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Jan 21, 2021 15:34:38   #
Triple G
 
JohnFrim wrote:
A slight aside comment here...

So many things are being pushed to SCOTUS to resolve. Why is that? Are lower courts incompetent? What makes SCOTUS the be-all and end-all? Maybe soon you can do away with the lower courts and have an Ultra Supreme Court that can hear appeals of a SCOTUS decision.

Put that on the back burner to resolve after the US fixes the outdated EC system (it’s “rigged!”).


Of course, the challenges have to go through the lower courts first, but with almost 100% laser focus on getting conservative judges in all courts but especially SCOTUS, it begs the question of why not make use of all that effort.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/01/13/how-trump-compares-with-other-recent-presidents-in-appointing-federal-judges/

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Jan 22, 2021 00:59:15   #
Tex-s
 
thom w wrote:
Maybe you can explain why "right to life" booths almost always have anti birth control literature. I would think more birth control would cut down on abortions more than any other single thing. I think most "right to lifers" are mostly about controlling others lives.



You speak truly in this case. I live every day with the fear that my saying exactly what you just said, that contraception is a key, even THE key, will set me at odds with my employer. I just happen to believe the religious have it right in one way, though not for the reasons they think. After 30 years of working with young ladies (teens) I can promise you that a great number of them end up with lifelong emotional issues after deciding to engage in sex too early in their lives. And when I say 'too early' I simply mean that these girls typically are choosing sex to avoid losing a boyfriend, not actually choosing sex because it's what they desire. That dynamic is very similar to domestic violence in its after-shocks to a girl of say 16. Most if not all of these girls end up with negative images of themselves when they split with a guy with whom they have had sex. Sex ed and contraception are surely important, but there have to be more of us willing to train boys to stop pressuring the girls, and need to train girls to protect their youth from adult problems.

A girl of any age ending in 'teen' SHOULD be making every choice (just like the boys, mind you) to put themselves on a path to a successful future. Education, work experience and financial literacy top the list, but emotional, bacterial, viral, or pregnancy (completed OR terminated) baggage can bring the future plans to a screeching halt. I'll repeat. The religious are promoting a good plan when they promote abstinence. It is the best idea, as temporary frustrations are preferable to life-long ones. Not having sex has a 100% success rate of avoiding pregnancy too. Their problem is they cloak the idea in 2000+ year old texts, which, even if true, were written for women with a life span of 42 years, who had no ability to survive a breech birth, no antibiotics, and an utterly subservient roll in society. No one, even Conservatives or Libertarians (which is what I label myself) would advocate for such a roll for women in today's world.

My views are two-fold. 1) Abortion is exponentially the worst (pronounced 'evil') way to avoid having a child, and 2) that leftists don't actually believe the unborn are not living humans. I'm sure it's suppressed, but a few years ago, Bill and Hillary Clinton announced on Facebook or some such that they were anxiously awaiting their next grandBABY, a BABY that was not due for 7 months. It actually seems that it's a BABY if you want it and a cluster of cells, zygote, blastula, or fetus if you don't. To me, that's the hypocrisy of the left on full display, denying reality by butchering language.

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Jan 22, 2021 09:22:02   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
Tex-s wrote:
You speak truly in this case. I live every day with the fear that my saying exactly what you just said, that contraception is a key, even THE key, will set me at odds with my employer. I just happen to believe the religious have it right in one way, though not for the reasons they think. After 30 years of working with young ladies (teens) I can promise you that a great number of them end up with lifelong emotional issues after deciding to engage in sex too early in their lives. And when I say 'too early' I simply mean that these girls typically are choosing sex to avoid losing a boyfriend, not actually choosing sex because it's what they desire. That dynamic is very similar to domestic violence in its after-shocks to a girl of say 16. Most if not all of these girls end up with negative images of themselves when they split with a guy with whom they have had sex. Sex ed and contraception are surely important, but there have to be more of us willing to train boys to stop pressuring the girls, and need to train girls to protect their youth from adult problems.

A girl of any age ending in 'teen' SHOULD be making every choice (just like the boys, mind you) to put themselves on a path to a successful future. Education, work experience and financial literacy top the list, but emotional, bacterial, viral, or pregnancy (completed OR terminated) baggage can bring the future plans to a screeching halt. I'll repeat. The religious are promoting a good plan when they promote abstinence. It is the best idea, as temporary frustrations are preferable to life-long ones. Not having sex has a 100% success rate of avoiding pregnancy too. Their problem is they cloak the idea in 2000+ year old texts, which, even if true, were written for women with a life span of 42 years, who had no ability to survive a breech birth, no antibiotics, and an utterly subservient roll in society. No one, even Conservatives or Libertarians (which is what I label myself) would advocate for such a roll for women in today's world.

