hurt their total data collection process.

The thing is that it does. Several years ago Oregon replaced their state climatologist. The reason was he had spent 25 years placimg data collection sites on farmland and had gotten vastly different data than the powers that be so instead of looking at his data they removed both he and his data from his positiin.

Because, surprise cities are hotter than the surrounding countryside.

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Feb 4, 2024 09:46:01   #
btbg
 
Haenzel wrote:
Don't tell me you don't have cities where electric busses can be used in the same way over here.
Long range obviously is not ideal for EV busses. Inner city however is perfect.
You're just looking for excuses to prove your point. There are solutions for EV to deal with cold environments as well.
Think in solutions. It's the only way forward.


I'm sure we have some cities where electric busses could work. We also have cities where they don't work.

You just go ahead and try an electric vehicle of any kind in Bozeman Montana in the winter.

In case you didn't see the news from Chicago Illinois a couple of weeks ago dozens of drivers were stranded when both their electric vehicles and their charging stations failed in the cold.

Just because something works in a flat relatively temperate climatebdoes not mean it will work everywhere else. I have nothing against electric vehicles other than the cost, but they are not feasable in some locations yetbour politicians are trying to force all of us into them regardless of if they will work in the real world that we live in.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:17:36   #
jcboy3
 
btbg wrote:
You clearly didnt read all of it either because NOAA admitted that some of their stations are not placed properly. They just claim that that does not hurt their total data collection process.

The thing is that it does. Several years ago Oregon replaced their state climatologist. The reason was he had spent 25 years placimg data collection sites on farmland and had gotten vastly different data than the powers that be so instead of looking at his data they removed both he and his data from his positiin.

Because, surprise cities are hotter than the surrounding countryside.
You clearly didnt read all of it either because NO... (show quote)


And adjusted for the placement. As for Oregon, they haven't had a state climatologist since before 1990.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:36:51   #
Haenzel Loc: South Holland, The Netherlands
 
btbg wrote:
I'm sure we have some cities where electric busses could work. We also have cities where they don't work.

You just go ahead and try an electric vehicle of any kind in Bozeman Montana in the winter.

In case you didn't see the news from Chicago Illinois a couple of weeks ago dozens of drivers were stranded when both their electric vehicles and their charging stations failed in the cold.

Just because something works in a flat relatively temperate climatebdoes not mean it will work everywhere else. I have nothing against electric vehicles other than the cost, but they are not feasable in some locations yetbour politicians are trying to force all of us into them regardless of if they will work in the real world that we live in.
I'm sure we have some cities where electric busses... (show quote)


You should read another post on this site explaining why EV's got stranded in the cold. (driver not pre-conditioning the battery). Norway is a good example. Lot's of EV's, lots of really cold weather, mountainous country. No problems there...Also US is a big country that also has flat areas and higher temps. Think in possibilities..

Let's be honest you have something against EV's. That's ok but don't tell me the concept isn't working.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:48:00   #
btbg
 
Haenzel wrote:
You should read another post on this site explaining why EV's got stranded in the cold. (driver not pre-conditioning the battery). Norway is a good example. Lot's of EV's, lots of really cold weather, mountainous country. No problems there...Also US is a big country that also has flat areas and higher temps. Think in possibilities..

Let's be honest you have something against EV's. That's ok but don't tell me the concept isn't working.


II have something against evs because they are trying to force me into one and they are not oractical for where I live and work.

If you want to use an ev no problem, but when you try to force me into one when they wont work then thats a big problem.

Try driving an ev 300 miles one way when there is no chaeging station anywhere in between. You might make it there but you wont make it back.

I can carry a can of gas but I cant carry a charging station.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:54:38   #
btbg
 
jcboy3 wrote:
And adjusted for the placement. As for Oregon, they haven't had a state climatologist since before 1990.


Thats about when they removed him and eliminated his data. When they did it is not relevant to the statement I made.

The data does show warming but it also shows bias regarding where they collect data.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:55:53   #
Wyantry Loc: SW Colorado
 
btbg wrote:
No one is denying climate change. We are denying that it is a threat. The draconian steps that environmentalists want to take will be far more damaging to humanity than doing nothing would be.

You seem to want the U.S. to take immediate and drastic measures, but that will do nothing as China, India, Russia, Turkey and others are increasing their CO2 production much faster than we could possibly lower ours, meaning that no matter what the U.S. does unilaterally it won't make a difference.

But, that simple fact seems to escape those of you that want immediate action. You will destroy the economy and gain nothing from it. It isn't a matter of ignoring climate scientists. It is a matter of taking rational steps to improve life for all humanity. I've got news for you, people in much of the planet will be happy if the temperature does increase. Greenland is currently seeing tremendous development in their precious gem mining as vast areas of minerals that previously were inaccessible are now available. Farming in the far reaches of both the north and south is improving, and countries like the Netherlands have proven that it is possible to not lose land when sea levels rise.

