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Nikon in serious financial trouble
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Jan 21, 2021 07:58:17   #
chrisg-optical Loc: New York, NY
 
LEWHITE7747 wrote:
Going to lose $720 million dollars this year---Canon to make '$616 million dollars.


Well Nikon had a triple whammy 2020 - (1) the pandemic which affected all camera makers, (2) sluggish camera sales due to smartphone photography for the masses (volume sales) carried over from previous years and (3) R&D expenses related to new product releases (not as much as in prior years but a minor factor)

Also Nikon has not made the best decisions in product design - they really needed a killer Z line product on par with the D500 and D850 releases. They are also not as diverse as the other camera makers so they can ill afford bad decision making in their camera department.

I'm with the Angry Photographer in that they should have released a hybrid DSLR/mirrorless F-mount model - they have the patent for it!

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Jan 21, 2021 08:13:55   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
Sony makes Nikon's high-end sensors. They've embedded a clever bug into all Nikon cameras with these Sony sensors: the Nikon suddenly dies for every new Sony mirrorless sold. Just look online for 'Nikon Sudden Death Syndrome'. I've seen a thread where they think from your Nikon serial number you can identify the week number in the calendar year (01 -> 53) your camera is most likely to die.

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Jan 21, 2021 09:09:10   #
hookedupin2005 Loc: Northwestern New Mexico
 
LEWHITE7747 wrote:
Camera's have been usurped by cell phones 87% of the market is gone.


So, if 87% of the market is gone, why is ONLY Nikon in serious financial trouble? Your logic make no sense whatsoever.

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Jan 21, 2021 12:05:55   #
gwilliams6
 
wdross wrote:
Most people are not even aware that Sony has moved the camera section as to make the cameras more responsive to their own profit/loss. I have no doubts that Sony would sell it if the right business scenario came up but I would have a very hard time even trying to imagine such a scenario right now for this market. Even though they are affect by this down turned market, their size and backing are significantly better than all the others at this time. Most people are not even aware that Olympus is still a competitor (3rd in sales, over 20% of the mirrorless sales) in the mirrorless market - for now. And even with the losses, Nikon still can reasonably come back with peculiar emphasis on mirrorless APS-C along with full frame. Will they survive? Jury is out for at least another year at the shortest.
Most people are not even aware that Sony has moved... (show quote)


You know American investors were screaming for Sony to sell off their imaging division and Sony resisted that investor pressure . Japanese corporations operate with traditional philosophies quite different from the scorched-earth buy and sell of American corporations and aggressive wall street traders and acquisition folks. Sony said as much when they wouldn't yield to this mainly American sell pressure and just did a restructuring.

Sony Execs have said they will never get rid of one of their major and continually growing profit producers, their imaging division. That would be a foolish move that Sony will never make. If you think that will ever happen, I have some swampland in Florida to sell you, lol.

Olympus camera division, now sold and wholly owned by JIP does very well in the Japan market and wont go away anytime soon. Nikon is restructuring, ending their compact point and shoot cameras which Nikon says was decimated by smartphones. They will concentrate on DSLR models (that still sell well in Japan), and improving their mirrorless offerings, as the mirrorless market is their best hope of reaching profitability in a global camera market that has declining overall numbers in all segments. Cheers

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Jan 21, 2021 12:31:53   #
wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado
 
CHG_CANON wrote:
Sony makes Nikon's high-end sensors. They've embedded a clever bug into all Nikon cameras with these Sony sensors: the Nikon suddenly dies for every new Sony mirrorless sold. Just look online for 'Nikon Sudden Death Syndrome'. I've seen a thread where they think from your Nikon serial number you can identify the week number in the calendar year (01 -> 53) your camera is most likely to die.


"They've embedded a clever bug into all Nikon cameras with these Sony sensors"?

Sony doesn't want to stay in business? Sony wants law suits and all companies questioning Sony's ethics? All the many other companies that work with Sony in areas other than cameras wondering if their products are be "sabotaged"? Do you really think Sony would be willing to go down that rabbit hole?