My views are two-fold. 1) Abortion is exponentially the worst (pronounced 'evil') way to avoid having a child, and 2) that leftists don't actually believe the unborn are not living humans. I'm sure it's suppressed, but a few years ago, Bill and Hillary Clinton announced on Facebook or some such that they were anxiously awaiting their next grandBABY, a BABY that was not due for 7 months. It actually seems that it's a BABY if you want it and a cluster of cells, zygote, blastula, or fetus if you don't. To me, that's the hypocrisy of the left on full display, denying reality by butchering language.
You speak truly in this case. I live every day wi... (show quote)


In the case of the Clintons, you are confusing emotions with science. Regardless of ones views on young people having sex, by the time abortion is up for consideration, that ship has sailed. I've known a few girls who have had abortions. For some there was a lot of guilt involved. Guilt that I believe came from societal pressure, not from the actual procedure. Others have given it as much thought as you might give having polyps removed. I challenge you to prove that having an abortion is more damaging to the girl/woman than having a child at 14, or 15, or at a time and under circumstances where one is not prepared to deal with it. A great many abortions are preformed on women who are old enough to know what they want. Holding a dime between one's knees is not an effective form of birth control. In the heat of passion, the dime almost always gets dropped. One loudly self proclaimed Christion on this sight has promoted anal sex as contraception. While I see anal sex as a personal choice and am neither for or against it, I doubt that that is where you are coming from. There might be circumstances under which I would work for a company that employed "thought police", but it would only be for as long as it took me to find a decent employer. Are your skills not on a level that gives you a choice in employment? I thought you were all in for free speech and such. If you really have no other choices, my condolences, and I hope you survive, but maybe you haven't really tried. I don't know your position on drugs and the law, but if you believe recreational use of drugs should be illegal, and abortion should be illegal, just what is it that makes you believe you are a libertarian?

Reply
 
 
Jan 22, 2021 11:20:47   #
Fotoartist Loc: Detroit, Michigan
 
Tex-s wrote:
....of media bias and leftism at work in media.

Here we have a 'lovely' article looking, longingly, forward to the day when Harris can (finally) gut the 2nd Amendment, an amendment penned in black ink within the text of the Constitution,

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/kamala-harris-chance-enact-major-142600528.html

Funny, but I just can't seem to find the articles praising the Trump administration and looking longingly forward to the day Mike Pence might push through legislation restricting abortion, a 'right' , of course, not written anywhere AT ALL in the Constitution, but invented by the SCOTUS, first in Griswold and then in Roe.

I'm not sure how a nation devoted to the individual's right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness has ended up with an entire political platform devoted to ending life (abortion), restricting liberty (forced financial and social relations, lock down policy, gun restriction, restricting the free practice of religion, banning free speech, and a 1000 others), and defining happiness as 'what we tell you' (24/7 narratives about male, white, police, or other fabricated evils and the supposed solution to such.) What's making sane folks insane, though, is that we have 50+ percent of what should be a well-educated populace voting to be oppressed and controlled.

We won't need to wonder, I fear, what it was like to live in Soviet Russia or NAZI Germany when our guns are gone, when certain ethnicities or religions (not just political thoughts) end up restricted by law to subservient status, and when government controls all means of production. Hope I'm wrong, but articles like the above, praising the removal of rights, make me sure I'm right.
....of media bias and leftism at work in media. br... (show quote)


Impeachment articles have already been brought forth in the House against Bite-me.

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 11:42:40   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Just a minor correction. There are no AR-15 assault weapons.
--Bob
Triple G wrote:
Many believe that gun ownership rights under the constitution are not “unfettered”. There are restrictions put in place, so that precedent has been met. Now it’s a matter of what restrictions go toward public safety that don’t conflict with the constitution. Stay tuned as these issues have been brewing for a long time and need to be settled all the way to SCOTUS. Now should be the time for the GOP to force these to SCOTUS with their conservative judges in place. Or, don’t you trust The Federalist and Heritage assessment of where Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Coney-Barrett will rule? Those restrictions under consideration shouldn’t affect upright citizens’ rights.

https://www.dw.com/en/8-facts-about-gun-control-in-the-us/a-40816418

→Revoke the licenses of gun manufacturers & dealers that break the law

→Require anyone who sells more than 5 guns/yr to run a background check on all gun sales

→Ban the importation of AR-15-style assault weapons"
Many believe that gun ownership rights under the c... (show quote)

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 13:32:30   #
letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.
 