The problems that you are concerned about can mostly be mitigated by using science, not to shut down development, but to preserve what we can while still improving the lives of millions of people that currently live in poverty. If you stop economic development you prevent them from ever bettering themselves, while at the same time actually causing more damage to the environment. For example, the reason the Amazon rainforest is being deforested is because of people attempting to eke out a living by farming land that is not really farmable. If we helped them have other job choices there would be no need for them to continue to damage the environment.

It isn't climate change that we deny, it is the solutions that has been proposed that we reject, such as forcing electric cars on us.
No one is denying climate change. We are denying t... (show quote)


To “correct” the present rapid global temperature rise, what we “need” would be a sudden temperature decrease.

The two most likely ways for this to occur would be: 1). A major (“Super-volcano”) eruption, or 2). A large asteroid strike.
Either one would eject enough particulates into the atmosphere to cause a cooling-event that would negate recent temperature increases.

These event(s) would also create major extinctions, including major (or complete) reductions of humans.

Then we would not have to WORRY about it.

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Feb 4, 2024 10:57:08   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Linda From Maine wrote:
"Being shoved down our throats" is one of the perceptions I alluded to. You're reading and watching the viewpoints that push only that narrative. Try a more balanced approach

I'm with Klickitatdave, specifically his comments: "On the other hand CEOs of corporations that contribute to the deterioration of the global environment are getting richer every year...Sad to say this does not bode well for the future of humankind."

With the pushback against science, the constant referencing of global weather history - which doesn't take into account that we are now more than eight billion humans - and the willingness of humans to soil our planet in pursuit of money and power, I've concluded that as a species, we are accelerating our own extinction.
"Being shoved down our throats" is one o... (show quote)


"The increase population of the world is accelerating our Extinction"? That's weird, you just claimed that we have population growth at the time the world is supposedly warming up due to human activity. So if the warming of the globe is causing the Extinction of humans, than why is the growth of the population accelerating as the world is warming up? You do realize that more people die from extreme cold weather than extreme hot weather right? Not only that, as the world is supposedly warming up the Earth is getting greener. There's also no real pushback on science when it comes to this issue, it's a pushback on the global warming cultist religion being pushed down our throats.

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Feb 4, 2024 11:37:50   #
srt101fan
 
btbg wrote:
II have something against evs because they are trying to force me into one and they are not oractical for where I live and work.

If you want to use an ev no problem, but when you try to force me into one when they wont work then thats a big problem.

Try driving an ev 300 miles one way when there is no chaeging station anywhere in between. You might make it there but you wont make it back.

I can carry a can of gas but I cant carry a charging station.


Who is trying to force you into an EV?

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Feb 4, 2024 14:24:55   #
btbg
 
srt101fan wrote:
Who is trying to force you into an EV?


Have you not been paying attention. The Biden administration wants to stop the production of gasoline powered vehicles within the next six years. California is trying to get rid of internal combustion engines even sooner.

What do you think the consequences of that are going to be. Forcing you into an ev. On top of that, they want to raise the cost of gasoline, remember Obama saying that it would need to necessarily go to $8 per gallon.

And, then, they are using tax dollars to defray the cost of evs for people who already have enough money to buy them. What do you think all of that means? It means they are trying to force you out of your internal combustion engine automobile. Maybe not today, but much sooner than you seem to be recognizing.

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Feb 4, 2024 15:49:13   #
chrissybabe Loc: New Zealand
 
Racmanaz wrote:
"The increase population of the world is accelerating our Extinction"? That's weird, you just claimed that we have population growth at the time the world is supposedly warming up due to human activity. So if the warming of the globe is causing the Extinction of humans, than why is the growth of the population accelerating as the world is warming up?...........

This is a typical argument where everybody is only looking at part of the issue. In any discussion or argument there is always a main point. But if you are thinking about it at all you have to look at, at the least, the main point AND probably the next 9 points (which will obviously be lesser but still very relevant). And just below the main point that the worlds population is still increasing is the other point that all these 8 billion also want to raise their standard of living. And it is this bit of the equation that is causing the problems just as much as there are more of us. And what does this entail - mostly more energy and physical resources like copper for example, and lithium at the moment, plus of course more and better food.
EVs are fine but if all the ICEs disappeared there is no way we can produce enough power without doing things like opening up coal fired power stations. Which is one of things we are trying to get rid of.
We all know that trying to get a government to change its mind is like trying to move a pyramid by three people pushing it. I have no idea what the solution is but to work on something that will help you first have to recognize that there is a problem AND what that problem is. Most people on here haven't done that yet - they can't get past that first initial main point !
And I apologise again to those who are unable to read past the first 2 sentences because of their inability to comprehend.

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