Do you think it is possible that Nikon has an internal design problem that either doesn't work well with the sensor, requires the sensor to do things beyond the sensor's intended specifications, or even ordered the sensors from Sony with less than what was really needed?

Good businesses have made mistakes in design and specifications that have cost those companies in sales and reputation. Is it possible Nikon did such and cannot sue anybody but themselves?

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Jan 21, 2021 16:37:26   #
greger Loc: benton harbor, mi
 
HRPufnstuf wrote:
My $400 cell phone has a camera. My $400 Canon T3i has a much more versatile camera, does all I need, including some wedding and portrait photography. But when the top of the line cameras are $6500+, and some lenses $2000 - $4000, I can see where camera companies are shooting themselves in the foot.

I think if the best cameras were under $1000, and the best lenses $500 - $1000, they would sell a heck of a lot more.


good point.

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Jan 21, 2021 22:47:12   #
Retina Loc: Near Charleston,SC
 
RWebb76 wrote:
Well, Mac, I am kinda having a friendly conversation with the OP and other friendly UHH people.
When I take a break from my real work I jump to UHH for a few minutes to talk to folks who have the same hobby interests as me. I did not do a deep dive into Nikon finances. Nor do I want to. I went to one source. And I wanted to make sure that folks knew that the data source was a quick look, not me spending a lot of time on it. I think some folks quote one source and take it as fact. The Canon data is good...Nikon is a bit fuzzy because they are not as big, and not as referenced.

So, there you have it.
Well, Mac, I am kinda having a friendly conversati... (show quote)

Nikon publishes their financials about all their major divisions, personal cameras being just one of several.

https://www.nikon.com/about/corporate/businesses/

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Jan 22, 2021 10:35:23   #
Jfendley
 
I have a a6000 Sony and a HX400 50 x zoom Sony camera. I take a lot of Wildlife and Landscape pictures. I just bought a new Samsung s20 phone and it's camera is unbelievable. However, it will not replace my cameras because of the limited Zoom.

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Jan 22, 2021 11:08:43   #
kkayser
 
Reference please

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Jan 22, 2021 18:07:28   #
DanielB Loc: San Diego, Ca
 
LEWHITE7747 wrote:
Camera's have been usurped by cell phones 87% of the market is gone.


Myth - Millions of cell phone are sold every year. People are not buying them strictly for the camera features and those that do are not serious about photography, just social media. The sheer volume of sales skews the percentages of camera sales.

I think photographers are holding on to their equipment for longer periods of time before upgrading. Also so called photographers are becoming a dime a dozen now - just look at Craigslist listings. Only 1 in 15 are worth anything but they all have camera equipment of some kind.

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Jan 22, 2021 19:15:12   #
Frida Loc: Atlanta
 
Everybody with a phone & a finger considers themselves a photographer-minus 30+ yrs experience

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Jan 22, 2021 19:20:06   #
Frida Loc: Atlanta
 
Thanks for this comment. Doubt I'll ever travel in the mtns of Haiti w/only my iPhone as "equipment".

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Jan 22, 2021 23:41:47   #
howIseeit Loc: Kootenays, BC Canada
 

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Jan 23, 2021 02:03:08   #
dick ranez
 
I was predicting several years ago that by 2025 there would only be three players in the camera market, Canon, Fuji and Sony, with Panasonic being a long shot. My reasoning was that Olympus would be sold to Panasonic as the only other player with m4/3, Pentax was, if not dying, at least on life support and Nikon would be adsorbed into Sony as a lens supplier since Sony lenses were less than stellar. The surviving companies were ones that made their own sensors and were not at the mercy of the market. Phone cameras were not quite as good then as they are now, but the camera industry shrinkage was plain to see. I also predicted that Apple would come out with an enthusiasts camera but with more phone like controls and better computer integration. That prediction was before Apple dropped their interest in photography applications like Aperture.

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Jan 23, 2021 03:41:17   #
User ID
 
kkayser wrote:
Reference please

Anytime. All you need. Go for it.

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