thom w wrote:
In the case of the Clintons, you are confusing emotions with science. Regardless of ones views on young people having sex, by the time abortion is up for consideration, that ship has sailed. I've known a few girls who have had abortions. For some there was a lot of guilt involved. Guilt that I believe came from societal pressure, not from the actual procedure. Others have given it as much thought as you might give having polyps removed. I challenge you to prove that having an abortion is more damaging to the girl/woman than having a child at 14, or 15, or at a time and under circumstances where one is not prepared to deal with it. A great many abortions are preformed on women who are old enough to know what they want. Holding a dime between one's knees is not an effective form of birth control. In the heat of passion, the dime almost always gets dropped. One loudly self proclaimed Christion on this sight has promoted anal sex as contraception. While I see anal sex as a personal choice and am neither for or against it, I doubt that that is where you are coming from. There might be circumstances under which I would work for a company that employed "thought police", but it would only be for as long as it took me to find a decent employer. Are your skills not on a level that gives you a choice in employment? I thought you were all in for free speech and such. If you really have no other choices, my condolences, and I hope you survive, but maybe you haven't really tried. I don't know your position on drugs and the law, but if you believe recreational use of drugs should be illegal, and abortion should be illegal, just what is it that makes you believe you are a libertarian?
In the case of the Clintons, you are confusing emo... (show quote)


Doesn't your spell check work, actually it does, maybe it was auto corrected wrongly. CHRISTION

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 14:18:39   #
redlegfrog
 
anotherview wrote:
Good morning. Like it or not, the legal right to abortion on demand has become the law of the land.

Which or whatever legal reasoning underlies this outcome, it goes to the the private decision of a woman to opt for an abortion or to give birth. This decision excludes the state.

It also by its operation excludes the irrational intrusions of religion and like emotional positions that purport to know better than the individual woman when she makes this decision.

Other rights have come under fire by irrational forces; for example, the anti-gun fanatics seek every avenue to suppress or to hinder if not to deny the constitutional right to own and use guns. The SCOTUS has settled this matter by its recent ruling that the Second Amendment means what it says, that citizens may own and use guns.

Consider that the Founding Fathers could have outlawed private gunownership. Instead, they they gave us the Second Amendment.

We also live in a time when the news media workers riddle their reportage with lies, bias, and propaganda, instead of doing straight reporting. This misconduct fails to serve the interests of the citizenry in a democracy.
Good morning. Like it or not, the legal right to ... (show quote)


So are we happy that we can get back to killing babies? What ever makes the lefties smile! Just don't use a gun in the process, it makes the lefties frown!

Reply
 
 
Jan 22, 2021 14:26:22   #
Frank T Loc: New York, NY
 
redlegfrog wrote:
So are we happy that we can get back to killing babies? What ever makes the lefties smile! Just don't use a gun in the process, it makes the lefties frown!


A fetus is not a baby any more than an egg is a chicken.

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 14:29:14   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
letmedance wrote:
Doesn't your spell check work, actually it does, maybe it was auto corrected wrongly. CHRISTION


OK, I trusted the cheap useless spell check program someone probably paid admin to use. I shouldn't have, but copying every post into word and then copying it back is quite tedious. You are right, but I generally only say something about someone's spelling if the UHH spellchecker points it out. Still, an error on my part, but no disrespect intended towards my audience.

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 14:34:26   #
redlegfrog
 
Frank T wrote:
A fetus is not a baby any more than an egg is a chicken.


You like scrambled or fried?

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 14:45:29   #
DennyT Loc: Central Missouri woods
 
I always stay out of right to discussion but have always wanted one question answered by the right to life side.

If life begins at conception and new life is totally innocent why is there always an exception carved out for rape or incest?

That always seemed rather hypocritical.

Reply
 
 
Jan 22, 2021 14:48:52   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Triple G wrote:
Many believe that gun ownership rights under the constitution are not “unfettered”. There are restrictions put in place, so that precedent has been met. Now it’s a matter of what restrictions go toward public safety that don’t conflict with the constitution. Stay tuned as these issues have been brewing for a long time and need to be settled all the way to SCOTUS. Now should be the time for the GOP to force these to SCOTUS with their conservative judges in place. Or, don’t you trust The Federalist and Heritage assessment of where Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Coney-Barrett will rule? Those restrictions under consideration shouldn’t affect upright citizens’ rights.

https://www.dw.com/en/8-facts-about-gun-control-in-the-us/a-40816418

→Revoke the licenses of gun manufacturers & dealers that break the law

→Require anyone who sells more than 5 guns/yr to run a background check on all gun sales

→Ban the importation of AR-15-style assault weapons"
Many believe that gun ownership rights under the c... (show quote)


Yes, there is precedent, of course not in the constitution but rather by the courts. Reading the contemporary writings at or near the writing of the constitution one could make a clear argument that there should be no restrictions. Why is it that liberals refuse the amendment process?

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 14:59:23   #
joecichjr Loc: Chicago S. Suburbs, Illinois, USA
 
You are right⭐

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 15:02:44   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
redlegfrog wrote:
So are we happy that we can get back to killing babies? What ever makes the lefties smile! Just don't use a gun in the process, it makes the lefties frown!


Doesn't a woman faced with the choice of having an abortion, or giving birth to a child she isn't prepared to care for, have enough problems without you piling on? Maybe you could use a hobby. Traumatizing young women doesn't really count.

Reply
Jan 22, 2021 15:16:20   #
mikee
 
"invented by the SCOTUS, first in Griswold and then in Roe."

The supreme court interprets, it does not invent.

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